Drilling holes in frame?
02-02-20, 11:26 PM
#1
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Drilling holes in frame?
can I drill holes into an aluminum frame for internal routing or will it compromise the frame?
02-03-20, 01:40 AM
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Depends.
02-03-20, 02:14 AM
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I think some people have successfully drilled frames for internal routing. I've seen it mostly done with steel frames.
However, keep in mind that it can cause a localized stress riser. And, if your frame is going to fail, it will probably be at the holes.
Many frame builders (with steel) will add some kind of reinforcement at the point where the holes are drilled.
If it was me, I don't think I'd bother for brakes or mechanical derailleurs, but might consider it for Di2 or EPS.
However, keep in mind that it can cause a localized stress riser. And, if your frame is going to fail, it will probably be at the holes.
Many frame builders (with steel) will add some kind of reinforcement at the point where the holes are drilled.
If it was me, I don't think I'd bother for brakes or mechanical derailleurs, but might consider it for Di2 or EPS.
02-03-20, 07:13 AM
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Your frame would have a safety factor built into the frame tubing by the designers. If you place "holes" in such a way as to reduce this safety factor and your are a heavy rider, or hit a big pot hole, etc., it could fail, total loss. Why take the risk when you can get into a newer Giant Escape with internal routing for a couple hundred. A new set of front teeth are expensive.
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02-03-20, 07:31 AM
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Sure, go for it.
02-03-20, 07:33 AM
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02-03-20, 10:37 AM
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^^^^^ You can reach down while riding, cover different holes with your fingers, and make some rippin' Jethro Tull music....
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02-03-20, 11:42 AM
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Seems like you'd be drilling at a 90 degree angle, not good for trying to feed a cable. Seems like you'd need less than 45 degrees for the cable to feed correctly into the tube, and some type of ferrule or something so the cable wouldn't be rubbing against the hole. If doing it for cable protection, just run fully shielded cables. If for aesthetics, can't help ya.
02-03-20, 06:36 PM
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Internal cables are a disadvantage IMO and the odds of drilling the cable holes wrong are high. Leave it as is and enjoy the ease of cable replacement when the time comes.
02-03-20, 06:46 PM
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I assume holes will be large enough to feed the cables and cable housing.
For the housing, I think one normally slots the frame. Then, either uses an insert guide/cover:
https://www.chainreactioncycles.com/...&sku=sku693641
Or, at least for steel, a braze-on cover.
https://framebuildersupply.com/colle...=4630016294940
For the housing, I think one normally slots the frame. Then, either uses an insert guide/cover:
https://www.chainreactioncycles.com/...&sku=sku693641
Or, at least for steel, a braze-on cover.
https://framebuildersupply.com/colle...=4630016294940
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02-03-20, 08:36 PM
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Clifford, I think that the inserts you show below are for a specific brand bike (Ragley) that has non-circular holes milled into the aluminum at the factory, and probably hand chamfered and smoothed to reduce stress risers.
I understand that we need to try stuff sometimes, but for me the view isn't worth the climb. Drilling into a frame without knowing if extra thickness was used to allow for the stress. Not worth it, to me.
If you decide to take the risk and do drill, remember that you should file, sand (with very fine emery paper) and perhaps even polish the hole edges.
I understand that we need to try stuff sometimes, but for me the view isn't worth the climb. Drilling into a frame without knowing if extra thickness was used to allow for the stress. Not worth it, to me.
If you decide to take the risk and do drill, remember that you should file, sand (with very fine emery paper) and perhaps even polish the hole edges.
I assume holes will be large enough to feed the cables and cable housing.
For the housing, I think one normally slots the frame. Then, either uses an insert guide/cover:
https://www.chainreactioncycles.com/...&sku=sku693641
For the housing, I think one normally slots the frame. Then, either uses an insert guide/cover:
https://www.chainreactioncycles.com/...&sku=sku693641
02-03-20, 08:58 PM
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I assume holes will be large enough to feed the cables and cable housing.
For the housing, I think one normally slots the frame. Then, either uses an insert guide/cover:
https://www.chainreactioncycles.com/...&sku=sku693641
For the housing, I think one normally slots the frame. Then, either uses an insert guide/cover:
https://www.chainreactioncycles.com/...&sku=sku693641
Thanks again for that link.
Cheers
Edited. I ordered three sets of those black guides yesterday. I'm going to use them on my road bikes where mine are either missing or badly deteriorated.
Last edited by Miele Man; 02-05-20 at 03:16 AM. Reason: Removed image & added comment
02-03-20, 09:12 PM
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Tuba with a spring loaded seatpost. 😀
I wouldn’t do it though. I wrecked a Columbus frame once just by dropping the bike on a broom on the garage. Hit it at just the right angle. Put a nice little dent in the frame near the lug and jacked up the head tube alignment. Made me realize how thin some of these tubes can be, particularly double butted frames.
I wouldn’t do it though. I wrecked a Columbus frame once just by dropping the bike on a broom on the garage. Hit it at just the right angle. Put a nice little dent in the frame near the lug and jacked up the head tube alignment. Made me realize how thin some of these tubes can be, particularly double butted frames.
Last edited by rollalongnow; 02-03-20 at 09:17 PM.
02-03-20, 09:23 PM
#17
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Zip ties will work, can get some fancy cable guide that will glue on as well.
02-03-20, 09:41 PM
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Clifford, I think that the inserts you show below are for a specific brand bike (Ragley) that has non-circular holes milled into the aluminum at the factory, and probably hand chamfered and smoothed to reduce stress risers.
I understand that we need to try stuff sometimes, but for me the view isn't worth the climb. Drilling into a frame without knowing if extra thickness was used to allow for the stress. Not worth it, to me.
If you decide to take the risk and do drill, remember that you should file, sand (with very fine emery paper) and perhaps even polish the hole edges.
I understand that we need to try stuff sometimes, but for me the view isn't worth the climb. Drilling into a frame without knowing if extra thickness was used to allow for the stress. Not worth it, to me.
If you decide to take the risk and do drill, remember that you should file, sand (with very fine emery paper) and perhaps even polish the hole edges.
One can remedy the problem by either drilling an extra large hole, or by drilling the hole at an angle (and thus getting the equivalent of a slot depending on the actual angle).
For the steel bike, one simply then adds the hood-like covers. For the aluminum bike, one cuts the slots and uses the inserts.
Now, thinking of the length of the slot... at the the surface (ignoring thickness and undercutting for an angled bit)
Ok, for a:
90° angle, length and width is the same.
45° angle, goes by 1, 1, sqrt 2, so I think the slot comes out to 1.4 x the width.
30° angle, 1, 2, sqrt(3) (1.7)
Ok, so I think that comes with a slot that is 2x as long as the width.
20° angle, SOH,CAH,TOA.... ok, so I think sin(20°) = 1/hypotenuse, and your slot length is 2.9x the width (diameter).
Whew, digging around the old noggin for geometry from a few decades ago... 45° angle, goes by 1, 1, sqrt 2, so I think the slot comes out to 1.4 x the width.
30° angle, 1, 2, sqrt(3) (1.7)
Ok, so I think that comes with a slot that is 2x as long as the width.20° angle, SOH,CAH,TOA.... ok, so I think sin(20°) = 1/hypotenuse, and your slot length is 2.9x the width (diameter).
I suppose one would more or less get an ellipse with an angled drill bit. If one cuts a slot with a vertical bit, then it will create a slot that is slightly longer due to the tubing thickness and undercutting, as well as wider at the ends due to the slot shape.
02-03-20, 09:54 PM
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If you drill the frame, and it gets stepped on by a hypontenuse, it's done.
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02-06-20, 08:52 PM
#20
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I would not do this because you are weakening the frame and just asking for cracks to develop. As suggested, use 2 or 3 plastic tie wraps. Not worth the possibility of a frame failure.
02-06-20, 09:19 PM
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I think it's risky and depends greatly on the thickness of the tubing, where the hole will be located, as well as the angle of and thus the size of the hole.
Cheers
Cheers
02-06-20, 09:31 PM
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Having seen handlebars collapse and break a time after being drilled for internal cable routing I say no. As a life long shop hack who picks up the pieces of customer attempts sometimes... I say no. As a 45 year frame guy I say no if you're not smart about it, and even then it's a less best idea. Andy
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02-07-20, 09:15 PM
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My rest recommendation would be to ride the current frame as is and save up until you can order a custom frame. Have the builder built it with internal routing plus all the other improvements you decide are needed on it between now and then; disk brake mounts, extra bottle mounts, custom racks, headlight mount, fender mounts, whatever, etc.
02-08-20, 09:22 AM
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That is basic "drillium"... see this: DRILLIUM
02-08-20, 12:39 PM
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That is basic "drillium"... see this: DRILLIUM
Cheers
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