spinnanz

A bus will cost me $4 each way to work and take at least 45 minutes. A car will cast me about $6 each way and take 12/25 minutes depending on the time of day. A 50cc moped will cost me $1 each way and takes 12 minutes. An ebike will cost me about 10c each way and takes me 18 minutes to get to work. Its more comfortable than an electric scooter, gets me to work faster than a bus, is cheaper than all other forms of transport except non electric hike or bike, and if it ever goes flat, I can pedal. Please explain how an ebike defeats the point of a bike. Find me a better form of commuting and I'll stand corrected.

alan s 

I’m not an e-bike advocate, but it seems to me that the main purpose of a commuter bike is to get you from Point A to Point B. Not clear how an e-bike “defeats the purpose of a bike.”

rollalongnow

Just use a bike.

fooferdoggie 

a e bike is just a bike.

rollalongnow

Its a slow moped with pedals.

fooferdoggie 

nope its a bike does this look like a moped? I have to peddle to go. I just get help still a bike just like recumbents are bikes as are all other bikes. The same thing has been said about any new bike innovation. but now athletes are using e bikes. If you can work as hard on a e bike as a regular bike but go faster and farther is that not a good thing?
my bike will not move without peddling. hard to call that a moped. look at this looks just like a bike rides like a bike

fooferdoggie 

the horror
https://www.cyclevolta.com/story/spo...ning-motoring/

fooferdoggie 

This s pretty good for me. I went farther then planned and ended riding the last 14 miles on the lowest assist level so about the same as a regular bike hard to get your heartbeat up riding a moped. I like to go fast and was averaging 19 mph till I got the the last leg then it was 15 pretty much under my own power.

spinnanz

​​​​​​To get to work, for the sake of 10c I'd rather get there twice as fast and not sweating my balls off.

iechega

I did get an e-bike for daily commuting, a Specialized Turbo Como 5.0, and it works like a charm for what I need. I go to work in suit/tie/dress shoes so the motor is great for not breaking a sweat in the hot and humid summer of Lima, Peru. Cheers!

2old

In CA and many other states this e-bike is defined as a bike by state law. There is no good reason why it's not feasible for commuting, but don't try to convince the "purist-haters" of that. There is no rationale that will satisfy them. They're pretty much banned from responding on the e-forum, so bring their bilge here. If they want to ride unassisted, nobody cares.

fooferdoggie 

I saw the same thing when I had a recumbent. Of course this elitism did not stop a roadie from drafting behind me when I was feeling good and doing 27 on a bike path (G)

Darth Lefty 

Heresy and schism!

tjspiel

We should be clear about how E-bikes are being used in this article. The guy who is getting the training is not riding an e-bike. They put other riders on e-bikes to make him work harder, - because they otherwise would not be able to challenge him. Sort of how like some runners will train by trying to keep pace with someone on a bike.

In my opinion, by putting a motor on a bike you're changing it in a pretty fundamental way, - whether it's just assisting you or providing all of the propulsion. However, it's still a bike.

Sailing is another hobby of mine. Many sailboats, particularly large ones, have motors. They are often used in ports where maneuvering in tight quarters under sail would be very difficult. But people will also use them to get somewhere upwind which would be more work and take more time with sails. And sometimes other sailers will see that as "cheating". Also there's a huge difference in sailing large boats with motors vs small boats without. They have a lot in common but there are fundamental differences that make them very different experiences.

Anyway, if an e-bike works for you why do you care if someone else considers it a "real bike" or not? Just use it.

Darth Lefty 

I wonder if there were people in 1895 going on in letters to the editor about how adding a motor to a bike spoiled it

wphamilton

I'd ride an ebike sometimes if I had one. Probably get lazy and kick in the motor on every hill and speed on the way down.

I don't think you're including the battery cost in your calculations though. I think a moped is overall cheaper to use.

rivers

My wife has an e-bike that she uses mainly for commuting, but occasionally out on days out with me and our dog. She is a self-employed fitness instructor. An e-bike allows her to get to work between venues in a relatively quick manner while a)not killing herself physically (she does that for a living), and b) taking a fair amount of kit with her. She still has to pedal, and assist cuts out at 15.5 mph. It also allows for her to come out all day with me, and not wear herself out. She sets the pace, and away we go. We alternate having the dog in the trailer attached to our bikes. I think e-bikes are a great tool for getting people who otherwise wouldn't be out on bikes on a bike. Before she was a fitness instructor, she was a professional dancer. Her body has taken a beating over the years and an e-bike helps her enjoy riding a bike.

I sometimes use it for commuting when my legs need a break as well.

spinnanz

what battery cost? The above is what it costs me to charge. The above also don't include road tax cost of $128 per year for a moped or $89 for a car.

wphamilton

Your battery only lasts for 300-500 full charge cycles. Figure out how many miles that is, and then when you replace it you have to add that to the cost per mile. Or else retire the e-bike, but it's not all that many miles.

Look at it this way: it's a resource that you use up, a little bit for every mile. Whether that resource is a tank-full of gas or a battery pack, it still costs you.

fooferdoggie 

your way off on that number a cheap battery may have 1000 cycles but a good battery should be over 1500

wphamilton

I'm not even a little off.

It's possible to get that many full-charge equivalent cycles, if you only use about 60% of its capacity. Normal use, 300-500 full charge cycles is the limit. Unless you're putting up with capacity that has degraded to maybe half charges or less.

But let's say it really was 1000 cycles - what's your point? It's still probably cheaper long term to use a gasoline moped. Do the math, show me where I'm wrong.

fooferdoggie 

actually we both are but it depends on the battery. here is the info on my Bosch and it is old. Bosch actually guarantee their batteries for 2 years or 500 charge cycles(whichever comes first). This doesn't mean your battery will pack up after 2 years and 1 day. In fact Bosch themselves state that the battery should be good for around 8-9 years or 1000 full charge cycles.Dec 22, 2013

wphamilton

Take the latter with a grain of salt and look up the specs and performance testing of 18650 batteries.

fooferdoggie 

bosch is known for their very long battery life.

spinnanz

The cells of my ebike are rated at 600 to 1000 full charge cycles. Let's assume the worst and its 600 full charges and my 1/3 cell usage each ride equates to 1800 partial charges. For me that equates to 32,400km. That's almost 8 years of commuting to and from work. At those km I'd expect to replace the battery for $600. A moped, I would expect to need some sort of rebuild at those km as well, with the parts likely cheaper than an ebike battery however when you add in the labour cost to get the moped rebuilt it would be at least as much as the battery cost. Even if costs were the same, I'd have saved 8 years road costs ($712) and $1.80 each commute (1800x commutes to and from work will be $3600 in gas on the moped, vs $360 on the ebkke). So Im still calling an ebike cheaper than a moped for commuting.