Lezyne new GPS units look interesting
07-27-18, 08:35 PM
#51
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Another little update. On the way home I made another route and that worked fine. I'm guessing it's the way I Picked the way points that the issue is. In terms of the app it's kind of just annoying. Itn some aspects it's just not easy to use at all. Like to get my workout to show on the app took some figgurijg out. This should be something that is automatic.
07-28-18, 03:06 PM
#52
Senior Member
Another little update. On the way home I made another route and that worked fine. I'm guessing it's the way I Picked the way points that the issue is. In terms of the app it's kind of just annoying. Itn some aspects it's just not easy to use at all. Like to get my workout to show on the app took some figgurijg out. This should be something that is automatic.
07-29-18, 05:02 AM
#54
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I have a Bryton 530. I got it because of the price (MSRP $180) and above all the battery life of 34 hours. I also have a Garmin Fennix i horse traded for used. I have been watching the Lezyne mature hoping they would get to this state and am excited. I love their other products. Looking forward to trying this IF it does do turn by turn decently. I have used many GPS extensively in the field including a Garmin Dakota for doing 1500 miles of the great divide. It ate a set of lithium AA batteries every day and a half of riding. Am not a fan of garmin because of the short battery life and their tendency to crash. The brytons are by no means perfect. For one they only do a line follow of the route with no street names or base maps. I hear a newer color version with possible base maps is shipping here in the US soon though. Having traveled/toured extensively with people using various navigation devices they all have their pros and cons. Even the brytons lock up for example, but they very quickly can be restarted and can get back on route. This has only happened to me twice. Garmin lockups seem to happen much more frequently on the 520 and 800 series i have experience with and often you cannot get the route back up. That said garmin are still the best for complex navigation jobs with street names, base maps and audible turn warnings, but to often they have left me stranded and having to pull out my smart phone. Ultimately for my touring purpuses I need complete reliability and long battery life. If that mans trayscale screens and simple line trace routes I can deal with it, but it does occasionally mean pulling out the old samsung S5 with Gaia GPS software on it. My garmin Fennix is the same way. No base maps as it is last gen, but great battery life and basic navigation.
P.S. love the signature: "Randonneuring -- it's touring for people that aren't smart enough to stop for the night. It's a wonderful sport when you can make up for a lack of ability with a lack of sleep."
I have settle down more now that I get to tour with others. Less riding around the clock, but getting to tour with my SO is amazing. She is not quite as adventurous as me, but not everyone likes to ride all night and gets excited about riding in blizzards.
P.S. love the signature: "Randonneuring -- it's touring for people that aren't smart enough to stop for the night. It's a wonderful sport when you can make up for a lack of ability with a lack of sleep."
I have settle down more now that I get to tour with others. Less riding around the clock, but getting to tour with my SO is amazing. She is not quite as adventurous as me, but not everyone likes to ride all night and gets excited about riding in blizzards.
07-30-18, 10:40 AM
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Like to get my workout to show on the app took some figgurijg out. This should be something that is automatic.
08-01-18, 06:42 AM
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You use the phone app to load the route into the computer...Then you can close the app, turn off the phone, even leave the phone at home. So, no, it is not relying on your phone for actual navigation during the ride.
08-01-18, 07:05 AM
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got it. My only reservation now is that it appears you have to use their website to load a route. I usually just hook my garmin up to my computer as a disk and upload a tcx file. Then if I want to upload an activity to a website, I hook it up to the computer after the ride, d/l, and then upload.
Granted, using their website on the road would be easier than what I do now, which involves finding a computer that doesn't want to format my garmin and doesn't reject it because of virus protection. That's not always easy.
Maybe I'm wrong about this too, hope so.
Granted, using their website on the road would be easier than what I do now, which involves finding a computer that doesn't want to format my garmin and doesn't reject it because of virus protection. That's not always easy.
Maybe I'm wrong about this too, hope so.
08-01-18, 07:29 AM
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It's not that big of a deal. I make my routes in Ride with GPS only because the Lezyne GPS Root website isn't as nicely polished. Then I export it out of RWGPS as a TCX file then import the TCX file to the Lezyne website. After that it's now available on the phone app to send to the GPS unit. And as Koyote pointed out...You don't need the phone after that for turn by turn to work.
08-01-18, 08:20 AM
#61
Senior Member
The new Garmin Edge Explore has gotten good reviews including a complete review from dc rainmaker and it's specifically marketed for touring cyclists and others who want turn by turn navigation. Other than power and Strava live segments, it does everything else and includes maps. All for retail of $250
Knowing all this, why bother with Lezyne?
https://www.rei.com/product/145207/g...hoCaX8QAvD_BwE
Knowing all this, why bother with Lezyne?
https://www.rei.com/product/145207/g...hoCaX8QAvD_BwE
08-01-18, 08:26 AM
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other than an extra web experience to deal with, I don't like the fact that they could just decide to shut you down at any time. Garmin decided my device was EOL and that they weren't going to fix some glaring errors, just wash their hands of the device. But I can still use it. I have been avoiding any device that requires a web interface, it just doesn't make sense to me. My daughter bought a fitness watch where the company got bought out and the new owners just pulled the plug on the website. Poof! No longer works, buy one of our other fine products!
Other than I have vowed never to buy another Garmin, that does look good. I'm a bit wishy-washy on that vow. Need to know more though. Somebody buy one and test it for me by riding 24 hours. The Garmin Touring was a disaster for too many people I know, so I'm going to wait. The touring looked perfect for me, but a lot of people just couldn't get it to work.
The new Garmin Edge Explore has gotten good reviews including a complete review from dc rainmaker and it's specifically marketed for touring cyclists and others who want turn by turn navigation. Other than power and Strava live segments, it does everything else and includes maps. All for retail of $250
Knowing all this, why bother with Lezyne?
Knowing all this, why bother with Lezyne?
Last edited by unterhausen; 08-01-18 at 08:31 AM.
08-01-18, 08:43 AM
#63
Senior Member
other than an extra web experience to deal with, I don't like the fact that they could just decide to shut you down at any time. Garmin decided my device was EOL and that they weren't going to fix some glaring errors, just wash their hands of the device. But I can still use it. I have been avoiding any device that requires a web interface, it just doesn't make sense to me. My daughter bought a fitness watch where the company got bought out and the new owners just pulled the plug on the website. Poof! No longer works, buy one of our other fine products!
Other than I have vowed never to buy another Garmin, that does look good. I'm a bit wishy-washy on that vow. Need to know more though. Somebody buy one and test it for me by riding 24 hours. The Garmin Touring was a disaster for too many people I know, so I'm going to wait. The touring looked perfect for me, but a lot of people just couldn't get it to work.
Other than I have vowed never to buy another Garmin, that does look good. I'm a bit wishy-washy on that vow. Need to know more though. Somebody buy one and test it for me by riding 24 hours. The Garmin Touring was a disaster for too many people I know, so I'm going to wait. The touring looked perfect for me, but a lot of people just couldn't get it to work.
Here's a brief history of my experience with Garmin:
I had a Garmin 810 for many years and it was trouble free till last year. At startup on cold days, it would go into a developer or diagnostic screen. A call to Garmin customer service was answered promptly and after many tries to correct the problem, it was decided that best solution would be to replace the unit. For a $50 fee, they exchanged my unit for a factory refurbished unit as well as a new charging cable. I would never have known the replacement unit was anything other than new if I hadn't been told so. It's worked flawlessly since I got it.
I recently completed a double century. I knew the battery wouldn't last so I used one of these: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...X9EWVXLJ&psc=1
08-01-18, 09:05 AM
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other than an extra web experience to deal with, I don't like the fact that they could just decide to shut you down at any time. Garmin decided my device was EOL and that they weren't going to fix some glaring errors, just wash their hands of the device. But I can still use it. I have been avoiding any device that requires a web interface, it just doesn't make sense to me. My daughter bought a fitness watch where the company got bought out and the new owners just pulled the plug on the website. Poof! No longer works, buy one of our other fine products!
Other than I have vowed never to buy another Garmin, that does look good. I'm a bit wishy-washy on that vow. Need to know more though. Somebody buy one and test it for me by riding 24 hours. The Garmin Touring was a disaster for too many people I know, so I'm going to wait. The touring looked perfect for me, but a lot of people just couldn't get it to work.
Other than I have vowed never to buy another Garmin, that does look good. I'm a bit wishy-washy on that vow. Need to know more though. Somebody buy one and test it for me by riding 24 hours. The Garmin Touring was a disaster for too many people I know, so I'm going to wait. The touring looked perfect for me, but a lot of people just couldn't get it to work.
08-01-18, 09:36 AM
#65
Senior Member
If Strava Live segments is important to you, be aware that Lezyne, Wahoo and other small players in the cycling GPS market may not be able to deliver on their promises to have that feature on their products. This excerpt is from a recent dc rainmaker review of the Stages Dash
But then there’s the bigger problem: Lack of Strava Live Segments
See, the original Stages Dash didn’t have Strava Live Segments either – but the company wanted to roll it out with these new products. Up until this point in time, that was largely a company-specific (Stages) thing, not a Strava limiter. As long as they had Strava’s blessing to roll out, it was merely a technical implementation item. Garmin, Polar, Lezyne, Wahoo, Mio, Sigma, and probably some others I’m missing all have done so on a variety of their devices.
But when Stages went to get said blessing they were essentially told to pay a per-device fee. Without getting too far into the specifics, that per-device fee is massive – almost as much as retailers would make. Of course, for any company, that’s a non-starter. Stages was apparently the first company to be caught in this new Strava policy of making money on the device side of Strava Live Segments (as a reminder it already is limited to only paying Strava Premium users).
Now both Stages and Strava say they’re still working this out – and thus, for the time being, I’ll sit a bit longer on the sidelines while they do so.
But let me be clear upfront: I’m not a fan, and let me explain why.
This is effectively a Garmin device promotion fee. There’s really no other way to frame it. See, Strava can go to smaller players like Stages, Sigma, Lezyne, and Polar (and probably even Wahoo) and force them to pay this fee (or not have the feature). Whereas if they go to Garmin and say the same, Garmin will tell them to ‘take a flying leap’ (actually, they’ll use other four-letter words).
Strava will have no choice of course, because Garmin commands about 95-98% of the cycling GPS market. But more importantly – it drives people to actually subscribe to Strava Premium. Without Garmin, Strava’s back to losing boatloads of cash (which investors don’t like). It’s the much tighter partnership between Strava and Garmin over the last 3 years that’s increased Strava’s previously non-existent revenues. Strava knows this, Garmin knows this…and everyone else knows this.
Plus this:
https://www.dcrainmaker.com/2018/08/...ing-model.html
But then there’s the bigger problem: Lack of Strava Live Segments
See, the original Stages Dash didn’t have Strava Live Segments either – but the company wanted to roll it out with these new products. Up until this point in time, that was largely a company-specific (Stages) thing, not a Strava limiter. As long as they had Strava’s blessing to roll out, it was merely a technical implementation item. Garmin, Polar, Lezyne, Wahoo, Mio, Sigma, and probably some others I’m missing all have done so on a variety of their devices.
But when Stages went to get said blessing they were essentially told to pay a per-device fee. Without getting too far into the specifics, that per-device fee is massive – almost as much as retailers would make. Of course, for any company, that’s a non-starter. Stages was apparently the first company to be caught in this new Strava policy of making money on the device side of Strava Live Segments (as a reminder it already is limited to only paying Strava Premium users).
Now both Stages and Strava say they’re still working this out – and thus, for the time being, I’ll sit a bit longer on the sidelines while they do so.
But let me be clear upfront: I’m not a fan, and let me explain why.
This is effectively a Garmin device promotion fee. There’s really no other way to frame it. See, Strava can go to smaller players like Stages, Sigma, Lezyne, and Polar (and probably even Wahoo) and force them to pay this fee (or not have the feature). Whereas if they go to Garmin and say the same, Garmin will tell them to ‘take a flying leap’ (actually, they’ll use other four-letter words).
Strava will have no choice of course, because Garmin commands about 95-98% of the cycling GPS market. But more importantly – it drives people to actually subscribe to Strava Premium. Without Garmin, Strava’s back to losing boatloads of cash (which investors don’t like). It’s the much tighter partnership between Strava and Garmin over the last 3 years that’s increased Strava’s previously non-existent revenues. Strava knows this, Garmin knows this…and everyone else knows this.
Plus this:
https://www.dcrainmaker.com/2018/08/...ing-model.html
08-01-18, 10:54 AM
#66
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good thing that doesn't matter to me, but I'll add it to my list of reasons why Strava is a force for evil in this world
08-01-18, 12:47 PM
#67
Senior Member
Just glad I don't mess with stuff like Strava.
08-01-18, 02:26 PM
#68
Senior Member
+1.....What I don't understand is if Strava already has a premium "pay for" app, why would they screw themselves by trying to milk the bike computer companies? I mean if you own a Garmin, Wahoo or Lezyne nav. computer and you want it to work with Strava, I would assume that the owner of whatever bike computer would still have to pay Strava if they wanted the premium features of the Strava app. That said, "Why screw with the people who actually own the Strava app and just want to use it with their bike computer"? I can understand general greed but I don't understand "stupid greed". What's next, is Strava going to try to milk iphone and Android for the right to use their app? Just glad I don't mess with stuff like Strava.
Just glad I don't mess with stuff like Strava.Why should others be allowed to leverage what Strava built from the ground up for free? Strava developed segments and is now asking for a fee if others want the feauture on their GPS units. Additionally, Strava is still in the RED .How are they supposed to earn $ if everything is free?
They're rolling out different less expensive plans for users or still a basic free plan and their app has no advertising.
How would you propose they earn money?
08-01-18, 07:33 PM
#69
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It's only free if you consider a premium strava account free. I only have a strava account because that's the only way I can upload a ride in to trainerroad. I don't really need to pay to have a website tell me I'm the 279th fastest person that did a particular ride.
08-01-18, 09:04 PM
#70
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It's only free if you consider a premium strava account free. I only have a strava account because that's the only way I can upload a ride in to trainerroad. I don't really need to pay to have a website tell me I'm the 279th fastest person that did a particular ride.
08-01-18, 10:16 PM
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08-01-18, 11:03 PM
#72
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It's only free if you consider a premium strava account free. I only have a strava account because that's the only way I can upload a ride in to trainerroad. I don't really need to pay to have a website tell me I'm the 279th fastest person that did a particular ride.
And if you "need" Strava Live segments to use in trainerroad, pay them for a service they're providing until someone else can either provide it cheaper or free. I don't see evil in wanting to turn a profit (which they have never done).
08-02-18, 02:36 AM
#73
Helpless Bike Fiend
If Strava Live segments is important to you, be aware that Lezyne, Wahoo and other small players in the cycling GPS market may not be able to deliver on their promises to have that feature on their products. This excerpt is from a recent dc rainmaker review of the Stages Dash
But then there’s the bigger problem: Lack of Strava Live Segments
<snipped contend>
This is effectively a Garmin device promotion fee. There’s really no other way to frame it. See, Strava can go to smaller players like Stages, Sigma, Lezyne, and Polar (and probably even Wahoo) and force them to pay this fee (or not have the feature). Whereas if they go to Garmin and say the same, Garmin will tell them to ‘take a flying leap’ (actually, they’ll use other four-letter words).
Strava will have no choice of course, because Garmin commands about 95-98% of the cycling GPS market. But more importantly – it drives people to actually subscribe to Strava Premium. Without Garmin, Strava’s back to losing boatloads of cash (which investors don’t like). It’s the much tighter partnership between Strava and Garmin over the last 3 years that’s increased Strava’s previously non-existent revenues. Strava knows this, Garmin knows this…and everyone else knows this.
Plus this:
https://www.dcrainmaker.com/2018/08/...ing-model.html
But then there’s the bigger problem: Lack of Strava Live Segments
<snipped contend>
This is effectively a Garmin device promotion fee. There’s really no other way to frame it. See, Strava can go to smaller players like Stages, Sigma, Lezyne, and Polar (and probably even Wahoo) and force them to pay this fee (or not have the feature). Whereas if they go to Garmin and say the same, Garmin will tell them to ‘take a flying leap’ (actually, they’ll use other four-letter words).
Strava will have no choice of course, because Garmin commands about 95-98% of the cycling GPS market. But more importantly – it drives people to actually subscribe to Strava Premium. Without Garmin, Strava’s back to losing boatloads of cash (which investors don’t like). It’s the much tighter partnership between Strava and Garmin over the last 3 years that’s increased Strava’s previously non-existent revenues. Strava knows this, Garmin knows this…and everyone else knows this.
Plus this:
https://www.dcrainmaker.com/2018/08/...ing-model.html
That puts paid my idea of getting the new Lezyne Mega series. I had high hopes for these new offerings as something less expensive than Garmin, but more sophisticated than the CatEye units I've been using since the late 1980s. My current CatEye Strada Smart will give power, speed/distance and cadence data -- it just lacks GPS navigation. Currently if I run into navigation issues while out on a ride, I stop and use my phone to find my location and plan my route....no turn by turn directions to be sure, but the head unit is USD 200+ less than a stripped down Garmin.
Bye Bye Strava Premium.....since the company refuses to address a years-long list of feature requests, and now effectively kills of GPS unit competition, why support them?
__________________
Never give a gun to ducks No bike does everything perfectly. In fact, no bike does anything until someone gets on it to ride.
Never give a gun to ducks No bike does everything perfectly. In fact, no bike does anything until someone gets on it to ride.
08-02-18, 05:37 AM
#74
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The new Garmin Edge Explore has gotten good reviews including a complete review from dc rainmaker and it's specifically marketed for touring cyclists and others who want turn by turn navigation. Other than power and Strava live segments, it does everything else and includes maps. All for retail of $250
Knowing all this, why bother with Lezyne?
Knowing all this, why bother with Lezyne?
08-02-18, 05:44 AM
#75
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I'm not sure why anyone would really want Strava Live Segments. I don't need an alert when I'm approaching a segment or to look down at a computer while I'm riding to look at my progress on a particular segment. Just ride it and check how you did after the ride is completed.
Last edited by prj71; 08-02-18 at 05:51 AM.
