bdcheung

Hincapie's response. No outright denial:
"I have been a professional on the circuit for 17 years – which is one of the longest careers in the peloton. During that time, I have earned the respect of my peers and a reputation for working hard, honestly and honorably. I'm really disappointed to hear these accusations."

dgasmd

+1

I think that if anyone seriously believes the entire peloton, now and then, is not doping they have a bigger issue than whether or not Landis is saying the truth!

Captain Insano

True, true. You've currently got the Tour of California and the Giro d'Italia in full bloom, so the public is generally aware that some big bike race is going on somewhere. If he dropped this last winter, it would be a one-day blip on ESPN, everybody would say "well, I already knew that", and life would go on. Floyd may be a liar and a cheat, but he knows how to time his message.

botto 

seeing as you didn't cite a source, how do i know that you didn't?

Homebrew01

It's not a level playing field for those with top-level ability that would rather not dope to succeed.

botto 

time to change your diapers, and up the Aricept because i don't do P&R in the 41, pops.

DonDenver

F’bombs, Mob? Goodfellas and Godfathers man; turn down the volume.

I suppose an athletic background helps with the context of ‘code’ where you don’t drop names with those you locker with…period. Call yourself out but not others. Flodis, while I believe him, he’s no Jeffrey Wygant, he’s Jose Canseco in his approach… a rat caught in wheel spokes.

escii_35

I still have a VHS tape of Floyd's TDF comeback ride. It sits along side "This is Spinal Tap" and "Rob Roy". To the garbage it goes.

On Lance:

Did he do drugs before Cancer. Probably

Did he do drugs during and while recovering. HELL YA!!.

Did he do drugs on his TDF winning run. Probably not.


Personally I will be requesting performance enhancing drugs after my next major manglement. When your 80 year old great aunt and 60 year old mom's initial recovery phase from knee surgery is better then yours it's time for some drugs.

fly:yes/land:no

lance comments are up:

https://www.fanhouse.com/2010/05/20/l...-me-for-years/

electrik

Haha... i love it.

Throw me some testing evidence though.

patentcad

Exactly.

DScott

So Landis comes clean, and says , "I don't want to be part of the problem anymore."

https://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20100520/...cling_landis_6


He's already marginalized, has no pro ride to speak of... what's his point?

deitman

Since Velonews won't load on either my computer or Iphone, and navigating through three merged and now diverging threads is killing me...I have an essay I'd like to share:

My $12.42 worth....

While I'm not a fan of Landis or his camp...there's some interesting things to point out with this revelation that strike me...

1. Funny enough, the last portion of his book (by Arnie Baker, a respected physician and cyclist in his own right) details the scientific protocols used by the drug-testing lab responsible for the positive result, and the lack of following basic scientific procedures to do so. HIS scientist is not the only one critical of the testing procedure of the french lab at the time, but also the UCLA lab that was not allowed to be called as a witness in his defense was critical of the french procedures. Ironically, now Landis says he was doping, but not in the manner for which he was suspended.

2. Landis has been unable to recover his form or sponsorship unless he brings said sponsors with him as part of the team that signs him...one could say he was "blackballed" and this is a way to maximize getting back at those who he believes are blackballing him. But is he being "blackballed" because his ability does not warrant placement within a top team or because people within the sport knew (or strongly suspected) what Landis has admitted...doping since 2002.

3. He focuses on American cyclists, some of whom are either among the most drug-tested professional athletes in recent years (Armstrong), or have been part of pioneering, biological passport programs that led UCI into its current biological passport protocols (Garmin, Columbia, even Astana last year had the passport). Hmmmmm...if those cyclists were/are, then it not only invalidates this year's drug testing protocols, but those by the teams from the previous years (and those team administered results were made available if you wanted them)...and why no mention of foreign cyclists except to mention them nebulously as "former team members"?

4. The rhetoric and heavy-handed guilty until proven innocent tactics by WADA seem amateurish and political at best, but Landis' admission only seems to reinforce that they are correct even when they screw up finding an athlete guilty of doping.

5. Landis chose to speak exclusively with a credible journalist from an outlet OUTSIDE THE CYCLING WORLD (Bonnie Ford of ESPN--an excellent investigative journalist) to bring greater attention to his claim/himself...

As for any debate on whether Armstrong himself is clean or not...only a positive test or self-admission will prove that he is not clean. Until then, I have to (somewhat hesitantly) believe that while he may have sometime in the past (pre-cancer perhaps?), he cannot risk the negative exposure that such behavior would have on the LIVESTRONG effort...his ego (yeah its big) dictates that this legacy is more important to him than his cycling results.

meanwhile

This is nonsense in two different ways:

- Armstrong HAS had at least one positive test - it just wasn't legally enforceable. And the circumstances he raced under were such that, as the result of great effort by him, it was impossible for him to be tested properly later. Other tactics Armstrong have used including hiring strict anti-doping docs with a big PR splash in the off season, then losing them before racing begins..

- As for "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence" - when someone harasses anti-drug cyclists, avoids testing, hires coaches and physicians who specialize in doping, surrounds himself with doped riders - and keeps up with their doped fueled performances - then the extraordinary claim is that they are NOT using dope! Oh, and let's not forget that tape of one of his assistant's discussing the doping habits of Armstrong and his posse.

The man's blood is so full of chemicals that it should be illegal for him to cross an international border!

Racer Ex 

Again, illegal. Again, mob reference perfectly applicable.

On a practical note, it's not level for those without the money to get on a program either. Although some who tried without the right supervision and clocked out in their sleep ended up under a level playing field.

Greg180

If he has the evidence then he's credible. If he doesn't hes not.

The question becomes WHO certifies the credibility of the evidence.

If he is telling the truth it must be a huge burden off his conscious. If he's lying...Landis's life just got a lot more complicated.

lotek 

where's Willy Voet when we need him?

electrik

It's only an extraordinary claim by Flandis since Lance has passed so many drug controls which are enforceable... I am skeptical of those tests which aren't legally enforceable. Even if there was another positive test... there have been so many negative tests that one could even assume - based off statistics that it's a false-positive test. Certainly there will be false-positive tests.

I'm not falling on either side here, but i really want some better evidence instead. This latest bit is just more finger pointing - nothing too exciting from the legal and evidence based side. We already new Landis doped during the tour.

botto 

Greg180

"I'd say I am a little surprised but I am not," Armstrong said Thursday. He also said that Landis has been threatening to make the e-mails public "for a long time."

Landis...Blackmail? The spin begins

WCroadie

Landis off the juice can't beat the cat1's here in the US let alone race the TdF

I don't believe Millar toured around proclaiming his innocence and begging people for money for his "Fairness Fund" or wrote a book about how he was clean.

Yup this is so great for the sport now here in the US we won't get much cycling on TV, sponsors will drop out, races will probably be canceled. IT will be just awesome. If anyone believes doping isn't still going on in cycling they are kidding themselves. Doping exists in ALL levels of sports from the local rec league on up. Like others have mentioned, it's a business and about making money, and there are a lot of sick people who will do anything for the almighty dollar.

Think again. You think he was that much better then all the other top guys during his run, that they were cheating and he wasn't and still beating them?

jsmonet

in case it hasn't been said yet: Giggity O_O

Racer Ex 

There were actually two, one of which was enforceable but the UCI accepted a post dated TUE application after Lance had said he didn't take anything. Then he did. He just forgot.

And you seem to be either ignorant of or ignoring the many riders who have never failed a drug test yet were found to be doped to the gills through other investigations or confessed. Kloden, Basso, Ulrich, Zabel, Vaughters, Andreau, Millar...that's just a very short list. None of them ever tested positive and were tested as much as Armstrong.

botto 

christ dude, show some farking originality for once, and find your own kool aid jpeg.

fly:yes/land:no

this thread is turning into a circus.