intransit1217

jon c. 

Putting a foot down slows down the entire process for everyone. Most drivers would be annoyed if I did that.

MoAlpha

atbman

Oh! Look! There's a cyclist balancing on his bike at the lights! And he's facing forward! How confusing. I wonder what he's going to do?

Oh Could it be that he's going to set off in the direction he's facing? When the lights change or the intersection clears?

I'm soooo confused.

caloso

Bandera

Being in full control of the machine and able to immediately apply power to clear the intersection quickly from a track stand is far safer for me than going through the slower although the well practiced start routine. The intersection is most the dangerous place for any vehicle to occupy, getting through it as quickly as practical/legal/safe has a high priority.

Oddly enough my operation of the bike isn't a circus side show but a deliberate operational decision, if that coaxes motor vehicle drivers away from their fixation on texting to stare in rapt attention so be it.

edit:
OP, out of curiosity can you perform a credible well controlled track stand for 40 seconds or so on your commuter bike at an intersection?

-Bandera

lostarchitect 

???

Not sure what this has to do with the OP, but "leverage" is a perfectly valid verb in other circumstances.

intransit1217

BobbyG

I am glad to see you post this. My mantra is: "It is not you VERSUS traffic...you ARE traffic!"

Perhaps because I've been commuting seriously, as an adult, for 26 years, I have come to the conclusion that more and better communication between traffic participants, leads to a better, safer traffic experience for all.

For decades, at many two- and four-way stops I have deliberately put my foot down to let other vehicles know I am stopped. It's like a 180-degree stop light that vehicles in front and to the sides of you can see.

But, I go even further...

There are some intersections on my route where I can roll to the front line in the bike lane and wait for the green. These intersections have protected left turns that go first when the left turn arrow lights up. Before the arrow comes on, not only do I have my foot down, I will cross my arms, or drink from my water bottle to let opposing traffic in the turn lane know I am not a cyclist who is going to jump the light as soon as cross traffic stops...I will wait my turn.

Hand gestures, which are more difficult to convey while driving in a car, are much easier to show while out in the open on a bicycle; hand gestures like waving some one through, warning them to wait, pointing out where you are turning or going, and saying "thank you!" (And of course "the bird" which I still let fly on occasion, against my better judgement.)

What's more, body language and hand signals when used in "tandem" with adequate mirrors can also convey messages to traffic behind you, like "Slow down", "Wait", "Come on and pass me now, it's okay."

As far as I'm concerned, in most multi-vehicle traffic situations, track-standing, or slow-rolls are equivalent to cars creeping forward towards crosswalks while pedestrians are crossing.

Better communication is also why for 20+ years I have been using an AirZound airhorn for cars, and a bell for pedestrians (and sometimes lightly tooting the horn at pedestrians when they don't hear the bell.)

When riding a bike in traffic, it is often helpful to ask "What Would Drivers Do?" and then do it.

Now I realize bicycles aren't cars, and there are many circumstances where I feel it's safe to bend a rule or two, but if you're gonna ride in traffic, you can't not communicate with other vehicles, or send ambiguous messages about your intentions.

So I agree with you and say "Put your foot down! Take a stand for traffic safety!"

(Crap, when did I start soudning like such an old fart?)

AlmostTrick

A track stand is 100% legal, but wandering around the intersection is not and I see that often. I agree that the latter is confusing and dangerous. Is the rider going or not? and which way?

Sometimes, putting a foot down (like at a four way stop) IS the fastest, because then a motorist who has the right of way will GO ASAP.

I've also noticed on group rides that many cyclists take forever to re-clip and get to speed. Not me.

AlmostTrick

Thanks Bobby, there are a lot of great thoughts and advice in your post here.

Even so, I think you and I would both agree that there are plenty of times/situations were a foot down is not needed.

BobbyG

Agreed.

intransit1217

Daniel4

I put my foot down all the time at stop signs and red lights. I have no problems with that.

Bandera

Having no clue about pretty much everything around them is SOP for motorists and other vehicle operators, if my track stand in an adjacent lane segment leads to further mystification about the ways the world actually operates I'm OK w/ that.

-Bandera

Jim from Boston

Quote:

Originally Posted by BobbyG

I am glad to see you post this. My mantra is: "It is not you VERSUS traffic...you ARE traffic!"…

Hand gestures, which are more difficult to convey while driving in a car, are much easier to show while out in the open on a bicycle; hand gestures like waving some one through, warning them to wait, pointing out where you are turning or going, and saying "thank you!" (And of course "the bird" which I still let fly on occasion, against my better judgement.)

What's more, body language and hand signals when used in "tandem" with adequate mirrors can also convey messages to traffic behind you, like "Slow down", "Wait", "Come on and pass me now, it's okay."…

Nicely said. I use hand signals a lot, even to bestow “bicylists blessings and curses” (not the middle finger). However I do not advise drivers when to pass so they can make their own estimation. And,

Quote:

Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike

Cyclists may "think" cryptic hand signals are "interpreted" correctly by approaching motorists but would be smart not to depend on it. My advice is to follow ItsJustMe's advice in Msg 10 and avoid the results from the likely possibility that approaching motorists won't have a clue to what you are waving your hand about.

gregf83 

GrainBrain

Good to know my track standing is not completely taboo, but I have a similar problem as the OP in regards to a few four way stops in my area. Motorists seem to fixate on the bike and I end up causing a traffic stall.

I often think they are waving me on, but they don't realize I can't see them do this from their low car with sun glinting off the windows. So it becomes a Mexican standoff. Infuriatingly putting a foot down often doesn't help either, and what really makes my eyes roll is having my foot down while taking a long drink from the bottle - and watching nobody move for a good half minute. There's nobody behind either, everytime.

Now I've gotten used to slowing 100ft before then track standing while waiting for an opening.

The funniest thing happened the other day, where as I approached I went very slowly, my head faced down, all the while dragging my foot. I came to a stop, had my foot down. About 50 foot prior to stopping I noticed traffic had already stalled a bit. Sitting at the intersection in a classic standoff (all three cars had arrived before me but were still sitting there) I heard some guy a few cars down just losing it His window was down and I was listening to his tirade against other drivers ... "Oh my God he was dragging his foot, go!" ... "Why haven't you gone he's still slowing down" ... "He's waiting for you, you were there first!" then just defeated laughter as I had to remount and get up to speed across while three drivers still sat and watched. Lesson learned!

Rje58

Actually, the YouTuber stated that he had no problem with cyclists, and was happy to share the road, except with cyclists like the one in his video that cause problems and create dangerous situations for themselves and others.

Agreed, however, that going by the title of the video alone, that is not the message he's sending.

BobbyG

Of course autonomous vehicles will fix all these problems...(EXTREEEEEME SARCASM!).

Jim from Boston

Quote:

Originally Posted by BobbyG

Of course autonomous vehicles will fix all these problems...(EXTREEEEEME SARCASM!).

I also posted to this thread on the Living Car Free Forum:

jefnvk

Eh, can't say I've seen a true non moving trackstand from a cyclist at a light pretty much ever. What I see are people wiggling around really slow trying to avoid putting a foot down, to me that is akin to a rolling stop.

If you don't feel the weight transfer in a stop, you didn't in a car. That's the equivalency to me, MOST cyclists haven't stopped if a foot hasn't gone down.

hotbike

Hear, hear !

I've had enough of this "the driver got confused" nonsense.
No, they are Not competent to drive.

tandempower

This post doesn't make any sense.

AlmostTrick

You may be correct when you say "most" riders haven't stopped if they didn't put a foot down. But coming to a full stop, (wheels no longer turning) momentarily, without putting a foot down is not difficult. One doesn't even need the ability to do a track stand to do this.