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Culture change

Old 05-03-20, 08:26 PM
  #126  
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Killing economy 2

the current NOeconomy is an illusion supported by a hyper inflated stock market(s) that upwardly redistribute wealth > wealth that is derived for the most part from from abstract concepts of connectivity ... maybe it was some "mad man" who cooked it up not to kill people but to sicken the beast that is destroying the planet
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Old 05-04-20, 10:04 AM
  #127  
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Originally Posted by rossiny View Post
any economy that is built on killing earth will self destruct, probably in 1 or 2 generations .
A system based on selling like over 70 million cars per year , and airline industry where the jumbo jet pulls up with people packed in like sardines and fills up with 36000 gallons of fuel .
Also who the hell is jet setting around daily ? Yeah very sustainable. Multiply this by how many billion people have increased since like 1930 and the mathematical part is even scarier.
I agree with just about all you have said in recent posts. I can agree with much of this one as well, however, "killing earth" is not an easy assignment. It will not happen in 1 or 2 generations. We have been at 'earth killing' for at least six generations but it took technological developments of the last 50 or so years to be impactful enough on biological systems that the Earth was actually threatened. Even now though, we threaten Humanity more than we threaten the Planet. Jumbo Jets have all been retired. Airbus A380's will be retired ASAP. Actually, there is a good chance that international air travel is a thing of the past. But domestic automobile transportation will increase going forward and that is not a good development.
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Old 05-04-20, 10:44 AM
  #128  
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Originally Posted by 350htrr View Post
The only reason that there is a Lockdown/a 6' separation law, IMO is to keep the health care system from collapsing... It is NOT going to stop the spread, it is NOT going to stop the virus, it is meant to slow it down, IMO it is here to stay... and... we will end up dealing with it, just like the flue virus, a certain % will die and the rest will live... it"s that simple. as I see it anyways..
Originally Posted by Mobile 155 View Post
If your assumption is correct then the plan and the experts that made it are as far off as the peak oil, total melting of the polar ice caps and Manhattan being under water. If saving the health care system was a reason then there must be some interesting board meetings going on by now. https://www.salon.com/2020/04/18/cas...aff-shortages/

Whatever conspiracy theories we might have, and yes I have heard the one about this being an attempt by the UN and WHO to equalize the worlds wealth. I am not as interested in that as I am in how we are going to look at transportation and human density in the future. While some have been hording toilet paper, pasta, beans and hand sanitizer others have cleared the shelves of gun stores of ammunition and weapons.(google it) It does not sound like we are coming together on this to me.

My question hasn't changed. Are we going to modify dense housing, dense transportation and maximum capacity for restaurants, sporting events and movies or might we learn to watch movies and sporting events from home with no people at the event? I will confess to a slight feeling of dread as the lift the shelter in place and we have to drive into Dallas to visit the my wife's pain management doctor. By the way I also wondered why Covid 19 closed the country and the flu season didn't? Because I am pretty sure subways, buses and trains are just as bad for spreading the flu as it is this virus.
OMG! Seriously? Did you call the earlier posters statement an assumption? They happen to be correct! Unlike the "Spanish Flu" (which actually originated in Kansas!) which took place in 1918/19, a time before embedded local and international media scrutiny, the Covid-19 outbreak is being covered 24/7 in excruciating detail. Modern sensibilities would be decimated by the spectacle of rows and rows of bodybags outside hospital centers. Hospitals that despite two decades of warnings by public health experts, shut down all their overcapacity to maximize profits.

What does that even mean that you are "more interested in how we are going to look at transportation and human density in the future"? Sorry, it is TOO LATE to return to living in prarie style bungalows separated by acres of farmland. We never lived like that even when the Mayflower sailed. From the beginning there were densely (relatively) populated colonies of people living communally. Of course there were the roamers and isolationists who COULD live like that because 'essential workers' in the cities brought them the things they could NOT provide for themselves out in whatever bumfart hollow or glen they removed themselves to.

Socially distanced, Rhode Island (our smallest state) can hold the entire planet (7.5B!) population. Let that sink in. Covid took off in Western countries because mask wearing is stigmatized. Even as many jurisdictions are mandating masks in public life, just as many are outlawing the wearing of masks in public. SMH. What a conflicted, contradictary MESS. Manhattan is NOT underwater, obviously. No one ever said it would be. The U.S. Navy has, however, had to evacuate their base on the Marshall Islands. The permafrost runways of the U.S. Navy and Airforce bases in the Arctic ARE melting and will soon become inoperable. Why are you even on a forum called "Living Car Free" if you are a climate change denyer?
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Old 05-04-20, 11:17 AM
  #129  
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So ... what doya's imagine the total cost of paying 80% of the wages of everyone laid off due to Covid? Here we have a national crisis that threatens the future of the country and we are harranging about single digit Trillions of dollars while the 0.01 percent sit tight on double digit Trillions and we don't even dare ask. WTF? What if this? What if that? When will this? When will that? We don't know much, do we. We've had the Common Cold around for decades. SARS-Cov-1 is a Coronavirus. MERS is a coronavirus. At some time vaccines were contemplated for all these illnesses but the R&D was scrapped because ED drugs were taking up all the oxygen at the shareholders meetings. Masks and social distancing are ALL we have to fight this thing with because of the deliberate refusal of Big Pharma to hitch up their britches and actually work on a cure. Not a vaccine, a CURE. As I understand it, Covid is on track to kill a couple hundred thousand people worldwide. Because of the worldwide unpreparedness and fallback to a total lockdown strategy of curve flattening over 1B, 1.1B to be exact, that is Billion, over one billion humans are going to die in the next several weeks to months from Covid related economic disaster. As I write this, thousands are starving to death in India. They don't have Covid but lockdown policies have destroyed their livelihoods and thus their ability to obtain food. India has billionaires. Few countries don't have even one. Just saying ...
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Old 05-04-20, 11:35 AM
  #130  
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Well now, I certainly am not a climate change denier... What I said to rossiny was that climate change is a different topic and as to this topic (culture change) I didn't think much is going to change, other than the virus will spread like any other virus and the world will learn to live with/put up with, all the deaths just like we are doing with the flu virus...
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Old 05-04-20, 12:12 PM
  #131  
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Originally Posted by 350htrr View Post
Well now, I certainly am not a climate change denier... What I said to rossiny was that climate change is a different topic and as to this topic (culture change) I didn't think much is going to change, other than the virus will spread like any other virus and the world will learn to live with/put up with, all the deaths just like we are doing with the flu virus...
Not you. The person who said your 'assumption' on the lockdown being to protect hospitals was as valid as Peak Oil or Polar Ice Caps melting.
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Old 05-04-20, 01:30 PM
  #132  
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Originally Posted by Leisesturm View Post
Not you. The person who said your 'assumption' on the lockdown being to protect hospitals was as valid as Peak Oil or Polar Ice Caps melting.
There are reasons people disagree.

Are you telling us that the lock down "helped" Smaller hospitals and medical practices? Are we to assume laying off Thousands of health care workers during a pandemic is the way to fight a war against that pandemic or can it be stated as a fact? Do you believe they are telling you the truth? Did New York run out of Ventilators or even need as many as they said? Did any hospitals have to turn patients away? Or did they have more than they needed and were able to send some to other states? Is this how we protect hospitals? https://www.salon.com/2020/04/18/cas...aff-shortages/
So it was a fact they were interested in saving hospitals for the populace? I still contend that is debatable. In most wars against something like this you don't send part of your army home. Small hospitals have real doctors and nurses as well and they are cutting staff. Not only that people act like there is no other sickness and people don't need cancer treatments right now. No thank you sir, I will stick with the assumption comparison. Because I remember the stated as fact, the Ice caps would be gone by now. I remember that the water was supposed to rise to flood Manhattan as a fact. I remember peak oil would be with us by the 70s then the 80s then the 90s then the 2000s. All these were facts when they were predicted. And yet they didn't come to pass. So if it doesn't happen is it a fact or an assumption? I admit at times I am a cynic but there is a reason for that. Climate change may get us or a real global pandemic or war, or they may not that is reality because no one Knows. But we can speculate how we will deal with the changes, and living like sardines doesn't seem to be the answer that the predictions promised it would be. Not a prediction and not scientific but an opinion of why I call some things assumptions. https://www.aei.org/carpe-diem/50-ye...erts-are-0-50/ By the way I don't believe people standing in the corner with a sandwich board saying the world is coming to an end either. None of that has much to do with how we will have to deal with transportation needs in an age of Corona type pandemics. For me I wouldn't ride a bus loaded like they used to be or a subway during next flu season let alone a Covid 19 season coming back. My view doesn't have to match yours but it is my view.

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Old 05-05-20, 08:25 PM
  #133  
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Originally Posted by Mobile 155 View Post
There are reasons people disagree.

Are you telling us that the lock down "helped" Smaller hospitals and medical practices? Are we to assume laying off Thousands of health care workers during a pandemic is the way to fight a war against that pandemic or can it be stated as a fact? Do you believe they are telling you the truth? Did New York run out of Ventilators or even need as many as they said? Did any hospitals have to turn patients away? Or did they have more than they needed and were able to send some to other states? Is this how we protect hospitals? https://www.salon.com/2020/04/18/cas...aff-shortages/
So it was a fact they were interested in saving hospitals for the populace? I still contend that is debatable. In most wars against something like this you don't send part of your army home. Small hospitals have real doctors and nurses as well and they are cutting staff. Not only that people act like there is no other sickness and people don't need cancer treatments right now. No thank you sir, I will stick with the assumption comparison. Because I remember the stated as fact, the Ice caps would be gone by now. I remember that the water was supposed to rise to flood Manhattan as a fact. I remember peak oil would be with us by the 70s then the 80s then the 90s then the 2000s. All these were facts when they were predicted. And yet they didn't come to pass. So if it doesn't happen is it a fact or an assumption? I admit at times I am a cynic but there is a reason for that. Climate change may get us or a real global pandemic or war, or they may not that is reality because no one Knows. But we can speculate how we will deal with the changes, and living like sardines doesn't seem to be the answer that the predictions promised it would be. Not a prediction and not scientific but an opinion of why I call some things assumptions. https://www.aei.org/carpe-diem/50-ye...erts-are-0-50/ By the way I don't believe people standing in the corner with a sandwich board saying the world is coming to an end either. None of that has much to do with how we will have to deal with transportation needs in an age of Corona type pandemics. For me I wouldn't ride a bus loaded like they used to be or a subway during next flu season let alone a Covid 19 season coming back. My view doesn't have to match yours but it is my view.
It's a big assumption that we are in "an age of corona type pandemics". Isn't that just one more apocalyptic prediction? This one will pass, and people have short memories.

Last edited by cooker; 05-05-20 at 08:31 PM.
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Old 05-05-20, 10:55 PM
  #134  
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Originally Posted by cooker View Post
It's a big assumption that we are in "an age of corona type pandemics". Isn't that just one more apocalyptic prediction? This one will pass, and people have short memories.
Yes, But I only meant the age of as in SARS, MERS and now Covid 19. They are coming at us differently and more often than we have seen for close to 100 years. Like SARS I hope this one burns out. But we just don't know and people have taken sides as to how to deal with it. At this point we are more or less beating a dead horse. People have made their decision and that is about all they can do. The government is not really here to help.

Much of our problems may be media driven and when the next bright and shinny thing comes along society's focus may change. Till then I am ready to drop it and enjoy gas at all time lows and discount shopping just to get people back into the stores. I hope you and your's stay healthy and that the financial impact is mild in your area. My state has started to reopen and people seem happy about it. I think I will spend some time with friends and family and let the rest of the world worry about themselves. Because that is what people do anyway isn't it?

Take care cooker we only have one life we might as well get the most from it.
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Old 05-06-20, 01:01 PM
  #135  
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Originally Posted by Mobile 155 View Post
Yes, But I only meant the age of as in SARS, MERS and now Covid 19. They are coming at us differently and more often than we have seen for close to 100 years. Like SARS I hope this one burns out. But we just don't know and people have taken sides as to how to deal with it. At this point we are more or less beating a dead horse. People have made their decision and that is about all they can do. The government is not really here to help.

Much of our problems may be media driven and when the next bright and shinny thing comes along society's focus may change. Till then I am ready to drop it and enjoy gas at all time lows and discount shopping just to get people back into the stores. I hope you and your's stay healthy and that the financial impact is mild in your area. My state has started to reopen and people seem happy about it. I think I will spend some time with friends and family and let the rest of the world worry about themselves. Because that is what people do anyway isn't it?

Take care cooker we only have one life we might as well get the most from it.
You too!
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