Iride01 

Lock nut became locknut a long time ago here in the USA. It's more common here to see OLD. Over Locknut Dimension than it is to see OLN or Over Lock Nut. Though I suppose both are fine, but most of us will assume you also use the word tyre instead of tire for that piece of rubber that hits the road. <grin>

You have two similar threads going with a slight variation. However without the specifics added to your question as to exactly what brand and model of components you are trying to fit together, we can only make general statements.

I had a bike I put a wider freewheel on with more gears that needed 130 spacing as the small sprocket rubbed the stay. Or was it the chain? Any how, adding a spacer to the drive side made that 126 mm wide OLD into about 128 or 129 OLD and stopped the rub.

It was a steel bike and there was plenty of flex in the stays to not have to cold set it. Removing and reinstalling the wheel it did get easier over time. So maybe the bike did adjust itself over time.

So if you put a 130mm OLD hub in a 126mm bike, and it doesn't have spacers you can remove to make if fit a smaller rear spacing, you might have to add a spacer of a mm or two and live with a drop out spacing being more than 130mm wide of the actual hub if anything rubs. And of course dish, chain line and all sorts of other things get affected. But those are on going to be a few mm. So maybe not a worry, or maybe they will be a worry. You are in try it and see territory. Or, be safe and get the stuff that works together. Even if that includes a new bike.

KCT1986

Thanks for the info on hub model. Here is the tech doc.



In it's stock state, the left to right tension imbalance should be about 55% (based on center of hub flange to center of hub flange, assuming 3mm flange thickness). Reducing it to 126mm by just reducing the left side would bring the left side tension to about 47%. Whether this is an issue will depend on: the intended use of the wheel, weight of rider/bike, rim strength, spoke count, etc.

As mentioned previously, doing the reduction on both the right and left will mitigate some of the reduction in the tension imbalance. Here is an older post that explains it. (Thank you Miamijim). The first few post are worth a read (and re-read until it makes sense)

10-speeds on a 126mm hub SUCCESS - Bike Forums

The amount that you can reduce the right side will depend on the cassette you intend to use. A 10 speed cassette with an offset inner sprocket (on a carrier) like a Shimano DA or Ultegra will be narrower and allow more reduction on the right side.

Here is Shimano's standard spec for 8/9/10 speed freehubs (40.75mm to the locknut/dropout). Depending on the cassette intended, a couple of mm reduction may be possible.

smd4

I have 7700 hubs on an older Cinelli. There was a little extra effort required to remove and replace the wheel, and I dealt with that for years, so technically you don’t need to mess with spacers. If you don’t want to deal with shortening the axle or cold setting the frame, you’ll be perfectly fine.

smd4

I never had hanger or index shifting issues…just more of a PIA to remove/reinstall the wheel.

cb400bill

Duplicate threads merged

rccardr 

These are always interesting discussions, and they pop up every year or two.
Always two camps:
A) If you don’t cold set your frame to 130mm your bike will explode!
B) Done it dozens of times over decades and tens of thousands of miles. No problems!

Discuss.
Also: Grant Petersen.

Kontact 

C) You can insert the wheel with cold setting, and it will be fine.

TC1

If the chainstays are 425mm long, widening their spread from 126 to 130mm only changes the dropout angle by a bit over a quarter of a degree. I can easily imagine that small tilt being totally insignificant -- as it has been in my experience.

70sSanO

What are you even talking about? I never said dropouts could not be spread to 130mm. Nothing explodes.

I’ve cold set steel frames before. But that doesn’t mean it is possible to just shove, not cold set, a 130mm hub into any 126mm dropout frame and it will be fine.

And I’ve had to square the dropouts on a frame that was spread because they flared out. Not a big deal.

You do realize that if the dropouts flare so does the hanger?

John

TC1

You wrote:

You specifically said that you "can't imagine" a bicycle with a retrofit 9 to 11 speed hub not having issues related to the new angle of the derailleur hanger, unless the dropouts were re-aligned.

I, and others, pointed out why your imagination is faulty. Specifically, it does not appear that you have a solid grasp on small the dropout angle change is.

70sSanO

I still can’t imagine someone forcing a 10 speed (130mm) or 11 speed (131mm) wheel into 126mm dropouts and not having to do some alignment.

The exception everyone took to what I said was that spreading/cold setting of the frame should be done. I haven’t worked in a shop, but I can’t image a bike mechanic just shoving a wheel in and handing it back to a customer with a bill.

I’ll stand by what I said.

John

TC1

Your imagination remains insufficient for this problem, apparently. What, precisely, do you propose that a bike mechanic should measure the frame with, in order to tweak out that quarter-degree of misalignment? That requires measuring the spread to within hundredths of a millimeter, at precise locations. 9 mechanics out of 10 would probably make the alignment worse, rather than better, if they even tried to change it.

Whether or not it is appropriate for a professional mechanic to mount a wheel in a manner not intended by the maker is a whole 'nother question entirely.

70sSanO

I would expect a mechanic would spread/cold set the dropouts and check the alignment of the frame and dropouts to make sure it was square.

I expect someone proficient in their craft will take the rudimentary steps I would take.

John

Kontact 

I think what you are missing is that the axle ends and the QR are forcing the dropouts back to parallel. The clamping force necessary to retain a wheel - especially in a horizontal dropout - is much greater than the spring force of the dropouts. So putting a 130 hub in 126 frame bends the stays in an S, as they bend out near the BB/brake bridge, and then bend back in close to the dropout. Which means the hanger is aligned as well if it was before the hub was put in.

But if you are cold setting the frame, you should spread the stays and then align the dropouts to finish. (Also an S curve.) However, as TC1 points out, it isn't much angle, and requires very little of the alignment tool.

70sSanO

‘86 Univega with horizontal dropouts and late 80’s Deore QR’s.

Even with that setup I needed to straighten dropouts to keep the rear wheel from shifting and rubbing on the NDS chainstay under heavy load. My first lesson that not everything always works the way you think it should.

John

Kontact 

And that was going from 126 to 130?

70sSanO

Yes. Things do happen. Nothing is absolute.

John

TC1

As explained a couple times previously: Even if necessary, squaring dropouts after a cold-set from 126 to 130 on a 27" or 700c frame is anything but rudimentary. I have some quite nice metrology instruments, and it would take me some significant time and effort to align dropouts to a precision greater than a quarter-degree. I also doubt that frames other than very high-end models were even originally built with smaller tolerances than what we are discussing here. I further doubt that very many cast dropouts are even manufactured to sufficient tolerances to make this discussion meaningful.

Since you are so proficient in your craft, perhaps you can share with us your technique. How did you establish a reference plane from which to measure the required adjustment for each dropout?

Kontact 

TC1

You seemingly misunderstood the problem that needs solving. We don't need to find the midpoint between the dropouts, we need to find the reference plane that bisects the bicycle frame fore to aft. From that plane, we can then measure how far we need to adjust each dropout.

If our dropouts are already cockeyed -- which is the problem we are trying to solve -- they cannot be the basis for our measurement to correct that problem.

smd4

You seemingly misunderstand the problem. He’s showing how to align dropouts with the proper tool, not the midpoint between the dropouts.

Maybe you’ve never used these tools?

bboy314

This tool is made for exactly what you’re describing.

TC1

Not if the dropouts are parallel, but not square.

More to the point, one still has to measure -- precisely parallel to the axle -- to hundredth of a millimeter precision.

TC1

No, it is not. That tool does nothing whatsoever to find the reference plane with respect to the frame. If one is lucky, and the chainstays are perfectly aligned, this tool might coincidentally arrive at that reference plane, but luck is not a strategy.

Kontact 

The dropouts are points in space that are equidistant from the BB and the seat cluster. Then the dropouts are centered to the plane of the bike by comparison to the seat and head tubes. THEN, the dropout tools are used to make the dropouts parallel by making two lines perpendicular to the flats of the dropouts intersect and parallel.