ThermionicScott 

@abshipp, if you're interested in ideas, there was no way that full-width fenders were going to fit between the chainstays of my Sport SX, either. I trimmed off the corners, filed the edges smooth, leaving a tang for connecting with the chainstay bridge. Crummy pictures follow:




You can also see my amateurish chainstay dimples to give a little more breathing room around the tires.

abshipp 

That's the plan!

What did you use to dimple your stays? I wasn't planning on trying to dimple the stays, but considering I had to spread the frame out to 132mm for the rear wheel, I'm a little more open to more modification now

ThermionicScott 

132mm, wow. And I haven't taken any of my frames past 126mm yet.

There are a lot of elegant and inelegant methods out there for dimpling the stays, mine is somewhere in the middle. I took a spare pair of vise-grips and ground out one jaw to be smooth and more or less the radius of the outside of a chainstay, then padded it with a few layers of duct tape. I also ground one side of an 11/16" wrench to be rounded and smooth, and so my process is to place the rounded side of the wrench where I want to make the dimple, open up the vise-grips a bunch to fit around the chainstay and inner face of the wrench, and then gently squeeze. I try to only do a little at a time, and you don't have to make a deep impression on the inside of the chainstay to open up a decent amount of tire clearance. Afterward, it's a good idea to double-check your dropout alignment.

mountaindave 

ThermionicScott 

I'm not opposed to using 8-, maybe 9-speed stuff someday, but I've got a pile of 7-speed cassette hubs and other parts, and they've always treated me well. Also, the stuff takes damn forever to wear out, so I just happen to keep riding the same drivetrains year after year.

noobinsf 

mountaindave 

79pmooney

I did similar to my ti fix gear, (True, not a real C & V but it is what we would have raced in the late 1980s had freewheels and gears never been invented.) On that bike, the chainstays are just as tight as yours and there was one slight "oops" on the construction. The chainstay brace got located too far back, making getting larger tired wheels in hard and limiting how far forward you could slide the hub. The remedy that worked beautifully was to carve an arc out of the back of the brace and weld in an artfully bent ellipse of titanium plate. Then this was countersunk from the rear. I do just as you did with the fender except I run it forward of the brace, nut forward of the fender. Works beautifully and looks really clean. Access looks too tight but is in reality easy once you know how. (Designing that fender was a challenge. It has to accommodate 2" of travel for the hub and be broken at the brake. And easy to take on and off. The end result took two fenders and a lot of hours, but the end result is worth it.)

Edit: my fenders were silver plastic SKS so the trimming was easy. To stretch the fender to make it long enough for the wheel travel, I cut the fender sides in two places about 8" apart near the top of the wheel, spread the fender a little and laminated carbon fiber and fiberglass to the underside ot the fender at the cuts. It was really hard to get all the distortion out of the fender at the bends but the end result is rigid, sturdy and works well.
.
Ben

abshipp 

What better way to spend a rainy Saturday than installing some fenders?

Velo Orange 50mm Snakeskin fenders
VO Randonneur front rack, modified with rack strut attached to brake hole
Acorn Tall Rando Bag

Clearance is adequate on the front, and just a tiny bit tighter than I would prefer on the rear end. Definitely suitable for staying on paved roads, and maybe some light gravel riding as well.

JT1973

mountaindave 

Nice fender lines! How does she ride with a load? I have had trouble with large frames and front loads on medium trail bikes = shimmy.

Kilroy1988 

I'm planning to revamp my 1980 Raleigh Super Course 12 as a 650B conversion, and was wondering what kind of side-pull brake calipers would be recommended? The bike came with horribly squishy Weinmann somethings that I would not even put back on if they fit... Thanks!

-Gregory

beicster 

If your 1980 shares the same frame build as my 79, then Tektro 559's will work.

Kilroy1988 

Cool, thanks! And I don't see why I would, but just to check... I wouldn't have any issues hooking up calipers like that to an old pair of Guidonnet levers, right? Such as the ones below:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Guidonnet-B...cAAMXQaBtQ~etI

Also, could someone point me towards a stock 650B wheel set that will be compatible with a 6-speed cassette (Suntour, for example)? Ideally something that comes with with 122mm (as per the frame) or 126mm rear hub spacing. Thanks again!

-Gregory

beicster 

I can't comment on the levers but the link below goes to an Amazon search where you can purchase a set for about $80. You get what you pay for and they come spaced at 135 but you can remove some of the spacers and/or substitute a set of thinner locknuts. This is the set I first bought when I converted my Super Course. They aren't the best quality, but they still work about 9 or 10 months later.

https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_n...s=sta+tru+650b

abshipp 

Thank you! I've spent a lot of time massaging the fit to be as close to perfect as possible. I really can't stand bad fender lines.

The Tempo does surprisingly well with the front load. I have not loaded up the front with more than 5 pounds or so (the bag is 2 pounds itself), but it does not have a tendency to shimmy until you start getting up to around 20 mph. Even then, it's not terrible. I think that the headset preload might be just a hair tighter than it "should" be, so that may contribute. The 650B conversion did something to it as well, it was less well behaved (but still manageable) on 700x25C tires than on the 650x38C ones it has now.

My 1977 Super Le Tour had the same bag/rack setup on it for a while with 700x28 tires, but the weight on the front turned it into an absolute noodle and would shimmy at the slightest provocation.

I really don't notice the weight up front much anymore, this bike is my main road ride so I guess I've just gotten used to it. Which is good, because while I would like to try a low-trail bike at some point, I don't have any negative handling characteristics right now that are forcing me to need to make changes to the geometry.

ThermionicScott 

Sure, they're more like 8-9 inches. I don't know much about vice grip sizing, I just grabbed a redundant pair and took them to the bench grinder until one of the jaw faces was pretty smooth and roughly the radius of a chainstay.

mountaindave 

Kilroy1988 

Thanks! Did you re-space your drop out or change the spacers on your wheels, or a bit of both? Considering the budget of my build I'd be fine with using these. I've essentially got all of the other components already from the original Super Course specs or a donor bike, all of which adds up to nothing too special. I just want to join the 650B club!

Your signature actually isn't appearing for me. Maybe the settings changed with the recent update on the site?

I'm definitely considering going with those Sta Tru wheels posted above, even if I have to do re-spacing (which I've done before and don't fear doing on this relatively common frame) or messing with the axle spacers. Cheers!

-Gregory

beicster 

I had crammed a 130 spaced 700c wheelset in there originally which required some cussing to get it in the dropouts. When the new 650b wheelset came, even though the ad claimed it was spaced at 130, it was actually 135. I knew that would not work so I took about 4 or 5 mm off each end of the axle. I had an old hub with thinner lock nuts and an assortment of other axle spacers that I substituted in. I have a cheapie vernier caliper so I was able to measure everything to get it basically correctly centered. I thought I might need to file the axle down so that the quick release could close, but the ends were deep enough to handle the extra extension.

BTW-Coincidentally I measured the dropouts this weekend and they are about 123mm apart.

ThermionicScott 

I keep feeling like there's an unmet need for "mid-grade" 650B wheels. There's the super-cheap wheels with single-walled rims, 36 straight-gauge spokes, and 135mm "hybrid" hubs that are good for someone looking to get their feet wet. And you can get great modern sporty wheelsets from Pacenti or a custom handbuilder for $$$. But not much in between that's also C&V-friendly.

Every so often, I get the itch to build another wheel, and wonder if I should build up a few "my way" and offer them for sale. But then I wonder if I or another C&Ver would be willing to pay what that's worth. ($150 or more in parts alone for each wheel.) Hmm.

mountaindave 

Kilroy1988 

Still can't see the sig line, sir!

Totally noob question... When I see cheaper tires advertised as 650b they are also often listed as 26x1 1/2". Is this the same size? Would these Sunlite tires fit in 650b rims?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Sunlite-Str...QAAOSwK~RZ8mjL

Again, I realize the quality is on the low end, but I am on a budget and simply want to get this Super Course back on the road sporting 650b wheels. Cheers!

-Gregory

ThermionicScott 

JT1973