Alloy lugged , Carbon, mystery frame
#1
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Alloy lugged , Carbon, mystery frame
Spotted this up for auction here in NZ .
anyone recognise the frame ? Japanese ? Apparently ?
Appears to be riveted on down tube which may not be a good thing ?
Any thoughts folks ?
anyone recognise the frame ? Japanese ? Apparently ?
Appears to be riveted on down tube which may not be a good thing ?
Any thoughts folks ?
#2
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Can't help with the identification, but I like it. A lot.
#4
Barred @ Velocipedesalon
Carbon frame w/Alloy lugs
I've not seen that frame before; nor heard of DURA ALL brand(?) before. I can see the rivets at the head tube top and bottom lug connections and at the BB-DT connection. Odd, I guess. I 've got a couple ALAN frames (alloy not the carbonio, although very similar) that have similar characteristics of this frame especially at the seat stays, but no rivets (and no separation of the tubing/lug connections). I have a Vitus/Payan that does not appear to "hold" together as well, glued only, and it shows the excess glue resin where tubing and lug didn't fit perfectly (I don't know if this is common), or was repaired. Still no rivets on either style frame; nor on the Colnago Carbitubo which is also lugged without rivets. I'm curious if they are from the factory or added due to repairing or as a precaution. The frame looks great so it seems it would be factory installed. Do you know the year, approximately? I believe that Specialized had no rivets on their carbon/alloy lugged frames so probably not the same manufacturing plant. I couldn't find another photo of one in a basic search. Good luck, you've got me wondering now!
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Never seen this one before......
The design of the frame look European but its not a Vitus, ALAN, or TVT....
The design of the frame look European but its not a Vitus, ALAN, or TVT....
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72 Line Seeker
83 Davidson Signature
84 Peugeot PSV
84 Peugeot PY10FC
84 Gitane Tour de France.
85 Vitus Plus Carbone 7
86 ALAN Record Carbonio
86 Medici Aerodynamic (Project)
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89 Bottecchia Professional Chorus SL
95 Trek 5500 OCLV (Project)
#6
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A few of these have surfaced in the past. I don't know the manufacturer but the lugs appears to be an excellent match for the aluminum Corsa model offered by Performance Bicycle Shop in the late 1980s under their eponymous brand. Literature mentions the rivet at each joint to back up the adhesive bonding, so I strongly suspect this is the same frame but with carbon fibre main tubes. The Performance Corsa was sourced from Japan. The serial number may allow us to determine the year and possibly the manufacturer.
Last edited by T-Mar; 04-22-19 at 07:43 AM.
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Oxy/propane at work, very cool.
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The Centurion Ironman Carbon were quite different, employing a different lugset and carbon tubes for both the chain stays and the wishbone style seat stays.
#11
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#12
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SR's bonded aluminum frame was the Litage, which was also marketed under the Prism brand. They were quite different from this frame. Externally, the lugs appeared very short but they had long internal sleeves and the adhesive was injected after assembly. The seat stays were dual wishbone style and bolted to the seat lug and dropouts. I recall them being very late 1980s.
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I'm wondering if the Performace decals were replaced by altered Shimano "Dura Ace" decals....
Maybe the previous owner wanted it to be something else other than a PBS bike??
Maybe the previous owner wanted it to be something else other than a PBS bike??
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Agree with T-Mar that the OP's frame is not at all similar to the SR Litage.
@Brewsmith started a topic about those frames, although his images seem to have disappeared.
There's a picture from @1simplexnut remaining:
I've got one in the shed waiting to get sold, but no pics on hand.
@Brewsmith started a topic about those frames, although his images seem to have disappeared.
There's a picture from @1simplexnut remaining:
I've got one in the shed waiting to get sold, but no pics on hand.
SR's bonded aluminum frame was the Litage, which was also marketed under the Prism brand. They were quite different from this frame. Externally, the lugs appeared very short but they had long internal sleeves and the adhesive was injected after assembly. The seat stays were dual wishbone style and bolted to the seat lug and dropouts. I recall them being very late 1980s.
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SR's bonded aluminum frame was the Litage, which was also marketed under the Prism brand. They were quite different from this frame. Externally, the lugs appeared very short but they had long internal sleeves and the adhesive was injected after assembly. The seat stays were dual wishbone style and bolted to the seat lug and dropouts. I recall them being very late 1980s.
#16
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As I stated earlier, I've seen these surface on the forum in the past, so it would appear to be a legitimate brand.
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Marketing budget must have been non-existently small..
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Admittedly, initially it doesn't sound very creative or appealing to Anglophones but I suspect the brand name goes back to the aluminum tubed version and may be a based on the duraluminum alloy used in the construction (i.e. DURA ALL = DURAluminum ALLoy). With this in mind, it sounds better pronouncing it with a short "a" as in alloy, rather than the "awl" pronounciation. Also, if the brand is Japanese, it may make more sense in the Japanese market., as they are not thinking of "all" in the context of English definition.
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I recently purchased a Dura All bike with complete Shimano 600 EX Groupset. It's a really nice bike and looks a lot like a Vitus. Theres a sticker that says Light Alloy Nakagawa and Japan. From what I can find, it looks like Nakagawa is (was?) a famous road bike brand in Japan. They might have made bikes for several different brands including Panasonic, Centurion, and Nishiki.
The bike I purchased looks just like this one without the Panasonic stickers. I'll take some pictures when I get it cleaned up.
The bike I purchased looks just like this one without the Panasonic stickers. I'll take some pictures when I get it cleaned up.
Last edited by Archangel1183; 05-11-19 at 12:40 AM.
#21
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A few of these have surfaced in the past. I don't know the manufacturer but the lugs appears to be an excellent match for the aluminum Corsa model offered by Performance Bicycle Shop in the late 1980s under their eponymous brand. Literature mentions the rivet at each joint to back up the adhesive bonding, so I strongly suspect this is the same frame but with carbon fibre main tubes. The Performance Corsa was sourced from Japan. The serial number may allow us to determine the year and possibly the manufacturer.
The one I have is mostly suntour components with a Campy headset and a modern wheelset. I'll post up some photos once I get in my required 10 posts and get the permissions to do photos and links.
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I just came across a very similar bike to that "Performance" brand bike one that you posted a photo of. Based on the grouppo installed, I think that the one that I havce is few years older. I can't find much, if anything, about the Performance brand. You had mentioned some literature. Do you still have access to any links or other info about these bikes?
The one I have is mostly suntour components with a Campy headset and a modern wheelset. I'll post up some photos once I get in my required 10 posts and get the permissions to do photos and links.
The one I have is mostly suntour components with a Campy headset and a modern wheelset. I'll post up some photos once I get in my required 10 posts and get the permissions to do photos and links.
Performance was the house brand of Performance Bicycle Shop, a shop and mail order business located in Chapel Hill, North Carolina. Circa 1982 they started offering frames and bicycles under their eponymous branding, in addition to various other cycling products and accessories. The frames and bicycles were contract manufactured by a wide variety of sources over the years. I forget the exact year but sometime in the early 1990s they even supplied the road bicycles to the USA National Team.
Higher end models were typically offered as both frames and built with a wide variety of groups. Consequently, it's possible that your bicycle was ordered as a frame and assembled with components taken from an older, donor bicycle. We may be able to determine the year from the serial number. You don't need 10 posts to submit photos. They won't insert in this thread but they will be deposited in a gallery album where members can view them.
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#23
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#24
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Lots of nice info and detective work.
Q: How long was kevlar used in the CF layup ?
Q: How long was kevlar used in the CF layup ?
#25
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My understanding is that they had to put Kevlar between the carbon and aluminum to prevent corrosion of the aluminum. Calfee used to do repairs, still does?, and had info on their site about it. Haven't looked in a while.