TimothyH

Two parts to this post.

Part 1 - why are my tires blowing off the rim?

I've had two 38 mm Schwalbe G-One Allaround Microskin tires blow off the rim. They are set up tubeless with Orange Seal Endurance on American Classic 29" MTB Race wheels. 45 to 55 PSI is typical pressure. One was brand new and blew off one side of the rim during initial install. Another was in service about 150 miles and this afternoon found the bike hanging in the garage with one side completely unseated around the entire rim and sealant everywhere.

Both tires were remounted this afternoon and the results are the same. Bead does not seat completely in one spot and bulges out on the opposite side. It blows at about 40 PSI. I also flipped the tires around and rotated them 180 degrees to make sure there wasn't something wrong with the rim and both blow off the rim at the same spot on the tire. I even mounted them with tubes and they looked like they were going to blow in the same spot. Tire beads and rim are clean, free of old sealant and Schwalbe Easy Fit lubricant was applied to the bead seat on the rim and the tire bead.

I think it is broken beads on both tires but would welcome any ideas.

Part 2 - More important than above, what is a suitable replacement?

Schwalbe G-One Allound Microskin roll like supple road tires, amazingly fast for a wide tire. I am looking for similar, something light and fast for packed dirt and gravel. Durability is obviously a concern and I know a race tire will wear fast. My main concerns is fast and light. Not looking for anything heavy or sluggish.

Again, would welcome ideas.


-Tim-

DrIsotope

Step one, email the warranty dept. at Schwalbe and initiate a replacement claim. No tire should blow off the rim.

You could try the Maxxis ReFuse 700x40. I've been using the 700x32 for thousands of miles (frame won't clear the 40s) and they're great. Excellent treadwear, and capable on most surfaces (outside of soft sand.)

dim

IRC Formula Pro Tubeless X-Guard TYRES (28 WIDE)

IRC TIRE FORMULA PRO TUBELESS

TimothyH

Thanks for the replies.

I know to make a warranty claim and understand that they shouldn't blow off the rim. I'm asking people to speculate as to why they blew off the rim.

I'm also not interested in strictly road tires but gravel tires. Must be 35-38 mm wide. Sorry that wasn't clear.


-Tim-

shelbyfv

There are now tubeless versions of the Gravelking, smooth or SK https://www.panaracer.com/lineup/gravel.html The tube ones are very nice IMO. Edit- weird but looks as if the smooth may only be 650B??? Oh well....

bikesailor

I had the same problem with a new 35mm G-1 on very tubeless friendly Boyd alloy rims (19+mm ID). Given the relatively small population (I would think) of BF users who have tried G-1's, its beginning to look like a pretty high failure rate. Competitive Cycle replaced the failed tire and said they were unaware of such failure problems. Scary to think that it could happen when using them. My 30mm G-1 speeds have been fine - so far.

TimothyH

Thanks for the info @bikesailor. Both of my failures were with the 38 mm version of the G-One Allaround on American Classic rims with 24 mm inside width. Again, the way they bulge makes me think that the beads are somehow compromised.

@shelbyfv, I've ordered a pair of 35 mm Panaracer Gravelkin SK this morning based on the review at gravelcyclist.com. Yeah, the Panaracer website shows the tubeless non-SK in only 650b. Weird.


-Tim-

motorthings

i was just going to install my 35 g-one allround today...and now you have me skeeved out!

shoota 

Good call, you will like them.

chas58

I was going to recommend 38mm Maxis rambler. the 35mm GK-SK is similar, so I think you'll be happy.

As for why - can you post a picture? Especially of the bulge or the area you think will blow out.

Depending on the wheel/tire, sometimes I find the bead hard to seat. For me, this is usually where the rim catches on the sidewall and never pulls the bead into seat properly. Sounds like you are experiencing something different.

mongol777

what is the max recommended tire pressure for your rims when running tubeless?
i have several g1s in various sizes, all tubelles and on various rims - did not have a problem so far, including 38mm ones

DrIsotope

If you're planning on running those 700x35 Gravelkings tubeless, I recommend very low pressures-- I had mine @ 57psi when the rear tire decided to destroy itself and take a chunk out of both beads on the rim-- definitely my most expensive blowout to date. They rolled and gripped really well, and were very comfortable prior to that event. Panaracer replaced the tire no questions asked, but I personally won't be running them again without tubes. Sub-50psi on pavement would be really smooshy.

Flamme Rouge

First, this sucks! Glad you're OK. I've got a couple of thousand miles on G-One Allarounds this year, zero drama and nothing but good things to say about them. I agree they roll surprisingly well, give decent grip in loose stuff, and have an excellent supple feel that takes some edge off a long day.

Schwalbe makes two versions of the tire, one is Tubeless Ready and one is not. And it's not always easy to tell them apart. I know this because I'm not willing to pay $75 for a tire and I look at a lot of eBay listings and bike ads to support my habit. I realized that most of the time the lower-priced tires were for the NON-tubeless version, even when the ad stated they were tubeless ready. Definitely a case of "buyer beware." If your tires are the tubeless version then Schwalbe has some work to do.

I've ridden Hutchinson Overides, Panaracer GKSKs, and Clement MSOs with good results. I like the Gravel Kings for really sharp, rocky terrain but I find them heavy and sluggish. The Overides have a suppleness and minimal tread that makes them one of my faves for packed dirt road riding (even though they are not TLR). The MSOs slot between the two, more towards the Gravel Kings. The G-Ones are also in the middle, closer to the Overides. All IMO, YMMV, etc. I do not trust Challenge tires at all based on bad experiences with a couple of different models. And as much as I like Compass BJPs, which is a lot, I find them a bit fragile and pricy.

Hope this helps. Please keep us posted.

TimothyH

Thanks for the well thought out and informative post.

Really appreciate it.

motorthings

I've got a brand new set of 37c maxxis ramblers if you want them...lmk and i'll send them your way.

chas58

do it, rambles are great tires!

shoota 

I've been looking for some Ramblers and I need to try them! If OP doesn't want them I will take them, and pass along my MSOs.

motorthings

Tim, you've got your options now...take my Ramblers, or we pass it forward through Shoota, and you get his MSOs. Who knows, maybe we'll end up with a chain of gifting that takes a year to complete?

Barrettscv 

Alternative;

Hutchinson Override 700x38

Size: 700x38, about 39mm wide, about 400 grams each.
Tread pattern: minimal file tread pattern in the center, progressively larger file tread on the shoulder.
Construction: 127 tpi, flat protection included, tubeless
Performance on pavement is excellent, like most road bike tires
Performance on firm gravel is excellent with very good cornering grip on a hardpacked fine gravel
Performance on deep or soft gravel is acceptable, float and traction is sufficient due to the wide footprint and supple construction.
Durability: good so far
Ride: super smooth and plush

The tire was eventually easy to install tubeless with a standard floor pump. I did pre-fit the tire using a tube and let it take shape at 80psi for 48 hours. This allowed the tire to seat quickly and hold air with 30 ml of sealant.

The Hutchinson Override is lightweight and very fast rolling. The Override helped me nearly produce the same kind of speeds I experience on my road bike on pavement with 700x25 Rubino Pro tires. Performance on a wide range of dry surfaces is excellent. Firm gravel, dry grass, dry single-track are all traveled with speed and confidence. Soft and rutted single-lane gravel roads require focus and skill, but can be covered quickly with sufficient traction. Wet gravel and pavement are acceptably easy to travel if the rider avoids any excessive banking during turns. I avoid wet earth and grass, it's not the right tire for those conditions.

shelbyfv

Tim- Here is a photo of the bead on my tubed version of the SK. When you get your tubeless ones, I'd be interested in what you find different.

TimothyH

This is how people are supposed to treat each other, sharing out of our abundance with those who have legitimate need. This is great.

I already have the Gravelkings on the way so find your tires a home if someone else wants them. I'll let you know about the G-One's.

Schwalbe emailed me the same day and asked for photos of the logo, said they had not seen this before except with two very specific brand/models of wheel. I replied today with the photos and will need to wait to hear what they say.

Here is a photo of how they start to bulge and deform. This was taken with a tube installed as test but they behave the same way tubeless. Schwalbe Easy Fit lubricant was used. Pumping it up further makes the deformation much worse, bulging on the side shown until they blow off the opposite side with a loud bang.

TimothyH

I'll surely let you know.

Tires might be here tomorrow and I'll try to pause long enough to take a photo.


-Tim-

TimothyH

Yikes!

Are you sure it wasn't 157 PSI?

Was it loud? I remember pumping my brother's MTB tires too high back in the day, thought they should be 90 or 100 like a road bike. The tires held until I got in front of a house with a lady sitting on the porch.... BAM! It was so loud that my ears were ringing and the lady started spewing a series of curses that would make a sailor blush.

What kind of wheels are those? Crabon?


-Tim-

DrIsotope

Definitely 57psi-- and most odd of all, they had about 300 miles on them when the rear detonated. You can see the bike white splotch of sealant on the spot where the tire blew out, I could fit my index finger into the hole. Was a bit like a pistol report when it went-- smooth pavement, moving around 20mph. I stayed upright, but the weight of me and the bike cut right through the thin sidewalls and wrecked the hoop.

Certainly not carbon. I'm still not to the point where I trust carbon as a wheel material where I live, which when combined with the fact that carbon are wicked expensive leaves me on alloy. I'm running wheels built up with Kinlin XR31T hoops, and they're great. Also luckily fairly cheap, it was only a hair over $100 to get the hoop and have the wheel rebuilt.

shoota 

Woah that's crazy! Something is definitely wrong with their construction, I guess it's not uncommon for a bad batch to get out.