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Recommandations for Alloy deep-rim wheelset for tandem ?

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Recommandations for Alloy deep-rim wheelset for tandem ?

Old 04-06-20, 11:26 AM
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Recommandations for Alloy deep-rim wheelset for tandem ?

Looking for recommandations for good alloy deep-rim wheelset for road tandem ? (40 to 55 mm; rim brake)
Thanks !
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Old 04-06-20, 03:21 PM
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EERO | H PLUS SON or SL42 | H PLUS SON

Come with NMSW or MSW, I built a pair of these, 36 spokes on Hope hubs, they ride like a dream and look good to
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Old 04-06-20, 03:24 PM
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This is how they look built up
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Old 04-06-20, 04:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Juke41 View Post
EERO | H PLUS SON or SL42 | H PLUS SON

Come with NMSW or MSW, I built a pair of these, 36 spokes on Hope hubs, they ride like a dream and look good to
Looks like you're using discs.
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Old 04-06-20, 04:57 PM
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I don't think there's any such thing. We've been using 36H Kinlin XC 279, but can't get them anymore. Wonderful rim for rim brakes. Aforce AL33 rims from Bikehubstore are available, but only up to 32H. 32.5mm deep X 23mm outside. I built up the 24H version of these for the rear on a single bike, but depending on weight 24H might not be good for a tandem. I don't know of a suitable 36H deep alu rim on the market right now. If anyone does, please reply. I'll run out of my stock of Kinlins in another year or two.
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Old 04-06-20, 06:15 PM
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Originally Posted by SpinnerPC View Post
Looking for recommandations for good alloy deep-rim wheelset for road tandem ? (40 to 55 mm; rim brake)
Thanks !
How come you want an alloy rim so deep? If youíre going for aerodynamic drag reduction, youíre better off matching the width of your tire to the rim. The DT RR511, Kinlin XR31T, HED Belgium +, Velocity Cliffhanger are solid choices at 23, 24, 25, and 30mm widths, respectively.

Keeping with the 40-55mm goal, youíre limited to H+Son SL42 and a host of copies of it. At 19mm wide externally, itís aero benefit is limited to 18-21mm tires. The SL42 does make a good heatsink, though.

Further down that rabbit hole, there are loads of 50mm deep x 20mm wide rims in tons of colors for the fixie crowd from ~12 years ago. Those rims weigh about 900-1100g each (or twice what normal rims weigh).

Finally, if you want an aero advantage, but wonít be cooking the rims on hills, you can get carbon rims with an alloy braking surface. These are generally available in 23 and 25mm widths and 38, 50, 60, and 80mm depths. Youíd generally have to get those straight from the manufacturer or your wheel builder. Iím fairly confident that a tandem team could melt the epoxy on these if youíre not careful.
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Old 04-07-20, 10:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Juke41 View Post
This is how they look built up
Looks good ! What is the tire size ?
I'd like to mount a 700x30C or 32C like the Conti Grand Prix 5000. Your SL42 would be too narrow
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Old 04-07-20, 11:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Carbonfiberboy View Post
I don't think there's any such thing. We've been using 36H Kinlin XC 279, but can't get them anymore. Wonderful rim for rim brakes. Aforce AL33 rims from Bikehubstore are available, but only up to 32H. 32.5mm deep X 23mm outside. I built up the 24H version of these for the rear on a single bike, but depending on weight 24H might not be good for a tandem. I don't know of a suitable 36H deep alu rim on the market right now. If anyone does, please reply. I'll run out of my stock of Kinlins in another year or two.
About 25 years ago, on a single road bike, I used to ride a pair of Campagnolo Zonda alloy deep-rim 28H wheelset. These were undestructible. And I would not have been afraid to ride with them on the tandem. But I sold them long ago, and Campy does not make the same wheel anymore.
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Old 04-07-20, 11:09 AM
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Originally Posted by OneIsAllYouNeed View Post
How come you want an alloy rim so deep? If youíre going for aerodynamic drag reduction, youíre better off matching the width of your tire to the rim. The DT RR511, Kinlin XR31T, HED Belgium +, Velocity Cliffhanger are solid choices at 23, 24, 25, and 30mm widths, respectively.

Keeping with the 40-55mm goal, youíre limited to H+Son SL42 and a host of copies of it. At 19mm wide externally, itís aero benefit is limited to 18-21mm tires. The SL42 does make a good heatsink, though.

Further down that rabbit hole, there are loads of 50mm deep x 20mm wide rims in tons of colors for the fixie crowd from ~12 years ago. Those rims weigh about 900-1100g each (or twice what normal rims weigh).

Finally, if you want an aero advantage, but wonít be cooking the rims on hills, you can get carbon rims with an alloy braking surface. These are generally available in 23 and 25mm widths and 38, 50, 60, and 80mm depths. Youíd generally have to get those straight from the manufacturer or your wheel builder. Iím fairly confident that a tandem team could melt the epoxy on these if youíre not careful.
Thanks for your reply. We mostly ride our tandem around where we live and there's no long hills; mostly rolling or flat. Some sharp pitches (12-20% for less than 500m). On the flat we regularly have a cruising speed of 35-40 Kmh so the explanation for aero wheels. I do want a 'wider' rim to accomodate 700x28C to 700x32C. For my road and TT bikes, I own a few sets or Carbon wheels ranging from 32 to 88 mm. But since the tandem has only rim brakes, I would not consider carbon wheels.
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Old 04-07-20, 11:43 AM
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They are Conti Grand Prix 700 x 28mm, 98% of our riding is on tarmac roads, no complaints from the stoker !
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Old 04-07-20, 01:10 PM
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How many spokes do your current hubs have? My guess is 36. If so, would you consider going down to 32 and new hubs? My guess is that spoke count would be fine up to team weight maybe 350 lbs? Then you could use the Aforce rims which have the advantage of being available.
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Old 04-08-20, 04:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Carbonfiberboy View Post
How many spokes do your current hubs have? My guess is 36. If so, would you consider going down to 32 and new hubs? My guess is that spoke count would be fine up to team weight maybe 350 lbs? Then you could use the Aforce rims which have the advantage of being available.
Actual wheelset is Mavic T520 40 spokes. Wheels are great for touring and commuting. But an additionnal and more performant wheelset would be nice for our 'sportive' ride. I'd like to find a strong alloy deep-rim with at least 28 spokes. Combine weight is about 320 lbs ( captain 6'4" 210 + stoker 5'3" 110 ) I read somewhere A-Force are limited to 125kg.
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Old 04-08-20, 04:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Juke41 View Post
They are Conti Grand Prix 700 x 28mm, 98% of our riding is on tarmac roads, no complaints from the stoker !
If I may ask, what is your combined weight ?
Would you have a wider rim, still having a 40+mm depth ?
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Old 04-08-20, 08:00 AM
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Spiraling in on the solution here. For perceivable aerodynamic improvement, I'd recommend the Velocity Cliffhanger, 32 bladed spokes (I build with Sapim CX-Sprint for most of my tandem wheels), and a tire that's labelled 25-28mm. The tire will balloon up to 30-32mm inflated on those rims. Hubs: either White Industries XMR or DT Swiss 350.
For a lifetime of durability, same as above with 36 spokes.

For *looking* aero, go with the Aforce AL33 with 32 spokes. They're optimized for 23mm tires. With 30mm tires, they're just as aero as box rims.

For a lighter weight solution that looks aero (but really isn't), go with the Kinlin XR31T rims. They'll spin up faster than the other options here, but your cruising speed and top speed will be lower than with the Cliffhangers.
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Old 04-08-20, 08:49 AM
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Here's a Velocity Blunt SS rim with a Conti GP4000S II 28mm tire. The Blunt SS has the same outer width (30mm) as the Cliffhanger, and is slightly wider internally (26.6 vs 25mm).
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Old 04-08-20, 10:47 AM
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Originally Posted by OneIsAllYouNeed View Post
Here's a Velocity Blunt SS rim with a Conti GP4000S II 28mm tire. The Blunt SS has the same outer width (30mm) as the Cliffhanger, and is slightly wider internally (26.6 vs 25mm).
That looks really nice. Velocity is locked down, not shipping for the duration. Any stocking dealers?

Besides areo, there are two other reasons for running deep alu rums: heat dissipation, and stiffness. Those two things IMO are way more important than the tiny aero contribution. On a tandem, the percent drag reduction is much less than on a single. Before I realized how large the heat dissipation advantage would be, we blew a few tires off shallower rims. For us, it's heat, stiffness, aero, in that order.

Even though the Velocity website is currently non-functional, one can still see the pages for the individual rims by googling the rim designation. That Blunt SS is only 425g.
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Old 04-08-20, 10:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Carbonfiberboy View Post
That looks really nice. Velocity is locked down, not shipping for the duration. Any stocking dealers?

Besides areo, there are two other reasons for running deep alu rums: heat dissipation, and stiffness. Those two things IMO are way more important than the tiny aero contribution. On a tandem, the percent drag reduction is much less than on a single. Before I realized how large the heat dissipation advantage would be, we blew a few tires off shallower rims. For us, it's heat, stiffness, aero, in that order.

Even though the Velocity website is currently non-functional, one can still see the pages for the individual rims by googling the rim designation. That Blunt SS is only 425g.
QBP and BWP have inventory of many Velocity rims. I imagine many LBS have a random smattering.

The OP didn't seem overly concerned about long descents. That said, the Cliffhanger is a heavy rim with a good amount of surface area. It would be totally fine for a loaded touring tandem.

To be clear, I don't recommend the Blunt SS for most tandem teams. It's a *really* light rim. It wouldn't hold up under heavy use with a team over 250lb. I presented pictures of the Blunt SS because I had them from wheels I built for a friend's gravel bike. The Cliffhanger and Blunt SS have almost the same outer dimensions, so its a fair pictorial estimate.
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Old 04-08-20, 11:18 AM
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Originally Posted by OneIsAllYouNeed View Post
QBP and BWP have inventory of many Velocity rims. I imagine many LBS have a random smattering.

The OP didn't seem overly concerned about long descents. That said, the Cliffhanger is a heavy rim with a good amount of surface area. It would be totally fine for a loaded touring tandem.

To be clear, I don't recommend the Blunt SS for most tandem teams. It's a *really* light rim. It wouldn't hold up under heavy use with a team over 250lb. I presented pictures of the Blunt SS because I had them from wheels I built for a friend's gravel bike. The Cliffhanger and Blunt SS have almost the same outer dimensions, so its a fair pictorial estimate.
We toured on Velocity Deep Vs, 550g and Kinlin XC279, 490g. We have a touring wheel with a Arai drum though. Wouldn't tour a rim-brake tandem into unknown terrain without it. The Cliffhanger is 675g, but is an essentially box-section rim.

The Aforce is 26mm outside, 505g, seems like the best on the market right now. 32H. Too bad the ceramic version doesn't come in 32H.
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