flocsy

I managed to strip everything off this Raleigh A4 that I bought from a colleague for my son. I think it's in a relatively good condition, with some rust in the frame (can be seen in the BB) and some missing paint on the chainstay, and some rust on the top tube and some small spots here and there.
I couldn't find the decal set for this online (and I guess if I would find it it would be too expensive to be worth to strip all the paint, repaint and put new decals) so I'm trying to save the original decals. What treatment would you recommend?



top tube:

seat stays:

bottom bracket:

chainstay:

rust inside the BB:

maddog34

put your cash into a better/lighter Hollowtech crankset, updated rear derailleur. and KoolStop brake pads, not paint and decals.

at least the KoolStop brake pads... serious.. that frame isn't worth multiple hours of labor to paint and re-decal.
and the better parts can be swapped to a lighter frame in the future.
AND.. those RIMS will bend in a strong breeze... maybe find a nice double walled rear rim too.

bikemig 

You could try an oxalic bath (if you google it, you'll find a few threads on this on BF) to deal with the rust. You could then simply use clear nail polish over the areas of missing paint and build the bike back up, replacing parts as needed.

flocsy

I think the crankset and even the derailleur is fine for our use case. My son is just getting into biking, doesn't use more than twice a month and we don't have a hill larger than 20m nearby so really I don't think I'll touch all that stuff.
Regarding the rims... well I forgot about the spokes. They are pretty much rusty, but I'll try to massage them with vinegar and aluminium foil, hope that it'll be good enough for the time being.

flocsy

Yes, that sounds like the most fitting solution, both cheap and doesn't need many skills. Just one thing: I am thinking about using Rustoleum 2X clear coat on the whole frame instead of dots of nail polish. What would I need to do before the spray? Cleaning oil, fingerprints it is enough? Or it would only work if I also sand the original clear coat?

grumpus

I'd just give it a wipe with an oily rag and go for a ride - it would be easy to invest a lot of effort to achieve sub-standard results. A bit of surface rust really isn't a problem on 4130, and your kid will look like a seasoned MTBer rather than a noob.

flocsy

I am now degreasing everything. What are my options with the bottom bracket? Is this servicable at home? Can I clean the sand from it (I can hear it when it's turning, and it's turning pretty badly. Or should I buy a new one? This is what was left of the sticker on it, the only thing I think I can read is: Cartridge BB and 68. What should I search for if I have to buy a new one?

HillRider

You need a new bottom bracket as the old one is not serviceable. Look for a square taper English threaded (aka BSA or 1.34"x24) cartridge for a 68mm bb shell width and match the end-to-end length of the current spindle. A Shimano BB-UN300 will work fine and Amazon lists them for $17 is a variety of spindle lengths. Look here: https://www.amazon.com/SHIMANO-BB-UN...ps%2C71&sr=8-2

Schweinhund

Before you start the money pit (and that's what I see) you have a straight gauge cromo frame/fork and a bunch of worn out low end parts.
The wheels are crap, the shifting is similar, the cranks are well, heavy metal.
The only way to reasonably refit it is to buy a donor bike. I look for girls bikes as they don't get the abuse men's bikes do.
Better yet, just get on offerup or craigslist with a budget you're willing to spend and you'll come out ahead over that bike for less money spent.

grumpus

You need the overall length in mm, as well as the 68mm frame width, to find a new one. They're cheap, less than £15 delivered for a basic one that will work fine.
You can try flushing it with kerosene, diesel, or similar and blowing it out with compressed air, but it's not really worth the effort because the bearing is probably pretty worn anyway.

grumpus

You risk sounding like a bike snob, and without appropriate information the OP risks buying something that's less fixable than this bike. I appreciate what you're saying, but this can probably make a useable bike with some effort and knowledge, as long as the hubs aren't junk (or even if they are, if the OP fancies learning how to build wheels).
If he took this to a decent bike shop they might reasonably tell him the end product wouldn't justify the labour charge, even without parts, but I don't charge myself for working on my bikes and I'll happily spend time fixing stuff that I'd never bother with at work - who doesn't patch their own inner-tube, despite it being "cheaper" to bin it and fit a new one? Now admittedly I have 50 years experience fixing bikes, a noob is going to take longer and sometimes have to search for good information, but isn't that part of why we post here?

flocsy

I bought this bike because a colleague sent a post that he was selling it and it was so cheap (for Israel's standards at least) ~$55 and perfect for my son in size and way better than his 15 old noname shimano SIS rusted crap, that I had nothing to lose. I could've buy something in the range of $120 and up but might not have been much better. Anyway the point is learning to take it apart, service it, put everything back (and be sure that it's safe to ride). I don't think that he's riding skills, and especially his willingness to ride would need amything considerably more expensive. He's riding it on local trails once every few weeks. We don't have hills, so it's really just to have fun together with the family for 2 hours.

Anyway this is how the hubs look now (just disassembled, still with the old grease) to me they look OK, but I'm here to learn. What do I need to look for?

We'll give the spokes a good massage with aluminium foil balls, then clean the bearings, regrease with ParkTool PPL-2, reassemble, and wait for the new bottom bracket to arrive (and anything else I have to order, but not because I can get a better one, only if there's something I really have to).

Regarding building new wheels, well I might try it one day, but probably not yet.

soyabean

Gotta love BSO restores.

Love can turn one from a freebie curb find to a retail value of $50

veganbikes

This is not a BSO, it is not a high quality bike or anything special and uses plenty of cheap components but is a decent step up from a wally mart special!

Schweinhund

At the risk of being that bike snob, I see way too many deals on Craigslist and offerup to not suggest he start with something of a bit greater quality level.
I do not mind building from a frame up, but I also have my own personal co-op. (my garage full of crap)
I buy very few parts most are sourced from parting out, and that is reflected in my suggestion.
And, since we seem to be in a lull in bicycle sales, I personally believe he would be money and labor ahead to buy used.

Now who's snobbing?

sweeks

I'd start by cleaning all the grease off the cones (the parts on the axles that the balls roll on, aka "inner races") and see how badly (if at all) they are worn. The cones usually start wearing out before the cups (the parts pressed into the hubs, aka "outer races"), so if wear is caught starting on the cones, the cups may (effectively) never wear out.

flocsy

Here they are after degreasing them. There is wear of course, but I have no idea if this is very good, hardly used, or worn out, and need to change. If need to changed then which parts do I need to buy?

soyabean

Get another BSO curb find, most of the time you can just swap the whole wheelset.

flocsy

I am not getting another bike for invisible parts. That makes no sense in this price category, because the cheapest bike I can get is about twice the price I paid for this and most likely it'll be some garbage that was stored outside for 10 years and is in way worse condition, so I'll end up not with a donor but with a corps. If I go higher in "quality" then the price will be even higher.

grumpus

Today I found a similar bottom bracket while looking for something else in a junk drawer, and decided because of this post to overhaul it. So I rested the drive side cup on my vice jaws and knocked the axle out with a copper hammer, then used the axle and hammer to knock the bearing out of the fixed cup, and also took the other bearing off the axle. Pulled the seals out of the bearings with a needle, to find grit, rust and congealed grease, which I removed with kerosene and a stiff brush, before blowing out any residue with compressed air. The bearings were spinning freely and quietly, so I packed them with grease, replaced the seals and reassembled with the hammer and vice. By then the bearings weren't turning as freely (generally you should not hammer bearings if you want to reuse them) but a lot better than earlier. I'm building another bike soon so I'll try this bottom bracket (if it fits) to see whether it beds in or falls apart.

grumpus

You want even wear bands around the bearing surfaces, both the cups and cones - smooth and shiny and concentric. It's not the end of the world if there's light pitting in the cones, you just have to adjust them to allow a little slack and expect to replace them soon, but heavily pitted cones should be replaced as they will be impossible to adjust effectively, and can damage the (usually non-replaceable) bearing cups.
Roll the axles on a flat surface to check if they're bent, quite common with multi-speed freewheel hubs.

grumpus

Your Craigslist experience does not reflect how it is in other places - here it's full of overpriced junk, dodgy dealers and new BSOs, even when I extend it to include a major city.
So having been a kid who fixed bikes in the 1970s is some sort of claim to superiority, or just a statement of fact? I used to love my crappy 3-speed*, we all start somewhere, right?

*[I've collected most of the parts I need to do a restomod, so I can tell just how crappy it was, or how good it might have been.]

maddog34

The Rear axle cones look fine... the front cones look to have some pitting on the ball track.. Front hubs are often too tight from the factory, This excess tightness creates extreme heat during riding... add the force from the Quick release tightening and the metal at the contact points actually Melts away...

Remember that ANY quick release axle like yours needs a tiny, tiny amount of play or when the QR is tightened, the bearings Will Overheat and pit.
YES, the axle adjustment Does get tighter when the QR is closed.

If the front cones only have a few small marks, but no pitting, grease the cups in the hub and start placing bearing balls in the grease... 10 3/16" balls per side in front, 9 1/4" balls per side in the rear hub.

PS... the front wheel cones are REPLACEMENT cones.. someone already replaced them in the past.... what you may think is "roughness" may just be the Black oxide wearing through in patches.... most cheap aftermarket cones are lousy quality, but usually better than the rust pitted ones people replace... Do the Threads seem loose too? if so, yep, they're the cheapo ones.

Schweinhund

So is your name Grumpus or Gurmpy?
Was having a bit of fun, don't get all butthurt.
I was in no way insulting your knowledge or ability, I was just getting a zinger in.
Nothing at all wrong with being smart enough at a young age to rebuild an IGH.

flocsy

I remembered from youtube videos how to play with the tightening, then trying it again and again. Today I assembled both hubs (used the same parts). I'll make sure tomorrow to loosen them ever so slightly before I give it to my son to test ride.

Replacement? What makes you think that? I didn't even think that's a possibility. I got the bike form a colleague who used it when he was a teenager, and the last years it spent stored at his parent's place. I thought everything was original. Not that it matters for me. I don't think the threads are loose, but I'm not 100% sure which threads you mean When I put the cones on the axle and turn it until it gets to it's place (touches the bearings)? After the cleaning I could do that with bare hands, but I thought that's the normal case, I wouldn't say it's loose.