expatriot98

There was some discussion about this bike a few days ago when it was listed for $1695. Just checked this aft and it had been lowered to $1495. Mine should arrive around the middle of February - just a couple weeks before my Pedal Force RS arrives .


https://www.bikesdirect.com/products/...bzeuro_pre.htm

blandin

Crazy pricing. Are you going to ride it or part it out for use on your PF RS? Do you know anything about the wheelset that comes with it, meaning good, bad or indifferent?

EDIT: The reason I asked about the wheels, is because the Vuelta website does not list this model. I was able to find a listing on ebay from bikeisland, which is another BD entity, and they are not lightweights. Weight Front: 826 g Weight Rear: 1120 g Both weigh 1946 g without skewers

Not that this makes the deal much less appealing, just a point of reference.

89quattro

Did you catch the fine print?

....."GET $200 BACK ON THIS PURCHASE*
*Here is how it works: After you buy this bicycle, send us back in as-new condition the Bottecchia bare frame, fork, headset and wheelset and we'll issue you a credit back of $200.00 (Please include tires/tubes/stem to make packing safe for return)"...

expatriot98

I don't have any personal experience with the Vuelta parts so can't comment. Planning to keep the Campy and part out the rest. I should be able to net back $400 from ebay - figuring $150 for frame/fork, $150 wheels/tires, and another $100 for seat, bars and stem. I've got a set of Easton Circiuts on the way and will likely order the rest of the parts from Ming. I should have the RS built out nicely for around $2200 - pretty choice for a Record equiped composite bike. Makes Mark very happy......

blandin

expatriot,

That's a great plan and you're going to come in at a great price for an amazing bike. The fine print that quattro89 noticed is interesting, given that it would cost you about $50 to send the frame, etc. back, that nets you only $150 minus your time to pack and send. It seems that ebay is a better choice, and that BD realizes that some people will be buying this bike for the parts alone.

expatriot98

Yup, I'm pretty exited. The RS should be an interesting contrast to my Tuscony. BD's buyback is a pretty good deal for most. Easy way to get a cheap Record group. I'm just a cheap azz and want to maximize the bux.

Mark

DrPete 

Nothing like admitting that the frame, fork, and wheels are worth 200 bucks and putting your customers through the headache of stripping a frame and shipping it back just to get a decent price on a Record group. I'm guessing that return shipping won't be paid either. I guess my joke about the frame/fork/wheels just being packing material for the Record group wasn't that far off...

Typical BD shady dealings. No surprises here. Get it while they're still allowed to sell Campy components, I guess...

blandin

Seems to me that shady dealing would be something underhanded and out of sight designed to put the buyer at a disadvantage to the seller. Like it or not, they are doing everything aboveboard, even going so far as figuring that some want the parts only. Given that between their physical Cycle Spectrum stores and the volume they generate through the web, I would think that they will have access to Campy gear so long as they chose to do so. But I guess once you move from a pedestrian Flyte to a knock your socks off Pinny, your perspective changes.

cuda2k

Too. Many. Good. Deals. Lately.

Must. Not. Spend. Any. More. Money!

blandin

There are Some Things Money Can't Buy. For Everything Else, there's Mastercard!

expatriot98

Mine is smoking tonight.......

expatriot98

That's ridiculous. Campy is in business to sell parts the same as Shimano and Sram. They could give a rats ass who they sell to as long as invoices get paid.

BD has built a beautiful, simple business plan. They offer a decent bike for a really good price. Don't see any deception anywhere. The marketing hype is certainly overinflated, but welcome to 2007.

And no, I don't work for them or know anyone who does.
Mark

vendorz

Up to a point... many manufacturers/wholesalers have refrained from direct internet sales or sell direct at or close to suggested retail price to protect their retail infrastructure. I think this is particularly true with respect to products for which consumers tend to need intensive support after the sale. I anticipate that competitors of BD will continue to squawk loudly and -- up to a point and for awhile -- the manufacturers will listen and try to find compromises.

But of course, just as the retail competitors of BD are protecting their pocketbooks by squawking about BD's biz model, my own bottomline is my pocketbook. I have some residual feelings for brands that have been advertised into a special status in my brain... and my ego gets the munchies at the prospect of having a custom frameset or the most expensive parts... but I work hard for a living.

For someone who can and will do most of his own wrenching, in the world today, bicycle pieces and parts are commodities. Just like the retail competitors wanna protect their own bottomline, I gotta look for the value purchase to protect mine...

DrPete 

Blandin--if you look back, I was anti-BD from the get go, and I looked at BD before I bought my Flyte. They turned me off well before any upgrade happened to my bike. But I appreciate the implication that I'm somehow elitist or snobbish for buying a Pinarello frame on clearance and scouring ebay, PBK, and 11speed for parts to complete the build at a price I could afford.

I'm not saying that BD doesn't put out a decent product, and it's not like they're doing anything illegal, but there's stuff that just doesn't sit well from an ethical standpoint. I remember early on a BD ad that mentioned a quote from LA and a Mercier that he had owned in the past. Yes, LA used the word Mercier, but the good people at BD didn't exactly go to any great lengths to make it clear that they weren't selling the Merciers that Lance was talking about. Same deal with Motobecane and Bottecchia. I understand that BD owns the rights to the name in the US, etc., and can do whatever they want with it, but still they choose to stand on the shoulders of brands that had good reputations and sell their budget bikes under those brand names. Yes, it's legal. Yes, it's kinda scummy.

As far as the deal where they're buying back the frame/fork/wheels on this new bike... As I understand it (and correct me if I'm wrong) manufacturers pay a different (read: lower) price for OEM gruppos than they do aftermarket ones. So BD is basically offering an OEM take-off group for a discount, and there's nothing 100% wrong or illegal about that. But come on--they're offering to buy back a frame, fork, and wheels that they claim are worth $500 for the wheels alone for $200 so you can strip the bike and keep the gruppo? I'm no math wiz but that would lead me to believe that the frame, fork, and wheels on that bike cost BD less than 200 bucks, and they're even willing to advertise it. Why not save the consumer the trouble of stripping the frame that BD is oh-so-proud of and just sell the group if you're not circumventing something by selling the complete bike?

So no, there's no deception, but certainly things about BD and the way they do business that skirt the boundaries of what many consider good business ethics. And I get that not everyone has a huge amount of money to spend on a bike, but there are ways to get a good solid bike and still support a company that you can feel good about. And if you don't have a problem with the way BD does business, go ahead and buy from them. I won't, and as long as this is a free country I'll be happy to post my dissenting opinions.

indygreg

Mike (owner of BD.com) has been very open about pricing of frames, and as he has pointed out - OEM's mark up the frame more than anything. A high quality Alum frame like this cost about $30-$40 to make in tiawan. Mike is being more honest in essentially selling then at near nothing. I think that is more ethical then some of these OEMs selling frames made in the same factories for $500+

I am a happy bd.com customer. While I think this buyback plan is a bit odd, I do not think it is shady. It is very clear . . . you are going to have to disassemble everything, pack the frame and fork and ship it back on your dime. I think that is actually a response to what his customers are saying - every thread on this bike on this forum and over at roadrunnersports talk about selling everything not record and making out like a bandit. Well, he is sort of enabling that. Giving people what they want is not a bad thing.
Not sure you would get $200 for this on ebay (though I think it is worth that price) - so you would be out ahead. On ebay you will have to ship it just the same.

I wonder what they will do with the frames? Sell them via an outlet, ebay?

cydewaze

So, is the $1495 price before or after the $200 refund from the returned parts?

botto 

jesus. i thought that was a joke until i checked their site.

a big +1

DrPete 

That's a good point. He's still not getting my money, though.

WheresWaldo

You guys need to learn how to read ads better, the price was dropped to $1495 w/o sending anything back. At $1695 you could send back the frameset and wheels and get $300 returned, now you send back the frameset and wheels and get $200 returned.

This thread, like all others that mention BD will likely degrade into a quagmire of misinformation, half-truths and lies. There will always be people that are anti-BD, pro-BD and indifferent. Doc P, please don't turn into an ABH, indygreg don't become a zealot for BD. The company is what it is, and whatever it is won't be changed by the constant back and forth that goes on here when discussing them.

I do not need affirmation on any of the purchases I made, whether they be from a brick and mortar bike shop or the internet. I am sure most others feel the same way. I have tried to be honest and fair in sharing my opinions on the bikes I have.

As far as ethics are concerned. Companies buy and sell brands every day. The trade on the reputations brands had in the past. This is the way the world works, especially the US, get over it. If some sort of brand bigotry is what you want to espouse, then I would have to assume that you never buy anything new, unless it is from a startup or off brand, or your house is full of antiques. Come on people, it's just a bike, not a life!

I was going to say sorry for the rant, but I am not sorry. I just am one BF user very tired of the bickering that goes on from both sides of the BD equation.

DrPete 

And here I was thinking to myself that I hadn't come up with a resolution for 2007, and then I show up in a sentence with ABH. You've got a deal.

WheresWaldo

Your a good cookie, Doc!

botto 

so now you're going to start writing how it's safer to ride without a helmet instead?

El Diablo Rojo

I still say that I'd rather buy the complete Record gruppo from a place like Totalcycling.com for a few hundred more than spend the time and run the risk of not getting my refund. All it would take would be a scratch here and chip there and suddenly your refund is denied because the frame is not in 'resalable' condition. Further more you better make sure that your fd is compatible (braze on vs clamp on) and your BB cups are compatable and you will still have buy a headset. Really this deal on a Record gruppo isn't exactly smokin'.

Totalcycling.com complete Record gruppo = $1666.00
BD Record guppo after sending back unwanted parts and buying new Record headset $1495.00
+ $89.00 headset
+ $50.00 returnshipping
= $1634.00

DrPete 

Exactly.

indygreg

Advice taken. It is just hard - I just disagree when people call their sales tactics as unethical or shady. Bottom line is that they are over the top and they are different then LBS. I do not think anything is shady.

I wish Mike would post here more like he does at roadbikereview. Actually I think this site (outside of ABH) is much more fair on BD.com threads than they are over at RBR.