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Old 02-17-19, 07:05 PM
  #26  
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Originally Posted by JoeyBike View Post

was that an organized trip or self supported through The Walking Dead set?
I hope you had your spare spokes ready for some life saving skewering, make sure the threaded bits are faced up and bobs your uncle.
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Old 02-17-19, 07:11 PM
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New thread idea: Zombie apocalypse encounters.

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Old 02-17-19, 07:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Rowan View Post
I do tend to agree with what you say about downtube shifters. I had a road bike for several years that had them, and they do come a bit risky when climbing and in moving in traffic situations when there is a need for shifting and braking.

The beauty of them does line in the simplicity of the mechanism, which even beats handlebar shifters of similar type. But the position change to reach them can become a nuisance. And it didn't hep that I road a 200km randonnee in the company of a downtube shifter guy who simply couldn't be bothered getting the adjustment right and eliminate the noise from the rear gears all day.

I have toured on a single-speed fixed-gear bike (and ridden it a fair bit in long daily distances) and still find it much better except on really steep climbs (and there is a solution to that, I think, in fitting up a rear hub that has threads on both sides for single gears).
Yeah they are super reliable and probably the best mounting position for cables and simplicity but oy vey what a pain to shift. Those who ride friction or even indexed and cannot bother to fix their bike so it functions properly for a long ride is simply just ridiculous. It isn't hard to get your bike set up a month before hand ride it and make sure everything is great and bring it back if needed.
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Old 02-17-19, 09:13 PM
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downtube shifters means you can hold some food in your hand and reach down and hold the bars with the food hand and reach down and shift the front and the rear without shifting the food between hands you just cant beat that level of convenience
for me, it's downtube shifters



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Old 02-17-19, 10:19 PM
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My Le Tour came with dt's and I'll keep them as long as I can stomach em. Rear is indexed and I'm well-practised with the front; honestly I just make due for the most part until I'm spinning way too fast and typically just change rings. Triple crank really helps out.
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Old 02-18-19, 10:08 AM
  #31  
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Originally Posted by Soody View Post
downtube shifters means you can hold some food in your hand and reach down and hold the bars with the food hand and reach down and shift the front and the rear without shifting the food between hands you just cant beat that level of convenience
for me, it's downtube shifters
You have 3 hands? How do you hold food in one hand, hold the handlebars and reach down to shift with only 2 hands? Frankly, if I were holding food for some silly reason, Iím not going to be shifting with any hand. Itís just not necessary.

Originally Posted by JoeyBike View Post
Downtube shifters are for people who can spin like mad AND push a gear two sizes too tall for the situation. If you can do this, and your gearing is correct, you just don't have to shift as much - you "make due" with the gear you picked until you break free of traffic or whatever situation keeps both hands on the bars. Or you learn to think ahead better. Or you become a better bike rider.
You could also wear a hair shirt, sleep on pine needles and eat road kill but why? Just to make it harder? Iíve used friction downtube shifters in the past and STI now. I donít look back fondly on friction. I shift more often and use my gears better with shift levers conveniently located for easy access.

If you race, and win money racing...brifters 100% no argument. For a multitude of reasons. Grinding up a pass in Rocky Mountain National Park on a tour for two hours straight? You won't be shifting much. Dropping down the other side of the pass at 30mph for 20 minutes? You wont be shifting much either. Crossing Kansas 8-hours a day for a week. Yep...you won't be shifting much. Shouldn't be in a rush anyway.
Colorado passes arenít that much of a gold standard for difficulty. They arenít all the steep but they arenít just uphills either. There are flat spots and even little downhills at various places where shifting comes in handy. Ditto on the downside.

But the real test of gearing is in the eastern half of the US. There are short, steep climbs followed by short, steep downhills followed by another short, steep climb, ad infinitum. STI shines in those conditions.
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Old 02-18-19, 10:22 AM
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I love downtube shifters, theyíre simply elegant!



Long Haul Trucker at the start of a transcontinental tour in Astoria, Oregon
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Old 02-18-19, 10:29 AM
  #33  
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Originally Posted by veganbikes View Post
Yeah they are super reliable and probably the best mounting position for cables and simplicity but oy vey what a pain to shift. Those who ride friction or even indexed and cannot bother to fix their bike so it functions properly for a long ride is simply just ridiculous. It isn't hard to get your bike set up a month before hand ride it and make sure everything is great and bring it back if needed.
I think youíve hit on the real issue here. The whole 1x and 2x silliness that we are saddled with is due to people not understanding derailers in general. Iíve never found indexed front shifting to be difficult to adjust. As long as the cable is at the right tension, the derailer shifts. Far too many people get out the screwdriver and start adjusting screws when the problem is a very minor cable tension adjustment. And even that should only have to be done seldomly.
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Old 02-18-19, 11:20 AM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by cyccommute View Post
I don’t look back fondly on friction...
No one is trying to send you back there.

...But the real test of gearing is in the eastern half of the US. There are short, steep climbs followed by short, steep downhills followed by another short, steep climb, ad infinitum. STI shines in those conditions.


And no one is claiming any type of performance advantage to downtube shifters. It's when you are 2 months into a 6-month bike tour and your bike falls over, or you have a minor crash and your brifters are almost guaranteed to hit the tarmac. Maybe they break, maybe they don't. Worst case for me is I operate with one brake lever for a week until I can find a bike shop. That bike shop is almost for sure going to have some type of brake lever on the shelf. You're gunna be tackling those eastern roller-coaster hills with no rear derailleur usage AND hoping the next bike shop can match up your components. And spending $$$ instead of $ during your tour.

The only argument for downtube shifters I can make is that they are less likely to need ANYTHING done to them for a year on the road, they will shift PERFECTLY that entire time, and they are almost impossible to break in a crash. Personally, I enjoy the nice, clean look of my bars and front of my bike in general, but that's personal preference only.

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Old 02-18-19, 11:30 AM
  #35  
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Originally Posted by Happy Feet View Post
New thread idea: Zombie apocalypse encounters.
In my photo with the burnt-out car, I was thinking more of a Mad Max scenario.

"Without fuel they were nothing. They'd built a house of straw. The thundering machines sputtered and stopped." - The Road Warrior (1981, Aust.) (aka Mad Max 2, or Mad Max 2: The Road Warrior)
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Old 02-18-19, 12:13 PM
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And the earth reclaimed the machines...

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Old 02-18-19, 03:03 PM
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for those of us who rode with dt shifters for years and years, we appreciate how pretty much any other system is nicer/more convenient/easier/faster/safer/more comfortable--you name it.

for those of you that havent used them, hey try them out , and for those very few who prefer them, hey thats fine too.

ride em for a few decades and then perhaps you too will have a "been there, done that" view--or not.
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Old 02-18-19, 07:10 PM
  #38  
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Originally Posted by JoeyBike View Post
]And no one is claiming any type of performance advantage to downtube shifters. It's when you are 2 months into a 6-month bike tour and your bike falls over, or you have a minor crash and your brifters are almost guaranteed to hit the tarmac. Maybe they break, maybe they don't. Worst case for me is I operate with one brake lever for a week until I can find a bike shop. That bike shop is almost for sure going to have some type of brake lever on the shelf. You're gunna be tackling those eastern roller-coaster hills with no rear derailleur usage AND hoping the next bike shop can match up your components. And spending $$$ instead of $ during your tour.
You kind of are claiming a performance advantage to downtube shifters. Saying the brifters are somehow ďdelicateĒ is a claim of better performance. Iíve crashed STI shifters into the ground...directly...without issues. Iíve had STI on a bike that have 25,000 miles on them without issue. The whole ďbrifters are going to leave you busted flat in Baton RougeĒ is a red herring.

The only argument for downtube shifters I can make is that they are less likely to need ANYTHING done to them for a year on the road, they will shift PERFECTLY that entire time, and they are almost impossible to break in a crash. Personally, I enjoy the nice, clean look of my bars and front of my bike in general, but that's personal preference only.
The brifters with 25,000 miles on them is on my commuter bike. They have been used for 12 years with NOTHING being done to them and they have made thousands more shifts in a commuting use then they would make while touring. They are tough, reliable and can be crashed without worrying that they will fail to shift PERFECTLY every time.
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Old 02-18-19, 07:32 PM
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Originally Posted by cyccommute View Post


You have 3 hands? How do you hold food in one hand, hold the handlebars and reach down to shift with only 2 hands? Frankly, if I were holding food for some silly reason, Iím not going to be shifting with any hand. Itís just not necessary.

You hold the food with your thumb, index and middle finger, for example a burger or some crab legs. You grip the bar with your pinkie, ring finger and palm. Then you can use the other hand to shift the front, and rear, at the same time. If you have a hammer to smash the crab legs, then you can even use that to articulate the downtube shifters.
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Old 02-18-19, 07:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Soody View Post
You hold the food with your thumb, index and middle finger, for example a burger or some crab legs. You grip the bar with your pinkie, ring finger and palm. Then you can use the other hand to shift the front, and rear, at the same time. If you have a hammer to smash the crab legs, then you can even use that to articulate the downtube shifters.
A most excellent post. I can't think of a time when I haven't had both crab legs and a hammer handy while riding on tour!

In that regard, stem shifters also make a good tripod (along with the stem itself) for balancing Au jus for a beef dip.
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Old 02-18-19, 07:38 PM
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Originally Posted by tacreamer View Post
I love downtube shifters, they’re simply elegant!



Long Haul Trucker at the start of a transcontinental tour in Astoria, Oregon
Originally Posted by tacreamer View Post
That is a really nice rig. How do you find the low rider bar with your light mounted there? Does it put a line in the beam?
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Old 02-18-19, 08:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Soody View Post

That is a really nice rig. How do you find the low rider bar with your light mounted there? Does it put a line in the beam?


There is no interference of the light beam mounted as shown. I used a German stainless steel mount for the light as shown in this link https://nabendynamo.de/en/products/accessories/


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Old 02-18-19, 08:09 PM
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I had DT shifters on my Long Haul Trucker for years. Then one day I got the itch for something different, and found some dura-ace bar ends for cheap on ebay. I put them on and wished I had done it sooner. Just love em.
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Old 02-18-19, 08:53 PM
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Originally Posted by tacreamer View Post


There is no interference of the light beam mounted as shown. I used a German stainless steel mount for the light as shown in this link https://nabendynamo.de/en/products/accessories/


ok cool, thanks, i have a couple of similar schmidt brackets, just asking because reasons
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Old 02-18-19, 09:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Happy Feet View Post
A most excellent post. I can't think of a time when I haven't had both crab legs and a hammer handy while riding on tour!

In that regard, stem shifters also make a good tripod (along with the stem itself) for balancing Au jus for a beef dip.
Yeah man, i think weight weenies like cyccommute take things too far. I don't go touring to martyr myself, i go to have a good time, and it's just not comfortable without Au jus & a crab leg hammer. Maybe when I was younger I would be happy with a dry beef sandwich or breaking crab legs with my hands like some kind of savage, but I'm just past all that now.
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Old 02-18-19, 09:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Soody View Post
ok cool, thanks, i have a couple of similar schmidt brackets, just asking because reasons
I forgot to add that the light on my touring bike (an Edulux II) is a shaped beam with cutoff.


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Old 02-18-19, 09:55 PM
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Originally Posted by JoeyBike View Post
Also, in the beginning with friction downtube shifters, they were not indexed. No clicks. Smooth shifting which took some skill to overshift a tad, then carefully center the rear derailleur over the chosen cog until it was silent. Of course with practice it became automatic. I remember my first real touring bike had 6-speed shifter with index, and for the life of me I couldn't understand why. Clicks meant more adjustments had to be made initially, and as the cables stretched, to make sure the chain centered on every cog. With friction I could make that adjustment in the saddle on the fly with a tweak of the shift lever.

Thank God the front derailleur was not indexed! I still hate that. My Trucker in the photo has a non-indexed front derailleur shifter.

I believe that index shifting was created to make it easier for "novice" cyclists to ride geared bikes. Of course now I am happy to use indexed shifting on the rear cog. If I cycled with ear buds, indexed shifting would take on a whole new meaning as well! But I do not.
Most, if not all, those indexed downtube shifters could be turned off so that they worked in friction mode. Most of you don't realize that todays shifters located in the brake levers is nothing but indexed shifters.
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Old 02-18-19, 10:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Happy Feet View Post
A most excellent post. I can't think of a time when I haven't had both crab legs and a hammer handy while riding on tour!

In that regard, stem shifters also make a good tripod (along with the stem itself) for balancing Au jus for a beef dip.
LOL! Yeah, I would like to see him try to hold food in one hand and shift with the other hand while riding with fully loaded front and rear panniers and handlebar bag on a touring bike, that would make for a very interesting YouTube video.
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Old 02-18-19, 10:03 PM
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Originally Posted by tacreamer View Post


I forgot to add that the light on my touring bike (an Edulux II) is a shaped beam with cutoff.


I know. They're fantastic lights. I have one. There's some pictures of my bike at the top of the page.
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Old 02-18-19, 10:05 PM
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Originally Posted by greatscott View Post
Most, if not all, those indexed downtube shifters could be turned off so that they worked in friction mode. Most of you don't realize that todays shifters located in the brake levers is nothing but indexed shifters.
yeah this is actually handy, i've bent my derailer hanger twice on tour and just switched to friction mode
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