to helmet or not to helmet
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to helmet or not to helmet
I've been commuting without a helmet. I looked at a few because riding everyday increases my probability of needing it. Now I'm wondering if I can get away without one. I took a few spills on asphalt when I was in college and I always was able to get my hands down first. A few scars on the palms but I never even tapped my head.
Anybody else out there like to live dangerously?
Anybody else out there like to live dangerously?
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Living dangerously? ...or stupidly. It only takes one good hit to put you in lala land. Do you have lots of insurance to take care of your family and an attendant for you?
Wearing a helmet is as much for your protection as theirs. I think you should reconsider your selfish attitude.
Wearing a helmet is as much for your protection as theirs. I think you should reconsider your selfish attitude.
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ljbike
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Be careful to judge lest you be judged. The average person would have the same attitude towards you for riding your bike in traffic.
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My bike is trained to not move without its rider wearing a helmet. I actually started zooming in on a bike-commute one day not so long ago and I felt something very odd. My hair (that which remains ) seemed to move a little more freely. About 0.5 miles into the ride I realized I had no helmet, turned around, and got the baby !!!
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You are right. You're entitled to gamble with your life exactly as you see fit. But if you have a family you're gambling with their lives too. Is that fair?
If you're single, it makes no difference what you do at all. Do whatever makes you happiest.
If you're single, it makes no difference what you do at all. Do whatever makes you happiest.
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ljbike
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Last edited by ljbike; 07-23-02 at 02:17 PM.
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Someone once made fun of me for automatically putting on a seat belt when I was just moving the car in the driveway to wash it.
The helmet is just as automatic. I don't want my wife to have to answer the question "Was he wearing a helmet?" it a "No" should anything untoward happen.
Just because it is possible to be killed even with a seatbelt or a helmet on, doesn't, to me anyway, justify the risk.
Carl
The helmet is just as automatic. I don't want my wife to have to answer the question "Was he wearing a helmet?" it a "No" should anything untoward happen.
Just because it is possible to be killed even with a seatbelt or a helmet on, doesn't, to me anyway, justify the risk.
Carl
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I've been hit 3 times on my bike, none of which could have been avoided, and none where my fault. In each of these instances, I ended up on the ground tumbling and in each, my helmet sustained significant damage. To the point that I sent it back for a "crash replacement". If I hadn't been wearing a helmet, I would tpue lik dis, cuz Id be 2 stoopid to funksion.
New helmets are cooler due to vents and even stylish, not worth the risk of not wearing one in my book!
L8R
New helmets are cooler due to vents and even stylish, not worth the risk of not wearing one in my book!
L8R
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"Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming, "WOW, What a Ride!" - unknown
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Originally posted by a2psyklnut
I've been hit 3 times on my bike, none of which could have been avoided, and none where my fault. In each of these instances, I ended up on the ground tumbling and in each, my helmet sustained significant damage. To the point that I sent it back for a "crash replacement". If I hadn't been wearing a helmet, I would tpue lik dis, cuz Id be 2 stoopid to funksion.
L8R
I've been hit 3 times on my bike, none of which could have been avoided, and none where my fault. In each of these instances, I ended up on the ground tumbling and in each, my helmet sustained significant damage. To the point that I sent it back for a "crash replacement". If I hadn't been wearing a helmet, I would tpue lik dis, cuz Id be 2 stoopid to funksion.
L8R
To the others,
There is a line we walk in everything we do between risk and convenience. When you drive/ride in a car do you insist on a full roll cage, racing helmet, frontal and side impact airbags, 5 point harness? When there is a T- storm in the forecast do you bunker down in your local tornado shelter until it's over? I don't really care what line you walk or how you feel about people who don't act just like you. I wanted to see if anybody else on the forum commutes without a helmet. If you have some real world knowledge of where a helmet has helped you or someone you know, that's cool too. If you have no first hand knowledge you are just being ignorant. I'm not insulting you, it's just the definition of ignorance.
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Originally posted by ljbike
You are right. You're entitled to gamble with your life exactly as you see fit. But if you have a family you're gambling with their lives too. Is that fair?
You are right. You're entitled to gamble with your life exactly as you see fit. But if you have a family you're gambling with their lives too. Is that fair?
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Originally posted by JDP
When I went to look at helmets my wife's response was "why?"
When I went to look at helmets my wife's response was "why?"
And thank you for giving serious consideration to becoming an organ donor.
I've cracked a helmet and rung my chimes. It is amazing how fast you can go down.
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Last edited by SD Fixed; 07-23-02 at 04:36 PM.
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It's simple.
Buy a crash helmet
You may wear the Crash helmet the first time, then leave it at home the next, you'll then start questioning yourself wether the ride your going on would be safer with a helmet or not and you'll pick the helmet up, then before you know it you'll feel naked without a crash helmet and you'll wonder how you ever cycled without it.
Try it.
Buy a crash helmet
You may wear the Crash helmet the first time, then leave it at home the next, you'll then start questioning yourself wether the ride your going on would be safer with a helmet or not and you'll pick the helmet up, then before you know it you'll feel naked without a crash helmet and you'll wonder how you ever cycled without it.
Try it.
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William, I think you should reread the forum guidelines.
JDP, obviously you had no idea of the can of worms you were opening when you posted your question. The best reason to wear a helmet is to avoid the hostile glare of these self-righteous individuals.
What amazes me is the change in perception that has evolved over helmet usage. When I was a kid, no one wore helmets. Now kids under 13 in NJ are required to wear one. Sometimes I ride without a helmet and other cyclists will give me looks because of it. Why would I ride without a helmet? Because I want to. It's not illegal and It's nobody else's business but mine.
For those members that feel the need to insult cyclists who ride without helmets, I ask you? If you're in a restaurant and see a obese man scarfing down a steak, do you go over and berate him because he is endangering his life and the welfare of his family? Do you ream out motorcyclists because their activity is so stastically dangerous and therefore they are just being ignorant idiots and a*******s? I doubt It.
It's called personal freedom. How much is it worth to you?
Ken kifer has the most intelligent article on helmet usage that I have read. https://www.kenkifer.com/bikepages/advocacy/mhls.htm
By the way, I'm not advocating riding without a helmet. I'm just saying it's your own choice to make.
JDP, obviously you had no idea of the can of worms you were opening when you posted your question. The best reason to wear a helmet is to avoid the hostile glare of these self-righteous individuals.
What amazes me is the change in perception that has evolved over helmet usage. When I was a kid, no one wore helmets. Now kids under 13 in NJ are required to wear one. Sometimes I ride without a helmet and other cyclists will give me looks because of it. Why would I ride without a helmet? Because I want to. It's not illegal and It's nobody else's business but mine.
For those members that feel the need to insult cyclists who ride without helmets, I ask you? If you're in a restaurant and see a obese man scarfing down a steak, do you go over and berate him because he is endangering his life and the welfare of his family? Do you ream out motorcyclists because their activity is so stastically dangerous and therefore they are just being ignorant idiots and a*******s? I doubt It.
It's called personal freedom. How much is it worth to you?
Ken kifer has the most intelligent article on helmet usage that I have read. https://www.kenkifer.com/bikepages/advocacy/mhls.htm
By the way, I'm not advocating riding without a helmet. I'm just saying it's your own choice to make.
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Last edited by thbirks; 07-23-02 at 04:20 PM.
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Hey, it's a free country. Or close. But to me it really is inconceivable how a bike-commuter would elect, choose, opt to not wear such a safety device.
But I won't flame someone who doesn't agree with me.
In my experience, however, the "no-helmeters" are also the same types that travel the opposite direction, have no lights in the dark, ride on sidewalks, and generally act like absolute rookies.
But I won't flame someone who doesn't agree with me.
In my experience, however, the "no-helmeters" are also the same types that travel the opposite direction, have no lights in the dark, ride on sidewalks, and generally act like absolute rookies.
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Originally posted by thbirks
JDP, obviously you had no idea of the can of worms you were opening when you posted your question. The best reason to wear a helmet is to avoid the hostile glare of these self-righteous individuals.
JDP, obviously you had no idea of the can of worms you were opening when you posted your question. The best reason to wear a helmet is to avoid the hostile glare of these self-righteous individuals.
Excellent article, BTW. You can find statistics in there proving that it is more important to wear a helmet while riding in a car than when riding a bicycle. I doubt that anyone on here wears a helmet everytime they get in a car.
Propaganda can achieve amazing things especially when it's "for the children."
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Originally posted by thbirks
[B]William, I think you should reread the forum guidelines.
[B]William, I think you should reread the forum guidelines.
I will disagree with you. I believe he had full knowledge of the results he would attain. In fact, with the exception of me, he was responded to in full civility, I'd say.
The best reason to wear a helmet is to avoid the hostile glare of these self-righteous individuals.
But as you know,
Courage or stupidity will be defined by history.
For those members that feel the need to insult cyclists who ride without helmets, I ask you? If you're in a restaurant and see a obese man scarfing down a steak, do you go over and berate him because he is endangering his life and the welfare of his family? Do you ream out motorcyclists because their activity is so stastically dangerous and therefore they are just being ignorant idiots and a*******s? I doubt It.
It's called personal freedom. How much is it worth to you?
By the way, I'm not advocating riding without a helmet. I'm just saying it's your own choice to make.
And also, it's somewhat a mute point. It's my choice not to be hit when I'm in the bike lane. Yet, if I get hit, what happens? A violation of my choice. Stuff happens.
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Originally posted by Andy Dreisch
In my experience, however, the "no-helmeters" are also the same types that travel the opposite direction, have no lights in the dark, ride on sidewalks, and generally act like absolute rookies.
In my experience, however, the "no-helmeters" are also the same types that travel the opposite direction, have no lights in the dark, ride on sidewalks, and generally act like absolute rookies.
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Originally posted by JDP
the pro- helmet militia
You can find statistics
I doubt that anyone
Propaganda can achieve amazing things especially when it's "for the children."
the pro- helmet militia
You can find statistics
I doubt that anyone
Propaganda can achieve amazing things especially when it's "for the children."
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Ah, the good old helmet wars revisited. JDP, assuming your question was sincere and not a troll (yes, the subject is that touchy), I suggest that you search Google Groups for threads in rec.bicycles.misc regarding helmet usage (or nonusage). You will find no shortage of reading material with many good arguments (and personal attacks too, of course) from both sides. Armed with the knowledge of what helmets are designed for and what their limitations are, you as an adult in a (hopefully) free country can make the decision for yourself.
To the others who have seen fit to flame JDP, (even without bothering to formulate a written reply), I would suggest you read the forum guidelines. Most of the responses were vastly more idiotic than the initial question and follow-up could ever be accused of.
Indeed, there have already been some misconceptions and fallacies regarding helmets already come up in this thread. I'm not going to bother correcting them here as it is a topic more controversial than abortion, religion, politics, gun control and bottom bracket taper-greasing combined.
Here is an interesting article which appeared in the NY times last year, showing how head injuries are increasing, despite increased helmet usage.
https://www.topica.com/lists/massbike...t=d&start=4140
The Bicycle Helmet Safety Institute (pro-helmet)
https://www.bhsi.org/stats.htm/
Another site (anti-helmet):
https://www.magma.ca/~ocbc/hfaq.html
Now, to answer your initial question, yes I wear a foam hat when I ride. No, I don't think you are playing russian roulette simply by not wearing a helmet - how you ride your bicycle is a far, far more important criteria for your risk of injury or death. Yes, I think you should research the subject like so very few people do and make up your own mind. I submit that someone who makes decisions without doing any research on the subject is far more deserving of being called an 'Idiot'.
Now, as a helmet wearer, the differences between a helmet nazi and myself are:
1. I have a realistic idea of what the limitations are (and there are many), what the statistics show (taking the slant from both sides) and I am under no illusions about the amount of protection which exists (if any).
2. I am in favour of personal choice in general. I am not a busybody and I try to avoid telling people what to do. Naturally, I would prefer that any legislation on the topic be based on facts with supporting evidence, rather than an emotional and irrational knee-jerk reaction.
To the others who have seen fit to flame JDP, (even without bothering to formulate a written reply), I would suggest you read the forum guidelines. Most of the responses were vastly more idiotic than the initial question and follow-up could ever be accused of.
Indeed, there have already been some misconceptions and fallacies regarding helmets already come up in this thread. I'm not going to bother correcting them here as it is a topic more controversial than abortion, religion, politics, gun control and bottom bracket taper-greasing combined.
Here is an interesting article which appeared in the NY times last year, showing how head injuries are increasing, despite increased helmet usage.
https://www.topica.com/lists/massbike...t=d&start=4140
The Bicycle Helmet Safety Institute (pro-helmet)
https://www.bhsi.org/stats.htm/
Another site (anti-helmet):
https://www.magma.ca/~ocbc/hfaq.html
Now, to answer your initial question, yes I wear a foam hat when I ride. No, I don't think you are playing russian roulette simply by not wearing a helmet - how you ride your bicycle is a far, far more important criteria for your risk of injury or death. Yes, I think you should research the subject like so very few people do and make up your own mind. I submit that someone who makes decisions without doing any research on the subject is far more deserving of being called an 'Idiot'.
Now, as a helmet wearer, the differences between a helmet nazi and myself are:
1. I have a realistic idea of what the limitations are (and there are many), what the statistics show (taking the slant from both sides) and I am under no illusions about the amount of protection which exists (if any).
2. I am in favour of personal choice in general. I am not a busybody and I try to avoid telling people what to do. Naturally, I would prefer that any legislation on the topic be based on facts with supporting evidence, rather than an emotional and irrational knee-jerk reaction.
Last edited by bikerider; 07-23-02 at 05:25 PM.
#22
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Originally posted by bikerider
Now, to answer your initial question, yes I wear a foam hat when I ride. No, I don't think you are playing russian roulette simply by not wearing a helmet - how you ride your bicycle is a far, far more important criteria for your risk of injury or death. Yes, I think you should research the subject like so very few people do and make up your own mind. I submit that someone who makes decisions without doing any research on the subject is far more deserving of being called an 'Idiot'.
Now, to answer your initial question, yes I wear a foam hat when I ride. No, I don't think you are playing russian roulette simply by not wearing a helmet - how you ride your bicycle is a far, far more important criteria for your risk of injury or death. Yes, I think you should research the subject like so very few people do and make up your own mind. I submit that someone who makes decisions without doing any research on the subject is far more deserving of being called an 'Idiot'.
Incidentally, Can I ask why this thread needed all the cheap insults that people were going on with in the early part? It all seems a little unnecessary to me.
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#23
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Originally posted by JDP
If you have some real world knowledge of where a helmet has helped you or someone you know, that's cool too.
If you have some real world knowledge of where a helmet has helped you or someone you know, that's cool too.
I'm not saying that he would have escaped uninjured if he'd been wearing a helmet. I am sure that he would have had less serious injuries, though.
The time I cracked a helmet, I had a ringing in my ears and a serious headache for a day. It was, I'm sure, a mild concussion. It would have been worse without the helmet. I won't ride without one.
If you want to argue personal freedom, I'll grant you that. I just hope we don't have the same insurance company. I don't want your injury to cost me money. And, yes, there are all sorts of risks each of us takes every day. Riding a bicycle is inherently risky. That doesn't stop me from doing it. Wearing a helmet is a simple way to minimize some of the risk.
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I'm with a2psyklnut. Hit head-on in 1994 (by a bicyclist!) and sustained a concussion DESPITE the helmet. I was doing nothing wrong, going all of ~8 miles per hour up a hill, and there was nothing I could have done to prevent it.
The concussion took a while to set in, so the guy who hit me had already left when I went to pieces (so my friend Chad tells me, I have no memory of it). Chad went to find a phone and call my parents, and some other cyclists found me lying in the grass with my crumpled-up bike, and covered me up with their jerseys in the meantime. The first thing I remember clearly is being put into a neck brace by an EMT an hour later, and rolled onto a body board. What I'm driving at here is that some things happen so fast you don't have any chance to react.
Hit again last year by a car turning left as it came towards me. Nasty grind marks on my face (but no teeth lost, thank goodness), a crunch to the left temple of the helmet since I was thrown face-first onto the pavement... again, I was doing nothing wrong and there was nothing I could have done.
I can't see any reason to not wear a helmet. They're not expensive (US$30 for a light, well-ventilated Bell). Besides, I need something to attach my 3rd Eye mirror to.
The concussion took a while to set in, so the guy who hit me had already left when I went to pieces (so my friend Chad tells me, I have no memory of it). Chad went to find a phone and call my parents, and some other cyclists found me lying in the grass with my crumpled-up bike, and covered me up with their jerseys in the meantime. The first thing I remember clearly is being put into a neck brace by an EMT an hour later, and rolled onto a body board. What I'm driving at here is that some things happen so fast you don't have any chance to react.
Hit again last year by a car turning left as it came towards me. Nasty grind marks on my face (but no teeth lost, thank goodness), a crunch to the left temple of the helmet since I was thrown face-first onto the pavement... again, I was doing nothing wrong and there was nothing I could have done.
I can't see any reason to not wear a helmet. They're not expensive (US$30 for a light, well-ventilated Bell). Besides, I need something to attach my 3rd Eye mirror to.