W F Collins

I've had my new Red groupo for about a month and I'm getting fed up w/ SRAM's FD's. A solid, trustworthy front shift hardly ever shows up.

I called SRAM and the advised/supplied a Force Stainless cage to try instead of the Red Ti cage, saying they had lots of issues w/ flex on the ti one. Gave it a shot and the shifting is still sloppy. The limits are about as perfect as they can be, but only 1 out of every 8 or 9 shifts is buttery. In either cage there is a good ammount of flex near the rear. Is there a way to compensate for this on the SRAM FD's? Is this just common with SRAM? My braze-on adapter seems solid, but could this be a culprit? Anyone other suggestions?

My LBS is recommending a switch to an ultegra/DA cage. The owner said he had the same issue, switched, and never looked back. Anyone tried this?

ilovecycling

I just now compared the flex between Ultegra 6700 (my bike) and Rival (gf's bike) with my fingers. I just pinched it with my fingers and gave it a little wobble. Rival is way stiffer. That being the case, Ultegra 6700 front shifting is still really really nice. I actually think Shimano is better for front shifting, but SRAM is better for rear.

I don't think a lack of stiffness is your problem. I don't know what else it could be since you said it's already properly adjusted. New cables maybe?

Val23708

my Force FD shifts just fine. I'd check that you are screwing down the cable correctly

Steve90068

my force and rival both have flawless front shifting.

hodie21

Front shifting is perfect on my Force FD.

EddieH

No problems for me with both Force and Rival. When I was installing my Force group, I did have to fuss with the height and angle of the FD before I got it dialed in. Check that the gap between the top of the teeth of the large chainring and the bottom of the FD cage is equal to about a penny's thickness.

Elvo

Get a better mechanic. Force/Rival share the same FD and shift flawlessly.

W F Collins

Changed out the cables...same issue. Interesting about the ultegra/rival comparison first hand. Have you had issues w/ your rival? Is your's a braze on or clamp on?

W F Collins

"I did have to fuss with the height and angle of the FD before I got it dialed in. Check that the gap between the top of the teeth of the large chainring and the bottom of the FD cage is equal to about a penny's thickness."

"I'd check that you are screwing down the cable correctly"

When you refer to angle, are you talking about running it non-parallel to the chainring?

Also, screwing down the cable correctly? Do you mean inside the grooves or something else I'm not seeing?

Runner 1

You may just have a lower tolerance than these people saying their shifting is perfect.

Painful Chafe

Yes. Put on a Shimano. I got a 6600 Ultegra front derailluer on my Force/Red group and it is great. 6600 FD's are very cheap and can be had for about $30 on CL.

JayhawKen

On Shimano front DR's the cable must come over the top of the attachment - some people run it from underneath and the shifting can never be dialed in if that is the case. I am not familiar with SRAM routing, but maybe something to check out.

W F Collins

For what we pay to get these groups, yes I expect it to shift perfect if setup right. That last part though....such a hassle.

giantdefy

Shift to the small chain ring and see if you have slack in the cable underneath the down tube, that may be your issue, readjust if necessary. No need to buy a new FD.

ilovecycling

The Rival is on her bike, which has a clamp on FD. I also had Rival on my '11 Cervelo R3 before I sold it. That was braze on and also shifted flawlessly. I'm pretty excited for my Red gruppo to show up so I can see what all the Red FD fuss is all about. I doubt I'll need to swap it out for a Rival/Force FD though.

revchuck 

I went in the other direction when I somehow broke the 6600 FD on my CAAD9, because the Force FD was cheaper. It was the day after Thanksgiving and I needed it NOW. It was a distinct improvement. When I switched over to an Allez Comp frameset, I had to get another FD since the Allez required a braze-on, and I went for Force again.

BmoreDrew

Same issue here with my Rival FD. It is perfectly dialed in.. takes several pushes to get it to shift either up or down.

Here I was thinking of going to Force for a FD, but maybe I look at Shimano. I do like my DA cassette and chain. I just hate Shimano shifters.

Best part was when I was humping up a hill the other day and really started to come to a hault, panickly tried to get into the little ring and couldnt.. I didn't unclip fast enough and I fell over. lol

Might I add the RD is flawless shifting everytime. Silky smooth!

EddieH

[QUOTE=W F Collins;12774680]"I did have to fuss with the height and angle of the FD before I got it dialed in. Check that the gap between the top of the teeth of the large chainring and the bottom of the FD cage is equal to about a penny's thickness."

When you refer to angle, are you talking about running it non-parallel to the chainring?

Actually, I was talking about making sure it was running parallel. The bigger issue was getting the height right so the gap was what it should be.

zigmeister

You know, I think this topic has come up a few times inside other threads.

I find it interesting that all the pro teams use a Red FD with a steel cage. It is the exact same steel cage as the Force FD, they just put a Red sticker on it..haha..

But, I've personally left my titanium one on, and it works perfect pretty much. I don't notice any degredation from my Ultegra 6700 setup.

Also, I don't expect perfect shifting every single time, and I really don't see how you can.

There are so many things involved in a simple mechanical shift.

1) A mechanical unit trying to lift and push a chain from a smaller diameter chainring up to a larger on.
2) The chain itself. Wear/tear, design/machinig.
3) The chainrings themseves, how they are machined, QC.
4) The FD and its adjustment/height/limits/angle
5) Shift Levers, the type, brand etc..
6) Cables are in the mix and how they are routed/secured. Wear and tear/stretch over time.
7) Frame itself of the bike and the QC tolerances they achieved could effect shifting and other aspect.

When I see pros having their chains fall off, shifting issues...and plus my 28yrs of riding experience on road bikes, I'm going to assume some stuff just isn't going to ever be fixed right mechanically speaking with manual setups so it is 100% butter every time. I will take the 99.9 that it works perfect though.

Look at Schleck at the Tour De Suisse yesterday on the TT. He gets a few hundred meters down the road, stupid bike won't shift and stay on the rings. He ends up having to swap his bike to the Road one and finish the TT. These are basically custom one off bikes that costs $15K to make likely and setup for these guys, and the stupid thing couldn't shift at all and work. Kind of like the Formula 1 car that goes around the track a few times, after they put $2M into the car.

Maybe Di2 is really the only solution to take out several aspects of the shifting issues mentioned above. But I don't want to spend $2K for something that I have to charge every few days like my cell phone, my Edge 500 and other stuff in life. Plus, what happens with Di2 when the battery dies or something with the wiring goes wrong during a race/ride?

I will say this though, although I have all Red now, except brakes, most of the components are basically the same compared to the Force. The FD/RD/Cranks/Brakes, except chainrings themselves, are basically the same, just some weight savings, titanium bits etc.


I'm not so sure the extra $100 is warranted for Red over Force per component personally. Except with the shifters. Zero loss on both sides is very nice. The best switch I made for sure was to Red shifters.

Looigi

Shifting performance also depends on the crank/rings being used.

Val23708

If its perfectly dialed in, it'll shift fine every time. Once the shift lever clicks, you should not have to worry about it not shifting gears. Two clicks do shift down obviously (for 2009+ Rival and 2010+ Force - earlier is two clicks up 1 click down).

Rival FD and Force FD are exactly the same except for label and the color of the arm.

BmoreDrew

Trust me, it is dialed in correctly. If I flip the bike over, shift and turn the crank.. it shifts flawless everytime. If I'm on the bike riding it.. I have issues. All I can think is flex?

Elvo

Maybe your chain is too big/small/worn?

BmoreDrew

Me?

Too big as in too long?

Not wear.. it isn't that old.

I <3 Robots

Double check your cable and make sure that its not binding. Make sure the braze on tab that the FD mounts to is straight. Take it to another shop.

I'm using Red shifters, Force FD, Stonglight CT2 rings...shifts smooth every time.