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Lack of 650b options

Old 08-24-18, 02:13 PM
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Lack of 650b options

This is the problem with 650b as a tire size: it's still such an orphan. I've been contemplating converting a bike to 650b specifically with winter in mind, to get just a little wider on the tire, plus have more clearance to fenders, which is really tight right now with 35mm studded tires on 700c rims.

However, there just aren't good options. Two that are really aggressive and knobby, and would likely eat up all my clearances, and the Nokian/Suomi A10, which has really lackluster reviews compared to the Marathon Winters that I currently run.

Oh well. Maybe someday Schwalbe will come out with a Marathon Winter 650b, and then I can look into it.
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Old 08-24-18, 09:00 PM
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I share the frustration. There is nothing studded in 650b for commuter bikes. I ended up converting mine back to 700c for last winter. I see no option but to do the same this coming winter.
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Old 08-25-18, 02:51 AM
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I've wondered if I could run 26" inch rims/tires on my 650b bike in the winter. Just bought my first set of studded tires and they will have to go on my old bike. Not sure what running smaller rims/tires on my good bike would do to the geometry. Brakes wouldn't be a problem, because it's disk. I've given in to the 26 inch because I liked the price.
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Old 08-25-18, 03:22 AM
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Originally Posted by baldilocks
I've wondered if I could run 26" inch rims/tires on my 650b bike in the winter.
My 650b bike is a 700c bike that I converted to road plus. Changing again to 26 was too much geometry change, and there were clearence issues sith the mountain style 26er tires that I ran to try and keep the tire diameter up. That's just my experience with the one bike .

Last edited by JonathanGennick; 09-02-18 at 08:58 PM. Reason: corrected a typo
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Old 09-02-18, 08:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Banzai
This is the problem with 650b as a tire size: it's still such an orphan. I've been contemplating converting a bike to 650b specifically with winter in mind, to get just a little wider on the tire, plus have more clearance to fenders, which is really tight right now with 35mm studded tires on 700c rims.

However, there just aren't good options. Two that are really aggressive and knobby, and would likely eat up all my clearances, and the Nokian/Suomi A10, which has really lackluster reviews compared to the Marathon Winters that I currently run.

Oh well. Maybe someday Schwalbe will come out with a Marathon Winter 650b, and then I can look into it.
I think most of the 650B action is in the "27.5" world where you're either talking mountain or "allroad" bikes that have room for 2" tires.

38-42mm tires, as used on 650B conversions of 700C/27" frames, will probably remain a niche, sadly. I'd love to be wrong, though.
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Old 09-12-18, 06:49 PM
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N+1

Park the 650B bike until spring thaw,,,, I have an old MTB ,
26" wheels , Studded tires from Finland.

It's parked until the road is icy.. then it gets used..
I've had it for over 20 years.
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Old 09-28-18, 04:26 PM
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I've got a set of 650B A10s on one of the bikes I ride in the winter. While they aren't as nice as other tires with more studs, I still feel confident enough to ride with them.
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Old 10-23-18, 12:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Arrowana
I've got a set of 650B A10s on one of the bikes I ride in the winter. While they aren't as nice as other tires with more studs, I still feel confident enough to ride with them.
I was hesitating on buying the Priority 600 Pinion with 650b wheelset until I found the compatible A10 x 40 at Peter White Cycles on-line. I ordered both today today and looking forward to trying them out together when things ice up around here..
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Old 10-23-18, 03:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Archwhorides
I was hesitating on buying the Priority 600 Pinion with 650b wheelset until I found the compatible A10 x 40 at Peter White Cycles on-line. I ordered both today today and looking forward to trying them out together when things ice up around here..
​​​​​​
Interesting! Does Peter still have stock? We'll have to compare notes. I have a set of Continental Top Contact II tires enroute. Those are not studded.

Petet lists some 294s too. If they run narrow, there might be a chance of them fitting the frame.
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Old 10-23-18, 03:36 PM
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Originally Posted by JonathanGennick
​​​​​​
Interesting! Does Peter still have stock? We'll have to compare notes. I have a set of Continental Top Contact II tires enroute. Those are not studded.

Petet lists some 294s too. If they run narrow, there might be a chance of them fitting the frame.
Penny at Peter White Cycles said they have over 20 A10s still left in stock. I bought three as a safeguard in case they sell out, as they restock only every couple years.
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Old 11-20-18, 10:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Archwhorides
Penny at Peter White Cycles said they have over 20 A10s still left in stock. I bought three as a safeguard in case they sell out, as they restock only every couple years.
Have you tried the A10s yet? I just found these, and have ordered a set:

https://www.thebikesmiths.com/collec...oducts/t217081

Should arrive on Monday. 2.1" = 53 mm, but I think they will still fit the 600. I'll know soon.
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Old 11-20-18, 01:12 PM
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I used Suomi-Nokian studless, A10, 622-40 on my touring bike 21 years ago,

9 months later, end of tour (with lots of stopping) they still looked like new..

the studded 26" are now 30 years old, still fine.. (Ice an occasion, not a season)
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Old 11-20-18, 02:29 PM
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I've been waiting for the thermometer to drop a bit more before throwing on studs, should be soon. I'll be curious to know how the 53mm tires fit. The A10 has an actual with of 38mm.

Originally Posted by JonathanGennick
Have you tried the A10s yet? I just found these, and have ordered a set:

https://www.thebikesmiths.com/collec...oducts/t217081

Should arrive on Monday. 2.1" = 53 mm, but I think they will still fit the 600. I'll know soon.
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Old 11-20-18, 02:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Archwhorides
I've been waiting for the thermometer to drop a bit more before throwing on studs, should be soon. I'll be curious to know how the 53mm tires fit. The A10 has an actual with of 38mm.
I'm optimistic. I own several sets of Nokians, and they all run narrower than nominal. I wonder whether that has to do with when during the manufacturing process they measure. Does the baking part shrink the tires?
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Old 11-21-18, 09:45 AM
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Originally Posted by JonathanGennick
I'm optimistic. I own several sets of Nokians, and they all run narrower than nominal. I wonder whether that has to do with when during the manufacturing process they measure. Does the baking part shrink the tires?
That is an interesting question, good luck with the fit of the 53mm studs.

My own take is that the Finns spend so much time raking, perhaps their baking skills have fallen off.
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Old 11-21-18, 10:41 AM
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I have some 650b A10s, they are incredibly heavy

I imagine there will be more winter 650b options in the future, but it's much more likely they will be 2.25" or larger.
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Old 11-21-18, 07:48 PM
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Glad this thread was here

Was about to make a post about this exact topic to see if anyone else knew any 650B options. Building a bulletproof/winter/etc bike off of the Twin Six Rando Frame I just ordered. Looking forward to hauling this bike on deployments, etc. And using it around fort drum in winter. As much as a beater bike is probably what I should use for this endeavor I can't bring myself to do it. I want to build a nicer machine from ground up and the purple is glorious. Can't wait to get it finished and ride it around in the snow and stuff
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Old 11-24-18, 08:54 AM
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Originally Posted by unterhausen
I have some 650b A10s, they are incredibly heavy.
They are! Mine arrived yesterday. I am surprised at their weight.

My Stud 62 tires also arrived yesterday. The Stud 62s are nominally wider, though in the photo below they are more taller than wider. Am planning to compare the two sets this weekend. The A10s are more studly, with 100 studs as compared to 62 in the wider tire. The stud counts going in opposite directions to nominal tire widths leaves me conflicted about which tire I'd prefer to have under me on the bike.

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Old 11-26-18, 07:05 AM
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Following up on my prior post. I was able to try both sets of tires this weekend -- one day in slushy slop over ice (Saturday), and again in colder conditions (Sunday) with a thin dusting of snow -- getting thicker as the day progressed -- over the prior day's frozen slop. My first finding is that I'm awfully tired of changing tires back and forth .

The A10s are the ones I'd choose for a commute. They roll decently on wet pavement, with enough studs to be useful on glare ice. I did a ten-mile ride on the A10s that included conditions in the photos below, and found myself hitting all the icy patches on purpose. Complete confidence in the tires, and only when the ice surface was wet and at max slipperiness did I lower my speed.

The A10s would benefit from being more supple. My 45NRTH Gravdals have it all over the A10s in their ability to conform to uneven ice like in the image below.

The A10s are a tighter fit onto my WTB rims than are the Stud 62s. The weight and thickness of the A10s lend a certain confidence about not suffering a flat. When comparing the tires in the hand, the A10 exudes an impression of quality, whereas the Stud 62 has a cheap look and feel to it. Perhaps the latter was made simply to hit a price point.

The Stud 62 tires don't actually make sense to me. They are ironically at their best when studs are not needed. I do like the rolling authority of the larger tire, but their grip was sketchy on ice, the rear tire breaks traction easily, and the front washed out on me a couple of times. Always in the back of my mind was the nagging thought that I was riding a razor's edge margin.

Tread patterns are identical on the two tires, except the spacing and knob sizes are larger on the Stud 62. It looks like someone went into Photoshop, loaded the tread pattern, hit the zoom button, and saved the result as the new pattern for the larger tire. Or maybe the larger tire came first.

What I want in a 650b winter tire is the width of the Stud 62 along with the higher quality and greater stud count of the A10, and bonus would be the suppleness from 45NRTH. I feel like Suomi has presented me a sort of Hobson's choice between quality and stud count on the one hand, and width on the other.

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