DC City Hauler

Hi. I've been watching for Vitus bikes on ebay and finally saw one that I like at an acceptable price, in what I think is the correct size. I was thinking about pulling the trigger when I realized that the wheels had tubular tires. It's been literally 35 years since I've dealt with tubular tires--and only once or twice--and I would want to switch to regular clinchers. So here's the thing: how much would it cost me to get a set of decent clinchers? Am I right in thinking that I need all-new rims at the very least? Also, what would I have to know with regard to switching the rear gears if I were to buy new wheels, assuming the plan was to swap the ones on the current rear wheel? Or do I go for a whole new gear system? The cassette I guess is the word. What do I need to know?

A little googling tells me I'm going to have to pay at least $200 for new wheels. This is on top of a purchase price that's already a bit steep. , on top of the purchase price of the bike. If true, I'm inclined to take a pass and wait for another Vitus to come along.

Here's the bike in question. I noted that it's missing pedals, but that's ok since I assume I'd be picking up something to go along with new biking shoes anyway. Back in the day I had Look pedals and would want something comparable.

SJX426 

I am biased in favor of sew-ups. Its got new tires! Run it as is after getting a spare. Really not that big a deal unless you plan on running on sketchy roads where you are going to get the same number of flats. Changing a sew-up is as fast or faster than a clincher with a new tube i.l.o. patching. It already has a nice set of wheels and the rims will last a bit longer than the tires.

DiabloScott

I'd say stick with sew ups too - it's part of the vintage experience and there is satisfaction in getting good at it. My tubular wheelset it the thing I love MOST about riding my vintage bike.

But if your budget is as tight as you imply, then you could probably find some clincher rims and new spokes and rebuild on the same hubs and keep everything else the same for under $200, and maybe sell the tubular rims too.

xiaoman1 

OP,
The price of admission to vitus on the bike in question seems very high to me....a quick look on C.L. turned these up, of course, they are not your size but the prices are all over the place...some higher (but not selling).
I would suggest that you wait another will come along for a much better price. The notion of the cost of wheels is also continigent on what you want to do....wheelsets on CL will range from 125.00 to stratosphere, but you should be able to find a decent set for under 200.00 with tires often with a cassette or freewheel.
Be Patient.
Good Luck, Ben

https://orangecounty.craigslist.org/...218444081.html
https://inlandempire.craigslist.org/...201696783.html
https://sfbay.craigslist.org/pen/bop...238360862.html

Germany_chris

I put stans in my tubies so I don’t change them mid ride. I personally can’t think of a single good reason to run clinchers in popular tubular sizes.

Classtime 

I agree with Ben. Wait for a nicer specimen if you are willing to put more than $1000 into it.

SJX426 

@DC City Hauler - Having ridden in DC for several years, I would not hesitate to ride sew-ups in that area. Lots of nice paths and the roads are often good.

I would stick to clinchers on the FG/SS.

Mad Honk 

DCCH,
I doubt that a pair of clinchers will set you back $200 unless you buy new stuff. If you look through the junk here in my shop you could get a set with tires for on the cheap. If you are willing to use some used parts I could likely find you something for the cost of shipping. But it looks like the Vitus is overpriced so I hope you keep looking around. Smiles, MH

SurferRosa

First, buy vintage used ($100-$160) or build them yourself with vintage hubs ($50-$100 if you don't already have them) and either new rims ($70-$150) or really good vintage rims ($50-$120). Double butted spokes will be around $60.

Most vintage hubs of the 120-126mm o.l.d. variety use 5, 6-, and 7-speed freewheels that thread onto the hub. You can use a vintage cluster or buy new.

DC City Hauler

Tell me more about hubs. Most of you recommend buying/building rims using vintage parts. Why? Is there a technical reason needing to do so? Or is the idea simply to be 'period-appropriate'? Or just to save money by going with old parts?

To be clear, I'm interested in saving money so would welcome used parts. I'd happily ride vintage wheels if I'm getting good value. But I'm not interested in period-appropriate for its own sake. I like the Vitus because I think it's beautiful and cool and would rather own/ride something of beauty than spend the equivalent on a new bike...the only new bikes I think are good looking are vastly more expensive custom builds. Several thousand dollars versus under $1k. Of course, all things being equal I'd take an 80s Vitus with a period-appropriate Campy group over Shimanos new or old, but who wouldn't? But, money aside, is there a technical reason why I can't just go out and buy whatever new wheel sets that, say, Performance is selling?

By the way, the same logic has gotten me a closet full of mid-20th century Brooks Brothers suits. It's like this: For maybe $200 plus $150 in tailoring I can get a suit that's demonstrably superior to any suit that costs under $2k new. And radically better than any new $200 suit. So it's not that I'm trying to dress vintage...I just appreciate the value proposition. Oh, and yes I look great in great suits (not that I've worn any suits since Covid happened in March). Now, compare a $800 vintage Vitus with whatever Taiwanese bike I can get for the same price at the neighborhood bike store. Functionally that new bike might even be better...but the Vitus is also, well, sexy

DC City Hauler

What are FG/SS?

DC City Hauler

What are "stans"?

Germany_chris

Tubeless tire sealant

SJX426 

@DC City Hauler - FG/SS : Fixed Gear/Single Speed

Stans is a "no tube" option for tire configuration - First Name in Tubeless | Stan's NoTubes

Classtime 

DC City Hauler the bike you are considering has space in its rear end for a vintage hub. You would need to spread that rear end wider to squeeze in a more modern wheel with its wider hub that you might get at performance. Not a big deal with a steel frame but that I have read that Dural frames don't take kindly to being "abused" in such a fashion.

xiaoman1 

Sound advice!

SurferRosa

All the above. We ride vintage because it works for us, and we're really into the aesthetic. It's these two things. We like beautiful things that look right together and can perform just like they did in the 1960 tdf or the 1984 tdf. They don't really wear out if you rebuild and take care of them. We know how to overhaul everything. We know how to replace things. We do all our own work, and it's easy for us to work on simple tech. We love wrenching just as much as riding.

Vintage hubs like Campagnolo Record are beautiful and look right. At the same price point, modern hubs are plain and ordinary. If we cannot get our hands on really good old rims, we appreciate new rims that provide a perfect brake surface and still look appropriate with our old stuff. It all needs to work perfectly, smoothly, quietly, just like it did decades ago when new ... or maybe a little better than it did now that we have better tires, chains, etc.

DC City Hauler

Thanks. No, that doesn't sound like a good idea to me. I hadn't realized there was a space issue. Will be happy to stick with vintage.

DC City Hauler

I remember back in the 80s comparing a friend's Campy (Record or Chorus? Don't remember) with my Shimano 105. Yes, my 105s did the job, but Campagnolo managed to make something as banal as a gear ring not just functional but an object of beauty. Very Italian. At the time I was jealous of a friend's Vitus, for the same reason. I assumed it was Italian and only recently, when I decided to hunt for one, learned of its French provenance.

scarlson 

Spreading the 126mm rear end of the Vitus 979 to 130 is something I've done three times now. All the bikes I have done are ridden extensively, and they've been fine for some years. It's ok if you know what you're doing and go very carefully. I do it by hand, not with any tools, so I can better feel what's going on. I use dropout alignment tools to get the faces parallel only after I've done the spreading by hand. Then you can use any cassette-equipped road bike rear wheel. There are a ton of options if you go this route.

That said, if you want to keep the spacing as it is, you can easily find a set of clincher wheels with 126 spacing and run 7-speed on the back with a modern freewheel.
It is also probably pretty easily find a set of wheels with an old Shimano 7-speed freehub that has the hyperglide (HG) freehub lockring thread on the inside, so it can take HG cassettes. Then you can use 8 of the 9 cogs from a readily-available 9-speed cassette and have 8-speed on your 126 spaced Vitus. Upgrading to a freehub is going to make your bike lighter, the rear axle stronger, and the whole thing easier to maintain (don't need a vise to remove the freewheel).

See Sheldon Brown's excellent page about cassettes for more information.
https://sheldonbrown.com/k7.html

Finally, that listing is not a great deal for a Vitus 979. You can do better, especially if you want to change wheels in the end anyway. Wait around and something that is cheaper and possibly more suited to your preferences will pop up.

3alarmer 

....a couple of things to think about. This is from the perspective of someone who constructs his own wheels, and has for a long time.

Most of those wheel sets you can buy for a couple hunnet bucks from Performance are constructed by machine, so they need to be tweaked a little bit by the user anyway. At time of receipt, you generally need to balance (and often to increase) the final spoke tensions, as well as stress relieve the spokes. They are good value, considering the cost of rims, hubs, and spokes these days, but you are often limited in what you can find available for purchase with regard to hub OLD spacing, hub quality, spoke number, and most especially rim quality.

So it's not just period correct that is involved here, but function and durability to some extent as well.

The better current offerings in box section rims (if you can get them in the 36 and 32 hole drillings to match your hubs), are really a joy to ride. The feel with a 25-28 mm high pressure clincher tyre approaches that of the older tubulars. They are quite nice, both in manufacturing processes and final finish/quality control. Before the pandemic bike parts crunch, they were more of a bargain. I just priced some 36 hole rims on Amazon, and the Sun rims I used to buy pretty cheaply in the 20-30 dollar range are now selling for 40-50. So much increased in price that I ended up buying some H + Sons rimms for not much more in price, and a big increase in quality.

I have no idea what spokes cost these days, but DT's were running around 50 cents each in bulk 100 boxes the last time I bought any. I have a pretty big collection of leftovers in a 5 gallon bucket, and mostly I use those when I can. The hubs, since you are using the old ones, are free for the cost off reconditioning them ( usually cleaning and new bearings, if needed ) .

So for this particular French PX-10E something or other Super Comp, my investment in the wheels will be about 120 bucks for two rims, plus whatever I spend on spokes if I can't find the right lengths in my bucket, plus maybe an hour to recondition the hubs, plus a couple of evenings (or crummy weather days) in lacing them and doing the tensioning and truing. The tensioning and truing would need doing anyway, even if I bought new machine built wheels.

I look at it as about the same cash investment, with a final result that is vastly superior. Which also comes out sort of period correct as to hubs and spokes, but considerably peppier to ride.


The time factor is larger when you are first learning to do this operation. So if your time is worth anything to you, consider that too. My time is pretty much free for me to do what I enjoy. Not everyone is so fortunate.

DC City Hauler

You guys are all super helpful. The bottom line seems to be:

1. I can do better, price-wise, and frankly I'd just assume not to have to wade into the process of finding/building appropriate replacement wheels. That would require learning a lot. I'm not against learning, but I'd rather spend that time riding
2. Running tubular is doable...I won't HAVE TO replace the wheels, but I'm going to want to eventually.

Paul J

I've got a pair of 36 hole Campy Record with Suntour 6speed and MA 40 clincher rims that I've been meaning to put up here that would be available just a little north of where you are if that would be something of interest.