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I'm riding a 50 frame Surly LHT but I just can't get comfortable on it.
It has a short stem and I've tried raising and lowering the bar and buying a set of drops with a shorter reach. My hands register pressure in the drops. I put the bike on the scales and the weight seems to be 45 front and 55 back.
Originally I had tried a 46 Surly (the next size down ) and then there was a gap of a month or two before I found a 50. When I rode the 46 my knees hit the bar end shifter a bit , but that may have been rectifiable. Thinking about it, at the time I found the bike boring compared to the sort of whippet I was used to (it was my first time on a touring bike). The other reason I chose the 50 was that I had previously brought a bike with a too long top tube, sold it, ridden a used hire bike which seemed fine and thought I knew my optimum top tube length (I spent a lot of time doing geometry spreadsheets).

I picked some comments out from the this (8 year old) thread:

https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?11974-Exhausted!!-gt-Neck-amp-Shoulder-Pain



"Are you feeling a lot of pressure on your hands as well?

-Does the bike look too big for me?

Right off I see no elbow flex. Do you relax and flex your elbows and keep your hands loose? Your hands seem really tight around the bars.
-I don't think I ever flex my elbows much. Hands are quite loose at times. Find myself cycling quite a lot with my hands close together at the top of the handlebars."

I don't flex my arms, but to do so I think the top bar needs to be shortened a tad.

"-If this strech is to long for me I've been told that I can buy an adapter to bring the curl bars up and closer to my body. I think the frame is 56cm. The largest Dawes Galaxy size frame available."

Do handle bars need a forward stem?

"-Think I'm gona have to take my bike to a decent shop nearby tomorrow. I'm very typical of my family and have long legs and short upperbody. This means that the frame must be too long horizontally. Darn! Bike seemed ok when I bought it because the one inch rule between your crotch and top bar was just about ok.

Sadly, that is the LEAST important fit measurement. There may be some things that can be done about moving the seat forward or back and adjusting the bars, though. "

I too have long legs and short torso - I was a good sprinter.

I think I'm out side the parameters offered by the frame, unless I can bring the handle bar back.
What about seat post angle. Should it be flatter for my body type?

Caretaker

Try tilting the saddle back.

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I'll try it (pruning roses at the moment). But I think if I tilt backwards, it will change my weight distribution but I'll have to reach further forward. So I'll be scrunched up.

It's a weird effect to me, I feel like I'm on a unicycle falling forward and taking the pressure on my palms. I don't have much of a head for spatial geometry and i suspect most of us don't and that's why while i intend to have a bicycle fitting I'm a bit wary.

groceries

I found this on another forum

A.I need a bike with a top tube of about 50.5 cm. To get a top tube of that length, I need to get a frame that is one or two sizes too small. That is, I would have to get a 49 cm. frame, whereas my inseam would indicate a 52 cm. frame. My LBS says that it doesn't matter that the frame is so small, but this strikes me as being counter-intuitive. Is the LBS right? Should I get the correct size frame and install a very short stem?

B.I would say that you should buy the frame with the correct top tube length. I am a prime example of this. I have longer legs than normal, a very short torso and long arms (+3 index) so I ride a 54cm frame, but my inseam says to ride a 56cm and my torso measurement says I need a top tube length of 53.5-54.5cm. So I ride a 54cm frame since it has a 54cm top tube length. My seat is higher to compensate for my inseam and my bars are lower to compensate for my longer arms.

I would agree with the LBS since you can always raise the seat. A 52cm frame may have a top tube length of 51.5-53cm that's almost an inch longer than your stats, which could make for a reachy and uncomfortable ride. Of course there is always room for adjustment. You can use an non-offset seatpost, or slide your seat forward, but you don't want your knee too far in front of the pedal axle as this will affect your climbing ability. You can use a shorter stem, but shortening the stem by too much can give poor steering performance by making the bike twitchy at speed. I think I read somewhere that you don't want to have a stem shorter than 100mm on a fork with an offset of 43-45mm. Take that with a grain of salt as all bikes are different and certain materials and geometry will change these "experts" rules.

My most recent experiance is that I bought a road bike for my GF and she requires a top tube length of 51cm. All the womens gemetry bike were kind of lame with pastel colors and low end components. The women's geometry have shorter top tubes and longer seat tubes to accomodate shorter torsos and longer legs. We found a Raleigh with great components that was a 47cm and was marked down and within "the price range". The top tupe length was perfect at 50.5 or 51.5 cm. The seat tube length is 47cm, so the seat post is sticking out an extra 3 or 4 cm, not a big deal.

If the LBS has a Serrotta bike fitting system, you can ask to adjust it to the two frame sizes and do some riding on each setting. Pick the one that is most comfortable.

Hopefully I was able to give you some good info through logic and personal experience and not confuse you.

Joe Breese
https://www.bikeforums.net/archive/in.../t-125563.html

Part of the problem is limited stock to try out (my retailer has to dig out a frame from his crowded premises and make one up so I can ride it. I then get to do figure 8's on the concrete pad.I haven't tried one as there isn't one where I live but I like the idea of an adjustable frame which lets you peddle (so doing work) which the top tube is shortened etc
like this:
https://www.gurubikes.com/enUS/dfu/
or this
https://trekdg.com/articles/the-serot...cycle-pg79.htm

valygrl

Can you get a professional fit? How's your neck? How's your butt? Is the seat the right height? Can you measure it compared to a bike you are comfortable on?

groceries

I'm planning to get a professional fit when I get time. The seat isn't too bad. I have a mountain bike which isn't so comparable. I have a Salsa Casserol single speed but it's at the local bike shop getting new brake levers on North Road type bars. People my hieght (165cm) are on the cusp of needing 650cm wheels and I've read that at geometry becomes compromised as they try to fit smaller frames on larger wheels. It's ok but twitchy.

Machka 

As in, tilting the nose of the saddle up a little bit so that your weight is forced back onto your sitbones.

Yes, your weight distribution will be changed, and from what you've written ... "I feel like I'm on a unicycle falling forward and taking the pressure on my palms" ... you need to change your weight distribution.

Take a look at your saddle right now. Does the nose of the saddle slope downward? Does the saddle look fairly level?

valygrl

What does that wheel thing have to do with anything, yours are 26" right?

I'm 5'2" (157.5 cm) and ride a size 49 bike with 514mm effective top tube & 80m stem and 700c wheels, and it's not twitchy.

I would need the 46cm LHT myself.

I'd get that pro fit ASAP and if you got the wrong size try to work something out with the shop. Too-big frames are a bummer, I went though a lot of those before I figured out what was wrong.

positron

THIS IS A RIGHT-ON PLACE TO START. CONSIDER ME SECONDING THIS ADVICE, IN FULL CAPS...

(because it doesn't seem to make sense, but is almost certainly correct, and a great place to start adjusting.)

Commodus

Figure out your fit and go to the gym. Core/upper-body strength matters too.

Carbonfiberboy 

Photographs, profiles. Hands on hoods, hands on bar tops, hands in drops, one pedal at 2 o'clock.

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groceries

The seat slopes slightly upwards. I put a level on it

valygrl

Thanks, that's very helpful. I was guessing the bike is to big since you think it is, but it doesn't look too big at all -- maybe even too small. I don't normally see people riding with the bars that far above the saddle, or with that many spacers under the bars. Is the seat too low? Your in-the-drops photo back angle is what I would expect for on the tops. I think you made it too short & high with your handlbar tweaks.

Can you tell us more about the discomfort? Is it just pressure on your hands or something else? Is this your only road-bike style handlebar bike? Why do you have non-road bars on the Casseroll? Do you have a neck/arm/shoulder/back injury that makes you want to be that upright?

I think we need 2 more pictures, both with hands on the hoods.
1) The leg towards the camera is at the bottom of the pedal stroke - crank parallel with seat tube
2) The leg towards the camera is in front, crank parallel to floor.

I think the seat is too low and the bars are too high. Or the bike is too small for you.

Or I don't know WTH I'm talking about.

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Actually I can't really get the seat much higher. I must admit it doesn't look too small.

groceries

Not quite at 6 O'clock. I lowered the bar a couple of spacers.

djb

dang, just wrote stuff and it was lost.

how close are you to the "max height" mark on the seat stem? If you are close, and I do think your seat is a bit low still, then this bike is at the limit for being on the small side. Thats ok, but at least you can play with diff handlebar stems.

for seat height, the old rule of putting the HEEL of yourfeet on the pedals and youshould have a almost straight leg, so when you put the ball of the foot on, hten youwill have the right bend and be getting the full extension of yourleg muscles for max efficiency of your leg extension.

are you new to riding? how muchhave you ridden this summer? if you ride with little pedal pressure, more weight goe sto your hands.
as others asked, do you have a back injury or whatever why your bar height is this high? your bars tops are higher than your seat, even in hte last photos, and one can or should be able to have them at same height or slightly lower and be completely comfortable if riding steadily .
core strength that increases as you ride more will play a big part.
good luck trying out diff positions, and using these phtos helps a great deal for others to see your actual riding position.

groceries

Sorry I didn't mean my seat was as high as it can go, I meant it is almost as high as I can ride it.
The bar is high as that's how the retailer set it for me. I took it quite low and as at the moment I'm riding through the city (having to watch out a lot) it seemed a bit hard on the neck. I've ridden as a commuter for the last 30 years on a racing bike that was too large so I was sprawled out. I don't have a (significant) back injury - I can touch my toes.
What abot the 45:55 front back. Shouldn't that be 40 to 60?

Machka 

I'm not sure what you mean by that. According to the photos in Post #16, you've still got quite a bit of bend in your knee


What are you talking about??

Cyclebum

Tweaking a new bicycle can involve many miles of riding and lots of minor/major adjustment.

Adjust the saddle height/angle first off. High enough that you get max leg extension without any rocking motion. Then start working with bar height/angle. It might take a lot of riding to get this just right.

If you find that you're still too uncomfortable with hand pressure, double wrap the bars. Good idea anyway as the basic ergonomics will be much better. As a last resort, or a first resort, depending on you attitude, add a set of aero bars. Radically different riding position, NO hand pressure, very restful, more aerodynamic, stronger climbing position. I like Profile Design Airstryke as they don't interfere with hand positions on the bar.

Great pics, btw.

groceries

I had the seat up a little too high and lowered it. In the picture I don't quite have the pedal at the bottom (and I have a knobbly knee).
Putting the bike on scales I'm 45% of my weight at the front and 55% at the back. I've read that it should be close to 40:60 and as I said I feel as though I'm tipping forward. I thought maybe I need to be down and curled up more (bum out and with a shorter reach) or with an upright comfort bar - except that it is a load carrying bike. A smaller frame with a higher seat may redistribute my weight?

groceries

Thanks,
I thought of a combo of north road and aero bars (if that's possible). North road bars through the city and aero bars for the open road.

onbike 1939

Going by the photos, the seat is too low in my opinion. The bike is not too big but the top tube does seem on the short side. The bars in the photo seem to be above the saddle height. I would start with setting the saddle height and then setting the bars at the same height. I would use, as a rough check for distance between saddle and bars, of placing elbow against the toe of the saddle with arm held at right angle. With fingers outstretched they should just touch the bars. The tip of slightly tipping back the saddle is a good one but we're talking of a few mills only here.
An experienced cyclist would be handy to help you out here but I wouldn't like to rely on most shops for advice on fitting.

10 Wheels

Your bike is too small. I had that with my first bike.

positron

try sliding the seat backward on the rails, so that your butt is further behind the cranks. By moving your weight back, you will take weight off your hands. Even an inch will help.

if you cant move the seat back, try a seatpost with more setback, like the velo orange seatposts or the thompson setback posts... This will help.

you need more of your weight further behind the cranks, basically.