TrojanHorse

He said RATE right in his post. If you want to complain, maybe you should complain about the unknown denominator.

indyfabz

HTFU and ride.

NiGoCo

That's the plan.

Buddha2499

Rollfast

I've seen too many crime shows, for Pete's sake, No!

Rollfast

There is an answer that is right on your computer: Craigslist. Stick to older bikes under 750cc, 400-550 would be ideal. You don't need a big fat motorcycle that costs as much as a used car there, that is what your wife is trying to tell you.

Another thing she may be telling you is that you need a sustainable car that will serve her as well (should hers break down).

But the biggest worry she has is that you won't be safe. I can't help you much on that other than to tell you nothing is foolproof and I've lost a friend or two to car-motorcycle wrecks. This is completely a matter of trust for her.

livedarklions

The problem is primarily that the denominator--miles traveled--is almost certainly not knowable, especially for bikes. Bike miles also have definitional problems that cars and motorcycles don't. For example, does the little kid riding on a bike path count as miles traveled?

Any comparative rates are really going to be guesses.

For that matter, is the correct denominator miles or hours? The rate of bike deaths might be overstated comparatively just because it takes a lot longer to ride a bicycle 60 miles than it does a vehicle with an engine.

rumrunn6

hahaha, I hear ya! after our 4 month trial separation & then reconciliation we kept our finances separate. been trying to talk her into paying my life insurance premiums. never seems to go over tho ...

autonomy

You need to normalize those statistics by the number of cyclists and motorcyclists out there, or possibly by miles ridden.
Exactly this. If you compare fatality rates per accident, yes, cycling seems safer. But question is, how many non-accident trips were there?

52telecaster

I got divorced. Now I ride my bike anywhere I want. I also live with a wonderful, different woman. The x hated my bike riding.

WizardOfBoz

My post, above, uses fatalities per 100 million miles of travel. This is apparently the way stuff is reported and compared. The rates I gave are roughly consistent with those reported as rates by jj1091.

I guess that the point is a bicycle is, on average, much safer to ride over a given trip (for example, a commute). Makes no sense for the OP's wife to get upset about the bike - it's likely safer than the motorcycle he's been riding.

That said, some trips might involve stretches are a more dangerous for bikes, or that have a lot of accidents that occur randomly (so you could be whacked by an accident caused by someone else). But in general, I think that the OP might look up some stats to point out to his wife. Now, that conversation may or may not be effective...

ggoytia1

Shimagnolo;
That must have been one hell of wreck! I had a buddy who owned a shop he would order for me for a little bribe to avoid the salvage ones.
when Jersey was underwater we picked some nice flooded ones that he got up and running. Made a little beer money on them

ggoytia1

Ride what you want there is danger in everything. Just live life while you can, we will get older soon and IF we make it we will have good stories. If you live in a bubble your wish list will soon fad.

That being said be careful out there. 😇

jj1091

​​​​​​It wasn't my evidence, just something I pulled up on statistics. But, the evidence in that particular data dump shows that in all accidents, bicyclists were about a third as likely to die. The rates they used were "all accidents". The statistics shown by the NTHSA, showing bicycle death rates being greater than that of motorcyclists, was used by ABATE, and it was noted that "Bicycling fatalities per vehicle mile, on the other hand, though difficult to estimate because of uncertainty in the total-miles-traveled data, appear to be at most 11 times greater than the rate for automobiles (and that number may be quite inflated). The motorcycle rate, on the other hand, is over 17 times greater than that for automobiles."

So, I question ANY data compiled on the safety of bicyclists vs motorcyclists, first because almost no cyclists use odometers, and any agency using cycling-miles-traveled would have no basis for compiling the data. Primarily, though, all studies shown are based on the number of reported accidents. Motorcycles are highly regulated by traffic laws, licensing requirements, vehicle registrations, and insurance requirements, so the reporting of any motor vehicle accident on a motorcycle is required by law. Not so on a bicycle. So, how many bicycle accidents of a minor nature are even reported at all? Probably almost zero. Minor motorcycle accidents? Probably most.

Maybe you can provide data that shows what I'm missing, since you seem convinced that the data is wrong. I'm not saying you're wrong and I'm right, and I have no real stake in the issue, but until published data finds a way to include the factors for bicyclists in a manner that is consistent with that compiled for motorcyclists, then I find no reason to say otherwise than what published studies show. The OP was seeking data to convince his wife of the safety of bicycling vs motorcycling, so it's a good place for data to be provided. Share your data.

NiGoCo

I finally had time to watch several of your videos. It appears I'm in a similar setting. Except without all those bike lanes, pictures of bikes painted on the road, MUPs and on my route our roads have no shoulders. I believe she'd be more at ease if we had something like that.

BobbyG

when I started 26 years ago there were very few bike lanes left over from the 1970s, and they were very faded. What you see had been added over the last three years, and that big wide one downtown just last month.

wphamilton

FWIW, accident statistics generally show a higher risk of serious injury on motorcycles than bicycles, on estimated miles. Even if you use the highest estimate of miles by bike in the USA. Minor injuries, I think you'll have more on the bicycle. The higher speeds of the motorcycle and more intimate mixing in traffic contribute to the risk.

I have to think that your wife's reaction is completely natural and rational, because I felt the same way when I started bike-only transportation. I was just too pig-headed to let that stop me, and after I gained experience my perception of danger diminished. My wife still worries though, so we may not be able to ever completely escape that.

Darth Lefty 

I stopped riding a motorcycle when it was clear I was going to have a family. Life insurance wouldn't make me feel better about it. I feel fine about riding a bike. When you crash a bike you aren't headed into opposing traffic or a square curb at 60mph.

In re: those statistics, the statistics for motorcycle fatalities show a lot of irresponsible people, with no license, no helmet, high BAC, twice as many high BAC at night, single vehicle crashes, liter+ crotch rockets, etc.
https://www.iihs.org/iihs/topics/t/m...ol-involvement
IIHS really hates motorcycles, as you can imagine. They really like motorcycles to have ABS and riders to have helmets.

SHBR

Get your wife on a bike, (or an e-bike?) the benefits of regular riding usually outweigh the risks for most people.

My wife thought I was crazy until she had a decent bike that she enjoyed riding.

I love the heavy duty bike you built up, it seems quite unlikely to be stolen, and if it did, it wouldn't be a huge financial loss.

I sense a second or 3rd bike will be in your future.

SHBR

Here are a few videos of my wife riding (on a crappy Ofo rental bike) through the Yangshuo countryside in China, last year around Christmas.

She had to walk up some of the hills, but other than that, it was an easy afternoon ride for her at around 30KM or so.

Her first ride was just 1KM to the subway station, and her longest was close to 160KM. (80 km each way over two days)

Tamiya

BobbyG

Very cool!

Nessism

I'd do some serious complaining to Yamaha about the engine self destructing at 10k miles. Warranty be damned. That's just insane unless you raced the bike. Unfortunately, that's what they will think regardless of what you tell them. Maybe make arrangements to meet one their regional field representatives so you can demonstrate the bike is not owned by some squid that beat the crap out of it? Not sure but I'd explore every possible avenue to get their help with the repair.

Regarding the bike commute, the overall safety will heavily depend on the conditions/route traveled. How far, condition of the roads, weather, etc.

I live 6 miles from work and want to start commuting only there is this one stretch of road along the route that is narrow, with parked cars along the curb, and there simply is not a safe way to transverse this section of road. Leading up to this section there are bike lanes, and past it the roads empty out and get wider. Mentioning this as an example since we haven't heard about the OP's route and traffic conditions along the way. In general I'd say a bike can be reasonably safe if the route is right. Motorcycles are always risky.

Paul Barnard

Exposure hours is the best way to compare, and most assuredly not data we have access to.

Paul Barnard

This is a very quick read, and it is spot on in my opinion. https://bicyclesafe.com/ If you read and heed the principles set forth in it, you can dramatically lower your chance of being involved in an accident. I am a safety specialist by profession, so my mind is always working in risk reduction/mitigation mode. I bicycle, boat and motorcycle. With each of those, I look at the leading causes of death and do what I can to avoid them. This is a simplification. By not drinking, you can strip away 20+% of the risk. Motorcyclists can strip away additional risk by maintaining control/not driving beyond their limits. Then awareness of left turners. Bicyclists can strip away additional risk by not riding at night or using very good lighting if they do. Don't ride against traffic. Don't ride in the door zone. Very easy things to do that will reduce your risk substantially.