Choosing a sleeping pad
#1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 74
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 14 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Choosing a sleeping pad
I plan on doing a 2-3 month self contained tour from Maine to Florida in the Fall. Trying to choose the most appropriate sleeping pad. Am thinking that an insulated pad will be needed for the first half, since the night temperatures will dip much lower than down south. I own two sleeping bags I can use. One is synthetic and rated to 20 degrees. The second is down and rated to 30 degrees.
My priority, after comfort, is the smallest packing space. I already have an older self-inflating therm-a-rest, but it only packs down to about 14" x 10", is nearly 3lbs and takes up a lot of space in the pannier. I would like the weight of the new pad to be no more than 2lbs, plus it needs to be wide.
My question is, can the sleeping bag make up for a lower R rated pad? Would appreciate input from experienced riders who traveled through different temperature zones.
My priority, after comfort, is the smallest packing space. I already have an older self-inflating therm-a-rest, but it only packs down to about 14" x 10", is nearly 3lbs and takes up a lot of space in the pannier. I would like the weight of the new pad to be no more than 2lbs, plus it needs to be wide.
My question is, can the sleeping bag make up for a lower R rated pad? Would appreciate input from experienced riders who traveled through different temperature zones.
#2
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Maine, USA
Posts: 1,612
Bikes: Corvid Sojourner, Surly Ice Cream Truck, Co-Motion Divide, Co-Motion Java Tandem, Salsa Warbird, Salsa Beargrease, Carver Tandem
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 534 Post(s)
Liked 435 Times
in
227 Posts
I think a sleeping bag could not make up for lower R rated pad because the insulation beneath you gets flattened and rendered useless.
FWIW, I have Nemo Cosmo insulated pad that is 20" wide and it has a built in foot pump - and I like it very much.
I'd be interested at mini reviews from others on their pads.
FWIW, I have Nemo Cosmo insulated pad that is 20" wide and it has a built in foot pump - and I like it very much.
I'd be interested at mini reviews from others on their pads.
Last edited by PedalingWalrus; 07-03-18 at 08:13 AM.
#3
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 39,246
Mentioned: 211 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 18420 Post(s)
Liked 15,564 Times
in
7,333 Posts
https://www.rei.com/product/135411/s...d-sleeping-pad
Been digging this since I got it last year. Easy to inflate, deflate, fine tune firmness and pack up. Not sure why they added an integrated "pump" to the stuff sack. I don't have the greatest lung capacity and I can get it nearly full with ten deep breaths. I have used it in temps down into the upper 30s with a bag having an EN comfort rating of 35 with no problems.
Been digging this since I got it last year. Easy to inflate, deflate, fine tune firmness and pack up. Not sure why they added an integrated "pump" to the stuff sack. I don't have the greatest lung capacity and I can get it nearly full with ten deep breaths. I have used it in temps down into the upper 30s with a bag having an EN comfort rating of 35 with no problems.
#4
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Maine, USA
Posts: 1,612
Bikes: Corvid Sojourner, Surly Ice Cream Truck, Co-Motion Divide, Co-Motion Java Tandem, Salsa Warbird, Salsa Beargrease, Carver Tandem
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 534 Post(s)
Liked 435 Times
in
227 Posts
From my observation, the insulated pad starts to make tangible difference only when the temperatures dip below freezing.
#5
Banned
Air mattresses with insulation in them , win for packed size , the open cell foam are popular
down filled air mattresses, more money.
down filled air mattresses, more money.
#6
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: northern Deep South
Posts: 8,904
Bikes: Fuji Touring, Novara Randonee
Mentioned: 36 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2604 Post(s)
Liked 1,933 Times
in
1,213 Posts
As for sleeping bags, depends exactly when in "fall" you're planning to start. September in, say, Vermont? 30F. Maine in October? 20 degrees. As you note, it'll get warmer heading south as it gets cooler heading toward winter. With a little luck the two will balance out.
#7
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Middle of the desert
Posts: 542
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 136 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
No substitute for R value. Do you have anywhere you could ship to halfway and then ship the insulated pad back?
#8
Senior Member
You could take a lightweight sleeping pad and a light foam pad that goes under it. More bulk, not much more weight and the increase in R-value would be quite significant
#9
Lentement mais sűrement
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Montréal
Posts: 2,253
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 78 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 4 Times
in
3 Posts
No. Get a pad with an R rating of ~3 or more.
Check these out:
SynMat HL MW | Exped USA They also have a long/wide
https://www.thermarest.com/neoair-xlite See the long/wide.
https://www.klymit.com/sleeping-pads...ping-pads.html
Check these out:
SynMat HL MW | Exped USA They also have a long/wide
https://www.thermarest.com/neoair-xlite See the long/wide.
https://www.klymit.com/sleeping-pads...ping-pads.html
#10
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Left Coast, Canada
Posts: 5,126
Mentioned: 24 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2236 Post(s)
Liked 1,314 Times
in
707 Posts
I currently have a Thermarest Scout which is a good compromise between price and comfort. I bought it for $60 CAD. Good insulation (R 3.4) and packs down to about 5.5X11" and about 1lb's. I put it between my aerobars but It will fit in a Salsa anything type fork cage or similar space. Full length mummy shape.
I spent a bit of time comparing it in store to other inflatables and many did not have that big a savings in size or weight until spending at least $150-200. Maybe one day but at the time that was too rich for me.
I spent a bit of time comparing it in store to other inflatables and many did not have that big a savings in size or weight until spending at least $150-200. Maybe one day but at the time that was too rich for me.
Last edited by Happy Feet; 07-08-18 at 09:45 AM.
#11
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Madison, WI
Posts: 11,208
Bikes: 1961 Ideor, 1966 Perfekt 3 Speed AB Hub, 1994 Bridgestone MB-6, 2006 Airnimal Joey, 2009 Thorn Sherpa, 2013 Thorn Nomad MkII, 2015 VO Pass Hunter, 2017 Lynskey Backroad, 2017 Raleigh Gran Prix, 1980s Bianchi Mixte on a trainer. Others are now gone.
Mentioned: 48 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3461 Post(s)
Liked 1,467 Times
in
1,144 Posts
I have a couple of different air mattresses and also some older Thermarest self inflating pads.
I have never felt that my air mattresses caused me to suffer due to lack of insulation. Have used them in sub-freezing temperatures when my 40 degree rated down bag was just barely enough. I also use a sleeping bag liner, not so much for extra thermal rating but more to keep my sleeping bag clean if I was grungy. A sleeping bag liner launders easily. But who knows, maybe the liner helped for temperature. My favorite air mattress is an older version of the REI Flash, however REI has re-designed the Flash and I have not tried the newer model. The older Flash model that I use is quick to inflate and deflate, air mattresses with small valves take more time and effort.
I exclusively use air mattresses for bike trips because they pack so tiny and fit well in a pannier. But backpacking and canoeing I use the self inflating pads because volume was not as critical. Backpacking, I strap it outside the backpack, canoeing I carry a bigger pack that has plenty of volume capacity.
I have never felt that my air mattresses caused me to suffer due to lack of insulation. Have used them in sub-freezing temperatures when my 40 degree rated down bag was just barely enough. I also use a sleeping bag liner, not so much for extra thermal rating but more to keep my sleeping bag clean if I was grungy. A sleeping bag liner launders easily. But who knows, maybe the liner helped for temperature. My favorite air mattress is an older version of the REI Flash, however REI has re-designed the Flash and I have not tried the newer model. The older Flash model that I use is quick to inflate and deflate, air mattresses with small valves take more time and effort.
I exclusively use air mattresses for bike trips because they pack so tiny and fit well in a pannier. But backpacking and canoeing I use the self inflating pads because volume was not as critical. Backpacking, I strap it outside the backpack, canoeing I carry a bigger pack that has plenty of volume capacity.
#12
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 74
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 14 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Thanks for contributing your experiences and thoughts. I've made some eliminations and narrowed down some of the choices.
#14
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Maine, USA
Posts: 1,612
Bikes: Corvid Sojourner, Surly Ice Cream Truck, Co-Motion Divide, Co-Motion Java Tandem, Salsa Warbird, Salsa Beargrease, Carver Tandem
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 534 Post(s)
Liked 435 Times
in
227 Posts
What do You mean by that? AFAIK survival sleeping is on your belly with your arms in fronnt to elevate your body from the cold ground and hands on your crotch where the heat is.
#15
Senior Member
The Neo Airs are the gold standard among UL backpacker's (and pack size is highly correlated with weight) - go with the X-Therm if you are worried about it, but I'd personally choose the 3/4 length X-Lite for that trip - it's about the size of a beer can with R of 3.2. Assuming same high/low temps, the ground in the fall will considerably warmer than ground in the spring. I tend to find a bag can make up for the pad somewhat, and for me, side sleeping relies more on bag, while back relies more on pad.
#16
Senior Member
I have the original Neo Air that I think I just wore out, so I've been looking at what's available these days. The Neo Air X-Lite seems to offer the best combo of r-value and weight for a 3-season pad compared to Big Agnes, Exped, Sea to Summit, Klymit, and a couple of others I can't remember. They are noisy though. Some people hate the noise. I don't mind it.
#17
Junior Member
Join Date: Jun 2018
Posts: 20
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
#19
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Madison, WI
Posts: 11,208
Bikes: 1961 Ideor, 1966 Perfekt 3 Speed AB Hub, 1994 Bridgestone MB-6, 2006 Airnimal Joey, 2009 Thorn Sherpa, 2013 Thorn Nomad MkII, 2015 VO Pass Hunter, 2017 Lynskey Backroad, 2017 Raleigh Gran Prix, 1980s Bianchi Mixte on a trainer. Others are now gone.
Mentioned: 48 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3461 Post(s)
Liked 1,467 Times
in
1,144 Posts
I should have mentioned this earlier but did not think of it. Air mattresses, they usually are a couple inches thick. All of my air mattresses are full length.
But self inflating pads that are an inch or less thick, all of my self inflating pads are the shorty length. On soft soil, I do not need a lot of padding under my knees or feet. If the ground is hard, I throw some clothes under my bag down at knee and feet level for a bit more padding.
The thicker your pad or mat is, the more important that it be full length so you do not feel like your lower third has fallen off a cliff.
But self inflating pads that are an inch or less thick, all of my self inflating pads are the shorty length. On soft soil, I do not need a lot of padding under my knees or feet. If the ground is hard, I throw some clothes under my bag down at knee and feet level for a bit more padding.
The thicker your pad or mat is, the more important that it be full length so you do not feel like your lower third has fallen off a cliff.
#20
Senior Member
^^ Just for a different perspective, I use a 2.5" NeoAir Xlite air mattress and prefer the 3/4 length. The spacing for the 1/4 footpad gives me a perfect place to store/multi-task soft bulky extra gear (i.e., clothing stuffed inside my backpack/pannier) inside my solo tent.
#21
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Madison, WI
Posts: 11,208
Bikes: 1961 Ideor, 1966 Perfekt 3 Speed AB Hub, 1994 Bridgestone MB-6, 2006 Airnimal Joey, 2009 Thorn Sherpa, 2013 Thorn Nomad MkII, 2015 VO Pass Hunter, 2017 Lynskey Backroad, 2017 Raleigh Gran Prix, 1980s Bianchi Mixte on a trainer. Others are now gone.
Mentioned: 48 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3461 Post(s)
Liked 1,467 Times
in
1,144 Posts
^^ Just for a different perspective, I use a 2.5" NeoAir Xlite air mattress and prefer the 3/4 length. The spacing for the 1/4 footpad gives me a perfect place to store/multi-task soft bulky extra gear (i.e., clothing stuffed inside my backpack/pannier) inside my solo tent.
I think my Xlite is the regular size, but as I noted above I usually use the older (green color) REI Flash air mattress.
#22
Senior Member
I’ve been very happy with my Klymit pad. They’re light and pack small, have good reviews, and are cheaper than the commonly talked about top of the line stuff. My insulated pad is the Static V light insulated. They make wide and long versions of some of their pads too. Other than their inability to spell/lame marketing attempts, I highly recommend one.
https://www.amazon.com/Klymit-Insula...pgL&ref=plSrch
https://www.amazon.com/Klymit-Insula...pgL&ref=plSrch
#23
Senior Member
I love my Neo Air X-Lite and have used it for a broad range of conditions. I found it fine even for cold nights in winter on the ST or cold spring and Fall nights elsewhere.
The thing is that despite temps at least as low as 18 F, the daytime highs were always at least in the 50s. Why does that matter? Because the ground was still unfrozen when I set up camp for the night. So while the air dipped into the teens, the ground under me didn't freeze.
For real winter camping with hard frozen ground with low air temps, I still use the Neo Air X-Lite, but add a Thermarest Z Lite under it.
For your route I think I'd just use the NeoAir xLite.
The thing is that despite temps at least as low as 18 F, the daytime highs were always at least in the 50s. Why does that matter? Because the ground was still unfrozen when I set up camp for the night. So while the air dipped into the teens, the ground under me didn't freeze.
For real winter camping with hard frozen ground with low air temps, I still use the Neo Air X-Lite, but add a Thermarest Z Lite under it.
For your route I think I'd just use the NeoAir xLite.
#24
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 254
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 92 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times
in
2 Posts
The Neo Air is the Benchmark for sure. It costs around $170 though for the Regular I believe . If you are on a budget but still want excellent UL gear, try..................
1) Outdoorsman Lab UL air mattress. I belive the R value is rated at around 2. So not quite the Neo but close. Around $40
2) Aegismax Outdoor UL goosedown sleeping bag (800 Fill..Lower Limit 40F/Extreme 15F). You can unzip with the zipper facing the ground, tuck the foot end of you air mattress into the bottom of the bag and use the upper 2/3's of the bag as a quilt. Around $75
3) Trekology Inflatable Pillow. Inflate for comfort. Around $15
4) I also cannot afford a Zpacks Cuban Fiber tent so I went with a 3F UL Lanshan 2 tent. I only needed to seam seal the tie outs from the A-frame sides of the tent and it has been stellar. It weighs 2 lb/ 7 oz. albeit it uses trekking poles to set up. Cost $107 shipped.
I am a huge fan of UL gear as it packs down so small and is so light.* I also wanted gear that has been proven with great reviews but didn't cost me an arm and a leg. So my whole system above was $270*** including the carbon fiber trekking poles which then have a dual purpose. So far it has been excellent and suits my needs. I am a stickler when it comes to tools and gear and I cannot have something that is going to fail and I've realized over my many years that you can purchase quality gear on a budget if you do your homework.
*I can easily fit all of the above into about half a pannier**
**with poles telescoped down and tied down outside the bag/rack
***just $100 more than just the Neo Air alone
1) Outdoorsman Lab UL air mattress. I belive the R value is rated at around 2. So not quite the Neo but close. Around $40
2) Aegismax Outdoor UL goosedown sleeping bag (800 Fill..Lower Limit 40F/Extreme 15F). You can unzip with the zipper facing the ground, tuck the foot end of you air mattress into the bottom of the bag and use the upper 2/3's of the bag as a quilt. Around $75
3) Trekology Inflatable Pillow. Inflate for comfort. Around $15
4) I also cannot afford a Zpacks Cuban Fiber tent so I went with a 3F UL Lanshan 2 tent. I only needed to seam seal the tie outs from the A-frame sides of the tent and it has been stellar. It weighs 2 lb/ 7 oz. albeit it uses trekking poles to set up. Cost $107 shipped.
I am a huge fan of UL gear as it packs down so small and is so light.* I also wanted gear that has been proven with great reviews but didn't cost me an arm and a leg. So my whole system above was $270*** including the carbon fiber trekking poles which then have a dual purpose. So far it has been excellent and suits my needs. I am a stickler when it comes to tools and gear and I cannot have something that is going to fail and I've realized over my many years that you can purchase quality gear on a budget if you do your homework.
*I can easily fit all of the above into about half a pannier**
**with poles telescoped down and tied down outside the bag/rack
***just $100 more than just the Neo Air alone