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Help me pick one of these frame sets

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Road Cycling “It is by riding a bicycle that you learn the contours of a country best, since you have to sweat up the hills and coast down them. Thus you remember them as they actually are, while in a motor car only a high hill impresses you, and you have no such accurate remembrance of country you have driven through as you gain by riding a bicycle.” -- Ernest Hemingway

Help me pick one of these frame sets

Old 04-07-12, 04:20 AM
  #1  
guadzilla
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Help me pick one of these frame sets

So I am starting to think about getting myself a super bike for my 40th - simply cos I can and I want one - and need the help of the 41 in trying to decide.

I'll be using the bike for races (road races with a fair amount of breakaways, no crits) and also for competitive group rides with a bunch of friends.

My choices:

- Cervelo S5: This would be the obvious choice. I ride well in flatter races and last year, was 12" and 9" off podium on 2 separate ITTs (where, for a bunch of reasons, I couldn't, and in the future, cannot, bring a TT bike - the S5 might have made the difference). Also, I tend to get gapped a little on climbs (am working on that), and a more aero bike will help me get back faster/more easily.

- Scott Foil: Everyone who's ridden it describes it as a great bike in terms of how it balances everything. Is supposed to be a dream ride.

- Specialized Venge: aero, stiff - but I've heard it isn't as stiff as the S5. Nor as aero.

Price difference between these isn't really a big thing; neither is weight. And I have the rest of the parts decided already (new 2012 SRAM Red, HED Stingers)

I am going to try to get a test ride for each of these bikes in Singapore, but it will only be a short ride to get a sense of stiffness and acceleration.

While I want the most aero bike possible, I don't want it to be at the expense of stiffness and acceleration (I can put out a pretty decent amount of torque and I would like all of it to be devoted to forward acceleration), so I want a bike that shines in sprints, surges and attacks: something that comes close to the Spesh S-Works Tarmac or SuperSix EVO in stiffness and acceleration, but adds an aero benefit.

The S5, provided it isn't really outclassed in the stiffness/acceleration department, would be my first choice.

Anyone have any comparisons or first-hand experience with these bikes?
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Old 04-07-12, 04:23 AM
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you already know, s5.
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Old 04-07-12, 04:37 AM
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Originally Posted by adriano
you already know, s5.
True. I'm just a little concerned about reviews, etc I've read about how aero frames feel dead, aren't as stiff, etc.

Funnily, just after I posted this, I read that Velonews has a review comparing the S5, Venge, etc. And it contradicts the Tour magazine reviews in quite a few places. *facepalm*
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Old 04-07-12, 04:53 AM
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LOL I did the same thing (building a super bike) but I did it a year early.

In my opinion, any of those frames built up with the right components would be pretty damned nice. I doubt you would regret your purchase later with any of them if you built it up nicely.
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Old 04-07-12, 05:34 AM
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True. But you know how it is - I don't wanna be thinking "should I have gotten that instead". Any other bike purchase, I'd just get the prettiest color scheme and be done, but this one, I wanna make like Goldilocks and get something that is Just Right.

And I might do it a little early as well - which is why I am asking now, and not 9-10 months later
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Old 04-07-12, 05:39 AM
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Check out Velo news magazine they just tested these bikes along with a litespeed. I haven't finished the article but the Scott foil won followed by the Venge, they did say the S5 is the most aero but in a wind tunnel only.
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Old 04-07-12, 07:28 AM
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I'd go foil if I were you. If you get gapped on climbs, it's probably best to try to avoid those gaps in the first place so you don't have to burn matches trying to bridge the gap later. Plus, it doesn't exactly do a lot for the 'ol confidence levels to have that happen in the first place. The S5, except the VWD is heavy. The foil is still aero to a moderate degree. I think you'd prob get more benefit from an aero helmet, wheels and riding position than worrying about the frame (for the ITT). Plus, the bike is supposed to be similar to an addict in handling, which I can tell you is a great, stiff, responsive bike and is great for accelerations/attacks and turns in general.

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Old 04-07-12, 05:06 PM
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I got to ride a Foil Premium today and while I've never spend any time on either of the other frames. I can safely say that the Foil is extremely stiff and goes like a rocket ship.
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Old 04-07-12, 07:25 PM
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Foil would be my choice. But it's your money buying the bike.
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Old 04-07-12, 07:32 PM
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With the problems cervelo has right now after changing ownership i would leave that one out.

I usually dont say this things but if you have money just get the specialized. Sweet ride.
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Old 04-07-12, 08:04 PM
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Originally Posted by guadzilla
While I want the most aero bike possible, I don't want it to be at the expense of stiffness and acceleration (I can put out a pretty decent amount of torque and I would like all of it to be devoted to forward acceleration), so I want a bike that shines in sprints, surges and attacks: something that comes close to the Spesh S-Works Tarmac or SuperSix EVO in stiffness and acceleration, but adds an aero benefit.

The S5, provided it isn't really outclassed in the stiffness/acceleration department, would be my first choice.

Anyone have any comparisons or first-hand experience with these bikes?
Ive test rode and s5 and a foil and i dropped money on a foil right after I came back to the shop.

If you want help in the climbs, the only one that can help you is the foil. That bottom bracket is the stiffest out of all three and the ride overall is lithe and spritely, where the s5 was a bit sluggish coming out of the saddle. An aero frame won't help you in the hills but a stiff frame does.
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Old 04-07-12, 09:43 PM
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Well, I don't think the bike will help me on the climbs so much - I give up about 15-18kg to most of the climber types and 100-200gm savings aint gonna make that up. On climbing races, I am nowhere in the picture and that won't change for a while. On rollers, I let myself get gapped a little (to save my matches) and I make it up on the downhills - an aero bike would let me get back on a little faster.

But yeah, everything I have read - including above - about the Foil indicates that it is a great riding bike.

What has been harder to get is how the Venge compares to either of these 2 bikes.
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Old 04-08-12, 08:48 AM
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Frankly, using the same logic as the above, I'm not sure that what little aero advantage there is of the S5 over the foil will make the definitive difference on the flats or in an ITT. Cervelo themselves had a slide show on their website stating that on climbs, weight trumps aero above 5 percent or something in that ballpark. For me personally, my climbing issues are all in the >5% range. You're right, 100-200 gm isn't going to make it up completely, but even cervelo would claim that it would help more than an aero frame. Plus, the Foil may offer an advantage in other situations such as acceleration for attacks and handling for those times when you're hammering on the descents (my last big crash was utilizing that same strategy. The guys were already going at the limit, so silly me shouldn't have tried harder - a big mistake with a lot of pain that I won't repeat again). I think you're probably at an advantage to burn the matches on the rollers to stay on a wheel than allowing yourself to gap and then bridge, but I'm not a very experienced racer. Seems like you've already talked yourself into the S5 and you're looking for support from strangers, so just go for it. My personal feeling is that at this level of frame, they're all good, and the small differences between them is probably negligible. I used to lust for an S5 too, but given the recent changes with Cervelo and QC questions, I've since shifted the crosshairs to a Colnago C59. I'm not a big Specialized fan, so I can't say anything about the Venge.

https://cervelo.com/en_us/engineering...presentations/
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