Ferrouscious 

My current freewheel, a Suntour Alpha 7-speed (13-30), is nearing the end of its life. I've had many issues with it over the past year, but now the thing is getting really needy. Issues I face include a stuck on 13T sprocket, slightly loose splined sprockets, chronic pawl chipping, pitted bearing races, and a locknut that won't stay tight for more than 200 miles. That's two weeks for me. Before you recommend a full disassembly, I want to get out of the way that I service my freewheels just like @pastorbobnlnh does. I use new bearings and grease the races. Park grease on the races and SRAM Butter on the pawls (used sparingly). The freewheel still rumbles after all the above service is completed.

I am now looking at a new freewheel. I run a very gear-phreaked setup, so my gearing choices are limited. I have a Suntour Perfect 5-speed with most of the sprockets I want. I would be acquiring a 6 speed non-Ultra body and a 15T sprocket. The other option is a Shimano 6-speed MF-Z012 freewheel in the same gearing. Both are about the same price. I was wondering which would perform better in a variety of ways. Here's my knowledge base ATM:

Perfect:
+Personal spare sprockets and parts
+easy to find
+better internals supposedly
+may have offset pawls for more engagement points
+great sound

-known to assplode unless red loctite'd and adjusted perfectly (locking cone comes loose and bearings spill out)
-inferior removal design (never had an issue though)
-minimally shaped teeth (I did a ride yesterday with a Perfect to see how well it would work, seemed fine)
-14T min (not really an issue though)

Shimano MF-Z012:
+tooth shaping
+better removal design, more common too
+reasonably easy to find
+known reliability (I have one on the commuter/beater, never any issues)
+13T compatible (not necessary)

-sounds cheap (when freewheeling)
-supposedly worse internals
-difficult? to find 15T
-supposedly faster wearing sprockets

Which would you choose?
* I will NOT use a modern freewheel. They ghost shift too much and look trashy.

I am ISO a 6 speed non-Ultra Perfect in sprocket combo 14-15-17-20-24-28. PM me please if you have one. (I found one on eBay, but it seems a bit questionable and I trust a forum member more than some blurry picture on eBay)

Fahrenheit531 

Suntour is my choice. No idea where you got those "downsides" to the Perfect freewheel. Known to blow up without loctite and... huh?

Note: If you need it rebuilt better than new, look up Pastor Bob.

tkamd73 

The Shimano. Cheap, reliable, very easy to find, and it will shift better. Have replaced all my freewheels, and gone the MF-Z012 route, even the Regina and Suntour ones. Big improvement, and so cheap, almost not even worth the time to clean them. Actually, found a few of the older ones in silver, without the Shimano lettering on the big cog, so not really noticeable on the Bianchi and TX900.
Tim

francophile 

Did I miss something, or why not just go out and get a Suntour Pro Compe or New Winner? I've got a couple new in box or near-new, I absolutely love them. I keep half a dozen or so in my bins for mixing and matching cogs, they support a variety of cog sizing. All the luxury and quality you would want with the flexibility you need.

seypat

If you have room for a non Ultra 6, how about an Ultra 7?

Ferrouscious 

That would fit as well. I currently am using a 7-speed freewheel. Is it possible to build a 7-speed Perfect?

A Pro Compe would work as well. I mention the Perfect because they are easy to find and I have sprockets that match. I don't have the lockring tool for New Winners, so those are less desirable for me. I want to be able to service the internals if I need to.

Sheldon Brown talks about Perfects coming apart on his website. He has had (as have I and others too) the locking cone/nameplate come loose and spill out the bearings. In the middle of winter, I had to limp home with 15 balls total left. I've been a bit wary ever since.

I believe you are talking about the MF-TZ21 (Tourney). The Z012 is an older model freewheel from the same time that the last gen of 600 (6200) came out. It's a Uniglide style (twist tooth) freewheel with full height teeth.

top506

Contact Pastor Bob. He has assisted/enabled a couple of custom freewheel with me and should be able to help you out.

Top

Ferrouscious 

In progress...

gugie 

The perfect freewheel is a cassette.

John E

On "why not ultra-7 if standard-6 works":

Mixed results in my case, very hub-dependent and freewheel-dependent. (Of course, one can usually play with spacers and washers to make it work.)

79pmooney

Ummm, maybe, I loved as a racer that I could just unscrew a FW and screw on another for a specific race. No messing with cogs and spacers. Only small, easy to lose item was the remover. (Raced and trained on two 13-19 Winner FWs on my two wheelsets, used a 13-17 for criteriums, a 14-23 Perfect for the Stowe, VT race and a 13-21 for Mt Washington. (The Perfect with no 13 tooth was because at the time we didn't have a Winner 23 on the board at the shop I worked at. Gambled that lacking a 13 would hurt me less than the damage I could inflict with the 23 when everyone else was riding 24s. Worked out so well I used it again the next year. Also 14, 15, 17 was a better sequence than 13, 15, 17. All my favorite FWs and cassettes have had those cogs over the past 40 years.)

I don't think I ever had an issue with the SunTour removers. Always used the QR. Always greased the threads.

And yes, I did have a couple come apart after opening them up and repacking. Just oiled them after those. (Didn't know about Locktite Red yet.)

Ben

gugie 

Sure, but I can unscrew a cassette and throw a new one on just as quickly, so that's a wash, at best. Ben, you're one of those skinny guys that probably have never bent or broken a rear axle, but I have in the past, but never on a freehub design. Outboard hub bearings are a superior design. Adding more cogs to a frewheel pushes the drive side bearings further inward relative to the wider dropout width, exacerbating the axle issue. More cogs in the back = closer spacing, which has made the triple crank start heading towards the path of extinction.

The biggest issue, however, is the overwhelming greater availability of cassettes and freehubs over freewheels. I consider both to be consumables. IRD just came out with a newer freewheel for sale, but the quality is nowhere near what I can get on a freehub/cassette. SunTour, Shimano, and Regina freewheels aren't being made anymore.

I leave freewheels for the two bikes I have that are intended for Eroica type ride use, where period correctness and dressing up in costume is a big part of the ride.

crank_addict

Friction or index man?

If index; Campy, Shimano, Suntour Accushift???

Meh, screw it.... just get a Sachs - ARIS on fleabay.

dddd

I assumed friction, since the OP did mention unannounced ghost shifting, and what I never liked about friction shifting a Hyperglide freewheel or cassette.

This particular issue of shifting sensitivity (toward larger cogs) and with gear hunting can be greatly helped by using older SACHS and SRAM chains that were made to be Hyperglide compatible yet which still didn't feature any bulging of the sideplates. Starting in the mid-2000's, SRAM began using bulged sideplates on all of their chains, but the older ones still turn up (and are much quieter than the yet-older Sedisport chain when cross-chaining or when shifting under load.

I like the Suntour Alpha 13-30t 7s freewheel for it's durability and range, plus it shifts (friction or index) really well with Shimano 9s chain.
These seem not hard to find.

canklecat

I have a couple of 7-speed Suntour freewheels -- 13-24 off my Ironman, and a 13-26 I got a couplafew months ago -- that I'm not using. Probably won't use 'em again. Both are in very good shape.

After trying the SunRace chromed 13-25 MFR30 and 13-28 MFM30 freewheels, the Suntour feel crude in comparison. Those particular SunRace freewheels shift more crisply and run more quietly. And they run just fine with my Suntour or Shimano rear derailleurs. I mostly use the SunRace 13-25 and 13-28 on the Ironman with Suntour GPX group, depending on whether I'm running a 50/39 or 50/38 chainring combo, which varies according to the terrain I expect on half-centuries and longer rides.

With Accushift it was impossible to get crisp shifting and quiet running across all 7 cogs. There was always one or two cogs slightly off. And the GPX friction mode is not good. Too much ghost shifting or I'd need to crank down the tension so much it lost any smooth feel. No problems with the SunRace. Everything snicks into place, no ker-chunking sounds.

And my '93 Trek 5900 has a wheelset off another Ironman, Wolber rims with Shimano 600 hubs and Shimano 7-speed 14-28 freewheel. Works for me with either the original Dura Ace downtube shifters or, now, MicroShift brifters and Shimano rear derailleurs (I've switched between 600 Tricolor short cage and Deore LX long cage this year). No problems with the Shimano MF-TZ21 freewheel.

Andy_K 

I don't know how you can argue that Perfect isn't perfect. I mean, it's right there in the name.

smontanaro 

FWIW, IRD just released their new Cyclone freewheels. They have 13-28 and 13-32 versions in seven speed configuration:

https://store.interlocracing.com/irdcyma1fr5.html

Not C&V, but they claim that the Cyclone is improved over their earlier offerings:

https://www.interlocracing.com/casse...eels-567-speed

I don't think they've been out long enough to garner very many independent reviews. Still, might be worth consideration. (I'm thinking of getting one for a townie Dawes I'm building.)

Ferrouscious 

I don't like the "improved" shifting of ANY modern freewheels; I get too much ghost shifting with my flexible frame. They also don't have the sprockets I need.

ThermionicScott 

I don't see any shifting ramps when I zoom in on the new IRD freewheel. I consider that a regression, but it might work better for you.

conspiratemus1

This is to amplify the PM conversation we've been having. I don't know enough about Suntour to know if the "AP" freewheel I mentioned to you is similar enough to be compatible with what you have/want. Hence these photos showing the body and the three spline patterns on the sprockets (plus the threaded top sprocket (not shown) which serves as the lockring to hold everything together.