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Surly Long Haul Trucker Deluxe Serial Number Mystery?

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Surly Long Haul Trucker Deluxe Serial Number Mystery?

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Old 02-14-18, 03:30 PM
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jitenshajin
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Surly Long Haul Trucker Deluxe Serial Number Mystery?

Hi everyone,

I have a Surly LHTD frameset. Identical to the one in the following article:

http://www.wired.com/2010/12/surly-l...-touring-bike/

For some reason, Surly have removed reference to this model on their website. But they did send me a copy of the web page they had for this model, attached below.

The reason for this post, is that I cannot find a serial number on the bottom bracket. Only “LHTCO-56”, denoting the model name and size in cm. The paintwork looks original.

I also attach below, a photo of the bottom bracket.

I am in the UK and bought it from a seller on eBay UK. I contacted them, but they could only say they bought it from someone else.

I have also contacted Surly, who agree that the serial number may never have been stamped on the frame.

I was therefore wondering, if someone with experience of this model, could assist?

Did the LHTD they have/had, have a serial number or not?

Is the frame I have, a one-off or not?

Thanks in advance.
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Old 02-14-18, 06:48 PM
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Originally Posted by jitenshajin View Post
...For some reason, Surly have removed reference...I cannot find a serial number on the bottom bracket. Only “LHTCO-56”...I have also contacted Surly, who agree that the serial number may never have been stamped on the frame...
LHTCO - that seems awfully fishy.

Surly discontinued production of the LHT Deluxe in perhaps 2012, two years after the 2010 article you linked. This is why LHT Deluxe is not listed among current models at surlybikes.com in 2018.

My 2006 LHT (not a Deluxe) had the serial number M6012345 (M for Maxway, 6 for 2006, followed by 6 digits which I believe are a simple serial number indicating order of production.

My 2012 Disc Trucker is stamped M12012345, again M=Maxway, 12=year of manufacture and the following 6 digits are serial number. This whole M12012345 serial number is stamped on the right/drive side of the underside of bottom bracket, and on the left/nondrive side is the stamp DISC700-56, indicating brake type, nominal wheel size (700 or 26) and nominal frame size as described in Surly's published geometry tables.

When you contacted Surly (derby@surlybikes.com), did they confirm Deluxe models were actually stamped LHTCO (LHT COupled)?

I hope an informed LHT-Deluxe owner will soon refute the following comment, but I wonder if you may have some sort of counterfeit LHT on your hands. Perhaps it's a prototype, thus the departure from normal stamping which might explain the lack of serial number. Do you have any other LHTs around to compare for authenticity? Any more pics you can post?

One thing you can check is the top tube (TT) diameter. Real LHTs have an unusually large ~32mm TT (measured at center, not ends where they may be ovalized). Down tube is 32mm too, which is not uncommon for DTs.

While on the topic of counterfeit bike parts, readers be aware that Thomson stems have been counterfeited for ~5 years now, and they are not safe, reliable stems. I seen several on eBay that look suspect - the counterfeits evidently have poor anodizing that flakes off easily.

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Old 02-14-18, 07:43 PM
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I had a first year of production LHT, serial number was M4061XXX (I used X for each of the last three numerical digits). I no longer have it, so I can't comment on any other markings.

I am surprised that a frame left the factory without a number. If you posted a photo or a few photos of the complete frame and fork, we might be able to tell if there is anything that makes it look like it is counterfeit.

One of my older bikes has the serial number on the seat tube up by where the seat stays join it. And I had a bike with the serial number on a rear dropout. Maybe the deluxe models had a serial number on a different part of the frame?
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Old 02-14-18, 11:46 PM
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Fishy

No serial number on the bike?

Are there counterfeit LHT
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Old 02-15-18, 02:50 AM
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Identification needef

I found a bike in the junk yard with a frame number : M330XXX

This bike surly ?
This bike model almost looklike LHT ( long neck )

Thanks
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Old 02-15-18, 07:11 AM
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I had one and I do think I remember the number being stamped on the bottom-bracket. I know for a fact that I wrote the frame serial number down, because I still have that documented. Unfortunately can't locate any photos of the underneath of the bottom-bracket.

BTW: I sold mine last year. Great frame, but decided to move to a World Troller instead.

Here's the document image. I did what the instruction said and stored the number:



Here my frame in new condition:


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Old 02-15-18, 11:43 AM
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Looks like there used to be a sticker on the bottom bracket. Probably had a serial number on it. I don’t think Surly uses stickers. Both of my Surlys are stamped. Troll and World Troller.
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Old 02-15-18, 12:05 PM
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Doesn't S&S control the distribution of their couplers to certified installers?

A LHT frame with S&S couplers seems like such a bizarre item to counterfeit, it's such a niche product and not all that expensive. And if you're going to go through the trouble of making a counterfeit coupled frame, why not just stamp a realistic number on it?
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Old 02-15-18, 12:17 PM
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Originally Posted by tyrion View Post

A LHT frame with S&S couplers seems like such a bizarre item to counterfeit,
+1, I agree.
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Old 02-15-18, 02:27 PM
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Originally Posted by alan s View Post
Looks like there used to be a sticker on the bottom bracket. Probably had a serial number on it. I don’t think Surly uses stickers. Both of my Surlys are stamped. Troll and World Troller.
Yep, unless they sticker prototypes, perhaps to discourage resell.

Originally Posted by tyrion View Post
Doesn't S&S control the distribution of their couplers to certified installers? A LHT frame with S&S couplers seems like such a bizarre item to counterfeit, it's such a niche product and not all that expensive. And if you're going to go through the trouble of making a counterfeit coupled frame, why not just stamp a realistic number on it?
I agree the counterfeit theory seems unlikely, unless the couplers themselves are counterfeit too, then it makes sense. A counterfeit stamped serial number would make the OP's suspect frame seem far more legit, unless the stamper doesn't know the s/n format and stamps a clearly bogus number.

Notice I also suggested the idea of a prototype. An email or phone call to Surly in MN would likely definitively resolve the prototype theory. It seems like a prototype frame would be found closer to Surly/QBP HQ in MN than the UK.

I have personally encountered counterfeit NiMH batteries, bike stems, knives from several makers, and flash memory. In each case I would not have known these items were counterfeit from casual inspection. Amazon is one of the largest sellers of counterfeit goods - for example, there is usually at least one third party seller offering counterfeit Spyderco knives. The counterfeits get mixed in with genuine so that all inventory is suspect. The better counterfeits are virtually identical to the genuine article in outward appearance. Considering it's clearly profitable to counterfeit $30 memory and $60 pocket knives, one shouldn't wholly dismiss the notion of a counterfeit $800 bicycle frameset.
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Old 02-15-18, 06:46 PM
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Looked at my Surlys again. One has a sticker about the same size as the one in the picture (that appears to have been removed) that says “Made in Taiwan.” But the serial number is plainly stamped into the BB shell.
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Old 09-30-18, 11:36 PM
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Apologies to everybody for not responding earlier.

I would like to thank everybody who replied to this thread.

I will address below, any points raised in the comments.

In reference to the sticker, I have attached a photo of the bottom bracket, before I removed the sticker to check for a serial (frame In the UK) number beneath.

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Old 10-01-18, 01:04 AM
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Originally Posted by tyrion View Post
Doesn't S&S control the distribution of their couplers to certified installers?

A LHT frame with S&S couplers seems like such a bizarre item to counterfeit, it's such a niche product and not all that expensive. And if you're going to go through the trouble of making a counterfeit coupled frame, why not just stamp a realistic number on it?
The frameset looks genuine in every way. I have other Surly forks and they look identical to the ones from the LHTD. I don't see why the frameset would be counterfeit. There would be little incentive for anybody to do so. They would have get all the details correct, such as the unique frame dropouts and lugs and fork crown that Surly use, not to mention the correct paint and decals. Besides, as said, S & S couplers are only supplied to certified installers.

As to the prototype theory. I prefer to think it was from an early production run, and they just neglected to stamp a serial number on this frame at least.

Thanks to member 'BigAura'. At least I know, some did have serial numbers!

If anybody has any more information to solve this mystery, I would be grateful to know it.
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Old 10-04-18, 05:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Tourist in MSN View Post
One of my older bikes has the serial number on the seat tube up by where the seat stays join it. And I had a bike with the serial number on a rear dropout. Maybe the deluxe models had a serial number on a different part of the frame?
I have checked every inch of the frame. There is no sign of a serial number.

Anyway, as 'BigAura' stated on the frame he had, there was clearly a serial number stamped on the bottom bracket.

So it there was indeed a serial number, that would be the place to expect it.
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Old 10-04-18, 05:20 AM
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Originally Posted by seeker333 View Post
One thing you can check is the top tube (TT) diameter. Real LHTs have an unusually large ~32mm TT (measured at center, not ends where they may be ovalized). Down tube is 32mm too, which is not uncommon for DTs.
seeker333

I have just measured the top and down tube with a pair of digital vernier calipers.

Both are exactly 32mm, as you stated.
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Old 10-04-18, 05:39 AM
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Originally Posted by tyrion View Post
Doesn't S&S control the distribution of their couplers to certified installers?
In my limited experience they do. I facilitated the purchase of a set for an engineering student project. The folks at S & S required a letter on University letterhead detailing the intended usage and certifying that they would not be resold or installed on a bicycle that would be resold.
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Old 10-04-18, 12:15 PM
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Originally Posted by jitenshajin View Post
seeker333 I have just measured the top and down tube with a pair of digital vernier calipers. Both are exactly 32mm, as you stated.
It took 8 months for you to respond to replies to OP. It seems you do not care much to resolve this "mystery", so why should we?
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Old 10-04-18, 02:10 PM
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Originally Posted by seeker333 View Post
It took 8 months for you to respond to replies to OP. It seems you do not care much to resolve this "mystery", so why should we?
Yeah- go after the poster for perceived impoliteness! Such passive rudeness will not stand!
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Old 10-05-18, 02:24 PM
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My Trucker has a serial number, but I assume if I purchased a frame it would not have one.
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Old 10-05-18, 02:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Nycycle View Post
My Trucker has a serial number, but I assume if I purchased a frame it would not have one.
All Surly frames have a serial number, whether bought as a frameset or Complete bicycle (see posts 2, 3 & 6). I bet less than 1 in 1000 frames leave the Maxway factory without a S/N stamp.
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Old 11-13-18, 09:29 PM
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My lht deluxe is stamped "deluxe-56" on the right side and has serial number on the left, where yours is blank. I believe mine is a 2011 or 2012.
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Old 11-16-18, 03:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Ski907 View Post
My lht deluxe is stamped "deluxe-56" on the right side and has serial number on the left, where yours is blank. I believe mine is a 2011 or 2012.
Just read the serial number. It should begin with characters Mxx, where xx indicates last two digits of year of manufacture (2010, 11 or 12). Then you'll know when it was made. See post #2.
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Old 02-16-19, 02:10 PM
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Originally Posted by seeker333 View Post
It took 8 months for you to respond to replies to OP. It seems you do not care much to resolve this "mystery", so why should we?

Back again on this forum, after a break from before the new year!


In reply to the poster:


Am I the only one, who concentrates on an issue. Then puts on the back burner for a while. Only to keep picking it up later. Especially, when a definitive answer is still unknown?


Anyway, thanks to all posters who have been contributing useful information.


This thread lives!
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Old 02-16-19, 02:28 PM
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Yes, internet forum trolling will never die.
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Old 02-18-19, 02:36 PM
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Originally Posted by seeker333 View Post
Yes, internet forum trolling will never die.
Are you referring to yourself or others?

"In Internet slang, a troll is a person who starts quarrels or upsets people on the Internet to distract and sow discord by posting inflammatory and digressive, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community (such as a newsgroup, forum, chat room, or blog) with the intent of provoking readers into displaying emotional responses and normalizing tangential discussion, whether for the troll's amusement or a specific gain."
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