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We'll never be safe...

Old 07-18-19, 06:37 PM
  #26  
mcours2006
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You gotta wonder what the heck the driver was doing to be so oblivious to his/her surroundings. Maybe on the phone.

With a rear view mirror cyclist might have seen the car coming too close and moved over a tad to avoid collision. Still pissy, but no harm done.
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Old 07-26-19, 07:26 PM
  #27  
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This is just another maddening example. Of why I 'take the lane'.
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Old 07-26-19, 07:39 PM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by Chris0516 View Post
This is just another maddening example. Of why I 'take the lane'.
What is not an example (i.e. an excuse) of why you "take the lane"?
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Old 07-29-19, 06:56 PM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike View Post
What is not an example (i.e. an excuse) of why you "take the lane"?
The cyclist was riding in the 'door zone' of the parked vehicles. This led to the driver probably thinking it was safe to pass. Also, As has been noted by others, the driver could have been on the phone.
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Old 07-30-19, 06:47 AM
  #30  
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It's hard to tell exactly because of the angle, but I thought the lane position was fine - there is and was space to pass 'safely' within that lane, I it looked like the rider was just outside the door zone. I don't believe BC has a minimum passing distance - if the driver moved left and took the available space within the lane instead of continuing in the centre of the lane, everything is fine. The issue here is a bad driver who didn't react to the cyclist at all unless their reaction to the red light jump was to 'teach them a lesson' - we'll never know what the driver was thinking unless they make a crazy public statement.
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Old 07-30-19, 06:55 AM
  #31  
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Our society has helped people to become disconnected and isolated from their humanity. The speed of "efficiency", and cult of instant gratification makes obstacles and impediments out of human beings. Sad....
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Old 08-01-19, 08:21 PM
  #32  
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Scaaaary

The rider could have easily been crushed under the wheels of the car. I never take the lane when I would impede traffic at a walking speed, THAT will piss off motorists. I cringe when I see that bad form. I never jump the red when there are cars lined up behind me unless I know I can out pace them in an instant, just get over and chill for 10 seconds while they blast up to the next red. I have ridden various amounts in the following cities: Detroit, Flint, Ann Arbor, Grand Rapids, Columbus, San Francisco (I was a bike messenger there in 1988) and Chico. Many many others where I was just visiting or passing through. The driver is totally to blame and needs to be ticketed at the very least.
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Old 08-01-19, 08:46 PM
  #33  
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All this defense of the motorist. He hit a cyclist riding a very straight and predictable path. He altered his path zero when he had plenty of opportunity. In every place I have ever driven it was illegal to hit slower moving vehicles. No exceptions. Visibility here is excellent. You can argue the cyclist broke the law starting early but that also made him very visible.
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Old 08-02-19, 11:10 AM
  #34  
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The rider could have easily been crushed under the wheels of the car. I never take the lane when I would impede traffic at a walking speed, THAT will piss off motorists. I cringe when I see that bad form.
You can easily take the lane and pedal at a speed that does not impede traffic at an intersection. And when the lane after the intersection is a sub standard lane like in the video you can continue to take the portion of the lane that keeps motorists from pretending there is enough room and side swiping you like in the video. When I am in a motor vehicle I choose not to run over bicyclists who use bad form like the bicyclist in the video. I don't cringe. I wait or go around them when there is room or an opportunity.
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Old 08-02-19, 11:37 AM
  #35  
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Here's my take; if the cyclist wouldn't have run the red light he wouldn't have been hit by THAT car, plain and simple. Accident or on purpose, when you're swimming in the ocean with nothing but a pair of shorts, don't p*ss off the sharks.

There's no such thing as "started early", the cyclist ran the red light and put himself in a position to be struck by a car that would have been past him before he got to the other side of the intersection if he had obeyed the traffic signal. Anyone who sees the cyclist as a complete victim will probably get popped by a car too.

Last edited by nomadmax; 08-04-19 at 04:29 AM.
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Old 08-02-19, 01:04 PM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by Rick View Post
You can easily take the lane and pedal at a speed that does not impede traffic at an intersection. And when the lane after the intersection is a sub standard lane like in the video you can continue to take the portion of the lane that keeps motorists from pretending there is enough room and side swiping you like in the video. When I am in a motor vehicle I choose not to run over bicyclists who use bad form like the bicyclist in the video. I don't cringe. I wait or go around them when there is room or an opportunity.
I have seen bike riders holding up a line of cars two blocks long by taking the lane at a snail’s pace. You and I may not get upset over this, but most people would want revenge, sad but I honestly believe this. I don’t want to hear about the law and your rights as a road user, drivers are petty and will only think “they had it coming, they deserved it” when a cyclist get hit. Did you not ever read the comments section of those stories? A lot of the comments sections no longer exist due to hateful statements from the public.
Re video: waiting for cars to go ahead of you only takes a few seconds, I give motorists the same courtesy I expect from them. I n doing so I control the situation versus trusting someone to be a good driver. Had the rider in the video done this we wouldn’t be having this conversation.
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Old 08-02-19, 06:05 PM
  #37  
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Originally Posted by venturi95 View Post
I have seen bike riders holding up a line of cars two blocks long by taking the lane at a snail’s pace.
I hear about this on bike forums, but I've never seen it myself. And that isn't the situation in the case under discussion.

Originally Posted by venturi95 View Post
Re video: waiting for cars to go ahead of you only takes a few seconds, I give motorists the same courtesy I expect from them. I n doing so I control the situation versus trusting someone to be a good driver. Had the rider in the video done this we wouldn’t be having this conversation.
It only takes a second to let one car go first, but in urban traffic there are a lot of cars. Do you let them all go in front of you? You might be there for a while.

I'm in the center of the lane at most all intersections. Safest place to be.
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Old 08-02-19, 06:12 PM
  #38  
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Don't run or jump red lights. It's a bad habit, doesn't really save you any time, and gives you bad karma (i.e. makes you a victim of "street justice".) Like most bad habits, you can break yourself of it and be happier for having done so. You just have to check your entitlement at the door. Besides, how do you know (every single time) someone isn't running the just-changed red in the other direction and won't T-bone you at high speed?
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Old 08-02-19, 09:10 PM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by jon c. View Post
I hear about this on bike forums, but I've never seen it myself. And that isn't the situation in the case under discussion.



It only takes a second to let one car go first, but in urban traffic there are a lot of cars. Do you let them all go in front of you? You might be there for a while.

I'm in the center of the lane at most all intersections. Safest place to be.
It all depends on the characteristics of the street and the traffic.

In one situation, I cross the intersection just on the outside of the pedestrian crosswalk. Then I check how long the motorized traffic is behind me before I merge. When the lights turn red and there are no red-light runners, I merge and proceed. It's less than a 30s wait anyways.

In another road, at 4pm I'm riding on the Diamond lane. That's the fastest lane and there are cars driving behind me as I take the lane. They don't honk or push me because they are already faster than the other lanes and if I'm not there, they won't be going that far before stopping anyways.

The third situation is that all the lanes are so jammed, I simply filter through the traffic in between the two lanes.

Last edited by Daniel4; 08-03-19 at 06:41 PM.
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Old 08-02-19, 10:02 PM
  #40  
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Originally Posted by jon c. View Post
I hear about this on bike forums, but I've never seen it myself. And that isn't the situation in the case under discussion.



It only takes a second to let one car go first, but in urban traffic there are a lot of cars. Do you let them all go in front of you? You might be there for a while.

I'm in the center of the lane at most all intersections. Safest place to be.
It depends, there is no blanket statement for every traffic situation. If we are all headed to another long red light, I most definitely just wait. Why get passed by stressed out and frustrated drivers when we are all headed to the same place (a good metaphor for existence?). Like I said, waiting gives you some control. Is the road ahead going to invite close passes with me struggling to achieve 20 m.p.h.? I'll wait. Heavy traffic with no hope of those cars passing me? I'm outta there, gone Daddy-O.
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Old 08-04-19, 01:27 AM
  #41  
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Originally Posted by conspiratemus1 View Post
Don't run or jump red lights. It's a bad habit, doesn't really save you any time, and gives you bad karma (i.e. makes you a victim of "street justice".) Like most bad habits, you can break yourself of it and be happier for having done so. You just have to check your entitlement at the door. Besides, how do you know (every single time) someone isn't running the just-changed red in the other direction and won't T-bone you at high speed?
I smirk in your general direction ...
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Old 08-04-19, 01:56 AM
  #42  
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most of the comments i see on non-bike forums by four wheel drivers are negative towards cyclist. fact. which reflects on these drivers' thinking and actions. i'm wary of every car i see coming up behind me. i (try to) keep an eye out for all of them with my take-a-look mirror on my glasses and can see their lane position in relation to my line. i also ride where it's not isolated and there are witnesses so as to try and not let anyone get away with anything.
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Old 08-04-19, 07:54 AM
  #43  
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Originally Posted by gios View Post
most of the comments i see on non-bike forums by four wheel drivers are negative towards cyclist. fact. which reflects on these drivers' thinking and actions. i'm wary of every car i see coming up behind me. i (try to) keep an eye out for all of them with my take-a-look mirror on my glasses and can see their lane position in relation to my line. i also ride where it's not isolated and there are witnesses so as to try and not let anyone get away with anything.
'Try' being the operative word because, trust me, if someone wants to 'get away with something' in a 5,856 lb. Escalade and what you are driving is a 20 lb. Trek Domane ... ...
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Old 08-04-19, 08:02 AM
  #44  
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I'm just saying ... I ride with a mirror, and like it just as much (maybe more) as anyone can like anything useful in their lives. Still, let's not get crazy. I defy anyone to prove, by using a mirror, that the fast approaching Miata in the rearview will slice past with 5" clearance or instead will impact the left handlebar causing a loss of control and fall. Bonus points if you can predict that the impact point will actually be your left knee requiring a BKA. SMH.
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Old 08-04-19, 08:45 AM
  #45  
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Originally Posted by gios View Post
most of the comments i see on non-bike forums by four wheel drivers are negative towards cyclist. fact. which reflects on these drivers' thinking and actions. i'm wary of every car i see coming up behind me. i (try to) keep an eye out for all of them with my take-a-look mirror on my glasses and can see their lane position in relation to my line. i also ride where it's not isolated and there are witnesses so as to try and not let anyone get away with anything.
Although these reports and studies are pretty old now, they indicate that drivers loathe other bad drivers a lot more than any cyclist. But I doubt any driver in those forums will ever acknowledge that they are their own worse experiences.

In this survey, cyclists are listed 19th out of the 20 top gripes.

http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/2...WantsFull=true


Expedia Road Rage Report 2015


"Fifty-one percent of Americans report that they loathe sharing the road with bad drivers, more than cyclists, buses, taxis, joggers and walkers combined. Nearly all Americans (97%) rate themselves as “careful” drivers, but feel that only 29% of fellow drivers merit the description."

viewfinder.expedia.com/news/expedia-2015-road-rage-report-texters-enrage-fellow-drivers-most-edging-tailgaters-and-left-lane-hogs-on-list-of-most-deplorable-driver-behaviors/amp/
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Old 08-04-19, 12:57 PM
  #46  
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Originally Posted by Leisesturm View Post
I smirk in your general direction ...

Smirk all you like. I don't need your approval.
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Old 08-05-19, 12:21 AM
  #47  
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Originally Posted by conspiratemus1 View Post
Smirk all you like. I don't need your approval.
You must, because you didn't mince words in that post I responded to. English is my first and only language. I read and speak it well.
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Old 08-05-19, 12:58 AM
  #48  
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Originally Posted by venturi95 View Post
It depends, there is no blanket statement for every traffic situation. If we are all headed to another long red light, I most definitely just wait. Why get passed by stressed out and frustrated drivers when we are all headed to the same place (a good metaphor for existence?). Like I said, waiting gives you some control. Is the road ahead going to invite close passes with me struggling to achieve 20 m.p.h.? I'll wait. Heavy traffic with no hope of those cars passing me? I'm outta there, gone Daddy-O.
You can always use the crosswalk button...
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Old 08-05-19, 04:07 AM
  #49  
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Originally Posted by Rollfast View Post
You can always use the crosswalk button...
Sure. There's that option. Although, perhaps, for some, it still feels safer and better to wait at the light, if using the crosswalk has several drivers making a right turn while the pedestrian/cyclists is attempting to cross at the crosswalk, not allowing them to cross or finish crossing in front at the other corner (because in some areas, even when the crosswalk is lit for those using the crosswalk, some drivers don't notice or don't care if someone is crossing, in the limited amount of time the crossing traffic light allows; they feel their right to make a right turn on "red" takes precedence over those using the crosswalk).

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Old 08-05-19, 11:45 AM
  #50  
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Originally Posted by Rollfast View Post
You can always use the crosswalk button...
Pedestrian deaths are higher than bicycle deaths. Sure, motorists blame texting but there's a spike for people over fifty who take longer to cross intersections.
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