1984 Centurion Pro Tour 15. FMV?
#1
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 40
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 16 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 4 Times
in
2 Posts
1984 Centurion Pro Tour 15 with Mods and Non-original Parts
Pics are at the end of this post.
I have searched the forum for this info and looked to past sales on the auction site. I have an idea of value, but I'd like input of how the modifications impact value in the eyes of you forum friends.
What is the value as it sits? Also, I have replacement brake hoods and bar tape I could add.
The bike was serviced a little over a year ago and ridden little since. It is road ready.
I do not know much of the history of this bike, but evidence suggests it has been well used and well maintained.
Several components are not original. I suspect the result of replacement from use rather than harvesting.
What I have noticed:
- original Sugino AT triple crankset was replaced with Sugino VP triple
- the headset has been replaced (Deore)
- the original Le Tech (I think) rear derailleur was replaced
- the rear triangle has been cold set to 130 mm (from 126)
- rear cog is 7 speed
- top mount DT shifters were replaced with barcons (1 cover missing)
- the rear wheel was replaced (new Mavic rim laces to 36H Deore hub)
- tires are mismatched, but good to go
Sorry for any typos - written on smart phone.
Thanks in advance for any feedback.
I have searched the forum for this info and looked to past sales on the auction site. I have an idea of value, but I'd like input of how the modifications impact value in the eyes of you forum friends.
What is the value as it sits? Also, I have replacement brake hoods and bar tape I could add.
The bike was serviced a little over a year ago and ridden little since. It is road ready.
I do not know much of the history of this bike, but evidence suggests it has been well used and well maintained.
Several components are not original. I suspect the result of replacement from use rather than harvesting.
What I have noticed:
- original Sugino AT triple crankset was replaced with Sugino VP triple
- the headset has been replaced (Deore)
- the original Le Tech (I think) rear derailleur was replaced
- the rear triangle has been cold set to 130 mm (from 126)
- rear cog is 7 speed
- top mount DT shifters were replaced with barcons (1 cover missing)
- the rear wheel was replaced (new Mavic rim laces to 36H Deore hub)
- tires are mismatched, but good to go
Sorry for any typos - written on smart phone.
Thanks in advance for any feedback.
Last edited by AfterThunk; 11-25-17 at 10:28 AM. Reason: Add Pictures and correction
#2
Senior Member
Good quality frameset with a "fruit salad" parts mix. IMHO, the mismatched parts hurt the value. It's fine if you're going to keep it and ride it, but if I were shopping for a bike, I'd not spend more than $200 on it, and even then only because the frameset is good, and I could sell off the mismatched parts and replaced them with parts I have "in stock" here.
The single thing that hurts the value most in my eyes are the mismatched wheels. Are they both 27" rims?
The single thing that hurts the value most in my eyes are the mismatched wheels. Are they both 27" rims?
__________________
My bikes: '81 Trek 957, '83 Trek 720, '85 Trek 500, '85 Trek 770,'81 Merckx, '85 Centurion Cinelli, '85 Raleigh Portage, '92 RB-2, '09 Bianchi
My bikes: '81 Trek 957, '83 Trek 720, '85 Trek 500, '85 Trek 770,
#3
Senior Member
Good quality frameset with a "fruit salad" parts mix. IMHO, the mismatched parts hurt the value. It's fine if you're going to keep it and ride it, but if I were shopping for a bike, I'd not spend more than $200 on it, and even then only because the frameset is good, and I could sell off the mismatched parts and replaced them with parts I have "in stock" here.
The single thing that hurts the value most in my eyes are the mismatched wheels. Are they both 27" rims?
The single thing that hurts the value most in my eyes are the mismatched wheels. Are they both 27" rims?
To much bright light in those photos. Maybe it makes the fruit salad better?
#4
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Middle Earth (aka IA)
Posts: 20,435
Bikes: A bunch of old bikes and a few new ones
Mentioned: 178 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5888 Post(s)
Liked 3,471 Times
in
2,079 Posts
I don't think $200 is optimistic as it sits. Hard to find a bike this nice with decent running gear at that price even in my mid sized city in the midwest where vintage bikes don't command much of a following or a premium. The bike isn't fixed up right (tape, hoods, cables should go over the top, etc.) which makes me think that the bike might need other work. If the bike fits, that bike would be a very solid deal at $200 and it could easily go for a bit more as well. The mismatched wheels are a problem for most of us. The parts are pretty decent and the bike will make a fine all around rider, commuter, and tourer.
#6
Senior Member
I found this in less than 5 minutes. https://york.craigslist.org/bik/d/ce...337613100.html
Took me two months and only two inquiries to sell this for $180 on Baltimore, and DC CL. I was surprised......and the bike needed nothing!
Most people looking on CL don't know what the hell a Centurion is. And then these prices batted around. Maybe somebody in some remote area in the Midwest might pay that, but in large metros they won't. Not Centurion.
They usual suspects get the money.
Getting over $200 for a bike like that can be tough. $200+ bikes are tough flips unless it's some great bargain.
More power to the seller if he can get that price.
Took me two months and only two inquiries to sell this for $180 on Baltimore, and DC CL. I was surprised......and the bike needed nothing!
Most people looking on CL don't know what the hell a Centurion is. And then these prices batted around. Maybe somebody in some remote area in the Midwest might pay that, but in large metros they won't. Not Centurion.
They usual suspects get the money.
Getting over $200 for a bike like that can be tough. $200+ bikes are tough flips unless it's some great bargain.
More power to the seller if he can get that price.
#7
Still learning
Prices of a Centurion Ironman and Sport DLX have no real bearing on what a Pro Tour should garner. However, other touring bikes in similar or even better condition to the OP's trade for less, this includes the purchase by me of 2 Raleigh Alyeskas, several Trek 520s, 2 Cannondale STs, and a Miyata 610 (non canti brakes). I have paid more for super clean Miyata 610s with canti brakes and refused to add an unneeded but very clean Fuji Touring Series IV to my hoard.
As presented, IMHO, FMV is about $125-$140, as an unfinished fruit salad.
As presented, IMHO, FMV is about $125-$140, as an unfinished fruit salad.
#8
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Middle Earth (aka IA)
Posts: 20,435
Bikes: A bunch of old bikes and a few new ones
Mentioned: 178 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5888 Post(s)
Liked 3,471 Times
in
2,079 Posts
I found this in less than 5 minutes. https://york.craigslist.org/bik/d/ce...337613100.html
Took me two months and only two inquiries to sell this for $180 on Baltimore, and DC CL. I was surprised......and the bike needed nothing!
snip . . .
Most people looking on CL don't know what the hell a Centurion is. And then these prices batted around. Maybe somebody in some remote area in the Midwest might pay that, but in large metros they won't. Not Centurion.
They usual suspects get the money.
Getting over $200 for a bike like that can be tough. $200+ bikes are tough flips unless it's some great bargain.
More power to the seller if he can get that price.
Took me two months and only two inquiries to sell this for $180 on Baltimore, and DC CL. I was surprised......and the bike needed nothing!
snip . . .
Most people looking on CL don't know what the hell a Centurion is. And then these prices batted around. Maybe somebody in some remote area in the Midwest might pay that, but in large metros they won't. Not Centurion.
They usual suspects get the money.
Getting over $200 for a bike like that can be tough. $200+ bikes are tough flips unless it's some great bargain.
More power to the seller if he can get that price.
Feel free to offer other data points . . .
Last edited by bikemig; 11-25-17 at 07:01 PM.
#9
Senior Member
Prices of a Centurion Ironman and Sport DLX have no real bearing on what a Pro Tour should garner. However, other touring bikes in similar or even better condition to the OP's trade for less, this includes the purchase by me of 2 Raleigh Alyeskas, several Trek 520s, 2 Cannondale STs, and a Miyata 610 (non canti brakes). I have paid more for super clean Miyata 610s with canti brakes and refused to add an unneeded but very clean Fuji Touring Series IV to my hoard.
As presented, IMHO, FMV is about $125-$140, as an unfinished fruit salad.
As presented, IMHO, FMV is about $125-$140, as an unfinished fruit salad.
#10
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 40
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 16 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 4 Times
in
2 Posts
Thanks for the comments. I am a little surprised by the low appraisals. But value is definitely in the eye if the beholder. Maybe the pictures in harsh lighting didn't do her justice.
Anyway, I was fortunate with this one. I had somone already interested who first contacted me about another listing that was a few sizes too big. I mentioned this small Pro Tour 15 that I had. He was interested and wanted to see it this weekend.
Last night I gave the bike a little love - rerouted the brake cables, put on new brake hoods and new bar tape, added replacement crank dust covers, and polished the shinny bits.
The guy came over this morning. Turns out he worked in a shop years ago that sold Centurions. And he was looking for a good vintage touring rig. The perfect person for a bike like this, right?
We agreed on $300. I honestly think that was a very fair price for a road ready bike of this caliber. Before this post, I thought it was worth a bit more. Regardless, I'm happy to see it going to someone who appreciates the vintage and quality AND plans to actually tour on it.
Here is how she looked this morning before the sale.
And I've already got an appointment to "look at" another bike. So much for freeing up space.
Thanks again.
Anyway, I was fortunate with this one. I had somone already interested who first contacted me about another listing that was a few sizes too big. I mentioned this small Pro Tour 15 that I had. He was interested and wanted to see it this weekend.
Last night I gave the bike a little love - rerouted the brake cables, put on new brake hoods and new bar tape, added replacement crank dust covers, and polished the shinny bits.
The guy came over this morning. Turns out he worked in a shop years ago that sold Centurions. And he was looking for a good vintage touring rig. The perfect person for a bike like this, right?
We agreed on $300. I honestly think that was a very fair price for a road ready bike of this caliber. Before this post, I thought it was worth a bit more. Regardless, I'm happy to see it going to someone who appreciates the vintage and quality AND plans to actually tour on it.
Here is how she looked this morning before the sale.
And I've already got an appointment to "look at" another bike. So much for freeing up space.
Thanks again.
#11
Senior Member
Thanks for the comments. I am a little surprised by the low appraisals. But value is definitely in the eye if the beholder. Maybe the pictures in harsh lighting didn't do her justice.
Anyway, I was fortunate with this one. I had somone already interested who first contacted me about another listing that was a few sizes too big. I mentioned this small Pro Tour 15 that I had. He was interested and wanted to see it this weekend.
Last night I gave the bike a little love - rerouted the brake cables, put on new brake hoods and new bar tape, added replacement crank dust covers, and polished the shinny bits.
The guy came over this morning. Turns out he worked in a shop years ago that sold Centurions. And he was looking for a good vintage touring rig. The perfect person for a bike like this, right?
We agreed on $300. I honestly think that was a very fair price for a road ready bike of this caliber. Before this post, I thought it was worth a bit more. Regardless, I'm happy to see it going to someone who appreciates the vintage and quality AND plans to actually tour on it.
Here is how she looked this morning before the sale.
And I've already got an appointment to "look at" another bike. So much for freeing up space.
Thanks again.
Anyway, I was fortunate with this one. I had somone already interested who first contacted me about another listing that was a few sizes too big. I mentioned this small Pro Tour 15 that I had. He was interested and wanted to see it this weekend.
Last night I gave the bike a little love - rerouted the brake cables, put on new brake hoods and new bar tape, added replacement crank dust covers, and polished the shinny bits.
The guy came over this morning. Turns out he worked in a shop years ago that sold Centurions. And he was looking for a good vintage touring rig. The perfect person for a bike like this, right?
We agreed on $300. I honestly think that was a very fair price for a road ready bike of this caliber. Before this post, I thought it was worth a bit more. Regardless, I'm happy to see it going to someone who appreciates the vintage and quality AND plans to actually tour on it.
Here is how she looked this morning before the sale.
And I've already got an appointment to "look at" another bike. So much for freeing up space.
Thanks again.
One factor in larger metros is with the high cost of living people have the money to spend and want higher end bikes, build their own, or buy a frame and build a beater that won't get stolen. That's what I usually encounter. And brand recognition is big.
Ah, and I just noticed Monterrey California as a bike shop label. If you are located in CA I can easily see why you think the prices some of us were quoting were low. And you got that price.
Last edited by StarBiker; 11-26-17 at 12:57 PM.
#12
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Middle Earth (aka IA)
Posts: 20,435
Bikes: A bunch of old bikes and a few new ones
Mentioned: 178 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5888 Post(s)
Liked 3,471 Times
in
2,079 Posts
Thanks for the comments. I am a little surprised by the low appraisals. But value is definitely in the eye if the beholder. Maybe the pictures in harsh lighting didn't do her justice.
Anyway, I was fortunate with this one. I had somone already interested who first contacted me about another listing that was a few sizes too big. I mentioned this small Pro Tour 15 that I had. He was interested and wanted to see it this weekend.
Last night I gave the bike a little love - rerouted the brake cables, put on new brake hoods and new bar tape, added replacement crank dust covers, and polished the shinny bits.
The guy came over this morning. Turns out he worked in a shop years ago that sold Centurions. And he was looking for a good vintage touring rig. The perfect person for a bike like this, right?
We agreed on $300. I honestly think that was a very fair price for a road ready bike of this caliber. Before this post, I thought it was worth a bit more. Regardless, I'm happy to see it going to someone who appreciates the vintage and quality AND plans to actually tour on it.
Here is how she looked this morning before the sale.
And I've already got an appointment to "look at" another bike. So much for freeing up space.
Thanks again.
Anyway, I was fortunate with this one. I had somone already interested who first contacted me about another listing that was a few sizes too big. I mentioned this small Pro Tour 15 that I had. He was interested and wanted to see it this weekend.
Last night I gave the bike a little love - rerouted the brake cables, put on new brake hoods and new bar tape, added replacement crank dust covers, and polished the shinny bits.
The guy came over this morning. Turns out he worked in a shop years ago that sold Centurions. And he was looking for a good vintage touring rig. The perfect person for a bike like this, right?
We agreed on $300. I honestly think that was a very fair price for a road ready bike of this caliber. Before this post, I thought it was worth a bit more. Regardless, I'm happy to see it going to someone who appreciates the vintage and quality AND plans to actually tour on it.
Here is how she looked this morning before the sale.
And I've already got an appointment to "look at" another bike. So much for freeing up space.
Thanks again.
#13
Still learning
Crappy photos + crappy presentation = crappy valuations
#14
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Middle Earth (aka IA)
Posts: 20,435
Bikes: A bunch of old bikes and a few new ones
Mentioned: 178 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5888 Post(s)
Liked 3,471 Times
in
2,079 Posts
#15
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 94
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times
in
2 Posts
^ Yeah, my feeling after scanning these appraisal forums for a couple years is that the estimates typically are given by folks in smaller towns/rural areas, and/or the price is given based on what the valuer would pay.
In other words, if you are in a city (really any city over 300k) than take the avg estimates you get here and double it to get a more accurate number.
Even with blurry photos, where I sit a pro tour will always be 250+.
In other words, if you are in a city (really any city over 300k) than take the avg estimates you get here and double it to get a more accurate number.
Even with blurry photos, where I sit a pro tour will always be 250+.
#16
Still learning
^ Yeah, my feeling after scanning these appraisal forums for a couple years is that the estimates typically are given by folks in smaller towns/rural areas, and/or the price is given based on what the valuer would pay.
In other words, if you are in a city (really any city over 300k) than take the avg estimates you get here and double it to get a more accurate number.
Even with blurry photos, where I sit a pro tour will always be 250+.
In other words, if you are in a city (really any city over 300k) than take the avg estimates you get here and double it to get a more accurate number.
Even with blurry photos, where I sit a pro tour will always be 250+.
- Photo quality affects values, as much as 200% or more in my opinion.
- Unwrapped bars, dirty drivetrains, and other deficiencies the same.
- Finally, do you live in Beijing or Shanghai? NYC and its suburbs are about as big as it gets in the USA. And last time I checked, metro Detroit is a tad over 4 million.
Last edited by oddjob2; 12-04-17 at 12:02 PM.
#17
Thrifty Bill
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Mountains of Western NC
Posts: 23,524
Bikes: 86 Katakura Silk, 87 Prologue X2, 88 Cimarron LE, 1975 Sekai 4000 Professional, 73 Paramount, plus more
Mentioned: 96 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1236 Post(s)
Liked 964 Times
in
628 Posts
Just checking in, I live in Asheville area, with a metro population is 424,000. Bike initially presented had several faults/deficiencies. I'm with OJ2 on his appraisal. Later pictures were noticeably better. I could nit pick it a little but it really doesn't matter.
Now some parts of the US certainly have higher prices, San Fran for example. Its not so much population, plenty of people live in the Atlanta metro market (5.7 million), where prices are half or less of SF. The one town where I have bought more bikes this year than any other area, at much lower prices, is Denver. Denver metro area is 2.8 million. But its a mediocre bike market, last time I had to donate two bikes I bought to the Denver co-op just to make room for even better deals....
As far as values I see posted in the forums, many are FMV. In my experience, getting FMV is a lot of work, most bikes sell for less. Personally, I never post what I would pay as it would be much less, and well below FMV.
Now some parts of the US certainly have higher prices, San Fran for example. Its not so much population, plenty of people live in the Atlanta metro market (5.7 million), where prices are half or less of SF. The one town where I have bought more bikes this year than any other area, at much lower prices, is Denver. Denver metro area is 2.8 million. But its a mediocre bike market, last time I had to donate two bikes I bought to the Denver co-op just to make room for even better deals....
As far as values I see posted in the forums, many are FMV. In my experience, getting FMV is a lot of work, most bikes sell for less. Personally, I never post what I would pay as it would be much less, and well below FMV.
#18
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 94
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times
in
2 Posts
Oh my, Bikeforums has a new valuation expert!
- Photo quality affects values, as much as 200% or more in my opinion.
- Unwrapped bars, dirty drivetrains, and other deficiencies the same.
- Finally, do you live in Beijing or Shanghai? NYC and its suburbs are about as big as it gets in the USA. And last time I checked, metro Detroit is a tad over 4 million.
2. Why would I need to live in Beijing or Shanghai? I've lived in 8 different cities in the U.S., all of them mid-sized or large cities, and have sold bikes in all of them (through bike shops in two). In both Albuquerque and Omaha - two of the smaller cities I've lived, a decent condition pro-tour is $250. You may be right about the poor photo quality having a bigger impact than I suggested though.
#19
Senior Member
1. I've been around here a few years longer than you, so I wouldn't say I'm new
2. Why would I need to live in Beijing or Shanghai? I've lived in 8 different cities in the U.S., all of them mid-sized or large cities, and have sold bikes in all of them (through bike shops in two). In both Albuquerque and Omaha - two of the smaller cities I've lived, a decent condition pro-tour is $250. You may be right about the poor photo quality having a bigger impact than I suggested though.
2. Why would I need to live in Beijing or Shanghai? I've lived in 8 different cities in the U.S., all of them mid-sized or large cities, and have sold bikes in all of them (through bike shops in two). In both Albuquerque and Omaha - two of the smaller cities I've lived, a decent condition pro-tour is $250. You may be right about the poor photo quality having a bigger impact than I suggested though.
__________________
My bikes: '81 Trek 957, '83 Trek 720, '85 Trek 500, '85 Trek 770,'81 Merckx, '85 Centurion Cinelli, '85 Raleigh Portage, '92 RB-2, '09 Bianchi
My bikes: '81 Trek 957, '83 Trek 720, '85 Trek 500, '85 Trek 770,
#20
Senior Member
The guy that bought that 520 drove from Boston to Baltimore to buy it. I got nothing but BS offers for two months on that bike and let it go for $350 about 7 years ago.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
OutnBack
Classic and Vintage Bicycles: Whats it Worth? Appraisals.
8
03-25-18 02:58 PM
Gingerw3
Classic and Vintage Bicycles: Whats it Worth? Appraisals.
6
03-17-18 07:55 AM
willydstyle
Classic & Vintage
32
03-10-15 09:54 PM
Bossanova
Classic and Vintage Bicycles: Whats it Worth? Appraisals.
7
04-10-13 04:03 PM
thombombb
Classic and Vintage Bicycles: Whats it Worth? Appraisals.
6
07-13-10 02:24 PM