redlude97

I don't think BMI is suppose to fall on a bell curve, or at least not a current bell curve of weight distributions, because the current american male BMI average is 28.6 and afaik the BMI ranges haven't been adjusted since their inception. A bell curve distribution means that it is likely that you can fall outside of the normal "healthy" range if you are muscular or have a "large frame" but it is highly unlikely that you would be able to reach the obese range of the bell curve while having a low amount of fat. I think more of the issue is that people have become accustom to the new "normal/healthy" average american male who is actually overweight, and outside of cycling and a few other sports groups, actual skinny people are not nearly as common.

khyricat

Not sure I like the bell curve analogy, but as a med professional I hate BMI and only look at it when insurnace companies want the number to approve a supplement or fght me on providing it for a patient.

BMI was NEVER intended to be used the way it is today. It was a societal or group population number. The best example of why it is useless I use is from my days as a dietetic intern. I had 2 patients in neighboring rooms. same age, height and weight. Had I not walked in the room I'd have made the same recommendations. One was obese, one was a body builder. Their caloric needs were very differentl.

BIA machines are accurate if you are well hydrated, if not, forget it. Dexa is the best option for an accurate scan.

gregf83 

BMI is not perfect but for 99% of adults if your BMI is in the obese category you should lose weight.

TimothyH

I'm pretty surprised at the number of people who immediately dismiss the data as wrong or as applicable to others but not themselves.

It is important to look at the individual and the charts are just one part of a person's overall picture but a doctor dismissing out of hand, calling them BS and "We don't go by them" as the OP recounts, seems very odd.


-Tim-

bruce19

Why would it be odd for a medical professional to look at something that has been proven not apply to everyone w/o further investigation and conclude that it was worthless? Hopefully doctors take their patients as individuals.

wolfchild

Forget BMI charts and forget numbers on the scale...Look in the mirror, what you see is what you get, mirrors don't lie.

Daniel4

I think you should change doctor if he or she is still relying on a chart that doesn't apply to you.

prathmann

Exactly - and if you're looking at the individual you can immediately tell much more about their physical shape than from a simplistic 'one-size-fits-all' formula. So it makes perfect sense to ignore that BMI number is you're in a position to see the particular individual.

joejack951

There is data to show that BMI is a good predictor of overall health. Is there any data to show that being overweight/obese per the BMI but 'muscular' is healthy?

I used to be a BMI-denier. Then I realized how much extra weight I was carrying after I started exercising a bit and eating healthier. Went from 'overweight' to 'normal' pretty quickly. No one thought I was fat, though.

IronM

I'm 5"11", 172 lbs and just barely creeping into the 'overweight' category. However, I carry muscle weight in my legs (cycling) and upper body (rowing), though arguably, yeah; I could loose maybe 7-10 lbs of distributed fat. My weight really hurts my cycling, where power:weight ratio means everything on the hills. My goal is to slim down to 155 by summer. When I tell people that, they look at me cross-eyed, as they think I'm too thin already! Compared to an average American, I'm thin; but compared to a bike race- yeah; I'm FAT!!

joejack951

179 lbs. is still considered normal for your height.

I looked it up recently and 'average' for an American man is like 5' 9" and 190 lbs. Oof!

When you realize how much you could lose and get even a glimpse of how much it would help your performance, it is hard to resist trying to lose some weight. Unfortunately it is equally as hard to lose that weight after a certain point as I am finding in my quest for the 130s (started at 180ish last winter). I saw 144 the other day thanks to dehydration but reality is still ~145 and I have been in that general weight for some time now, and not for lack of effort to lose more. 5' 8.5" FWIW.

Seattle Forrest

I'm going to assume that you mean obese per BMI but "muscular" as a different thing than obese per BMI but muscular.

joejack951

Yes. Data on both would be interesting. Data on big, 'muscular' and muscular professional athletes like NFL/NCAA American football linemen would be fascinating.

mcours2006

You may say that BMI is a useless metric, especially if you fall outside the 'normal' range, but the bottom line is that for health reasons it's still better to be 'inside' than 'outside' that range. You can rationalize that some NFL running backs have BMI's in the lower 30's and would be considered obese, but c'mon, you're not them.

Most of us could probably stand to lose a few pounds, but we make up reasons for not wanting/needing to.

RShantz

Exactly. I lost about 50lbs and now hover between 135-140 during the year. At first everyone thought I was crazy skinny, but they were comparing the new me to the old me. Now that I've been this size for a few years, I no longer get the "are you sick" comments. I just look healthy with not much fat. You can tell how much fat there is by looking in the mirror.


Some of the nutrition shops around here have these expensive scales (was told about $5k cost) that is supposed to do a descent job of measuring body fat. Maybe you could give that a try & see what you get. In my experience the expensive scales at the shop always show me with 4-5% more body fat than my cheap home scales.

TimothyH

This is my point exactly.

No one wants to be told they are obese and so people rationalize by using body builders or NFL linemen as examples and convince themselves that the charts don't apply to them. "Look at the individual, not the chart" only makes them more convinced that there isn't a problem.

The charts are just a data point but if the chart says you are obese and you are not an NFL lineman, heavyweight boxer or bodybuilder then it should at least give pause. Laughing it off seems just seems reckless.


-Tim-

joejack951

Just confirming, this post was not directed at me but as a general response, right? Or was it directed toward me with the mistaken thought that I have an NFL linemen's build?

OBoile

Not to mention that most NFL running backs (or most others who can qualify as "obese" yet have single digit body fat) are likely taking PEDs to get that way. That obviously causes it's own health risks.

Seattle Forrest

I'll have to dig around to find anything, but I remember reading some headlines recently about a number of studies casting doubt on the "healthy at any size" concept.

mcours2006

No, not directed at you personally.

mcours2006

I also recall reading/hearing something about waist size being a good predictor over good overall heart health.

joejack951

https://www.cdc.gov/healthyweight/assessing/index.html

I'm guessing lots of Americans take comfort in the waist circumference assessment as apparently I can have a 40" waist and still be considered not at risk for certain diseases

To be fair, that article does go on to state that waist circumference is not a predictor of overall health.

joelcool

I think most of us on this forum recognize that excess weight makes us climb hills slower, which means we spend more time climbing hills - and that sucks. So we have a motivation for loosing weight that's different than the dude (or dudette) next to us in the F-150.


I'm down about 9 pounds so far... 9 pounds on a bike costs a lot of money, but it comes off me with just attention to my intake and continuing to exercise. Plus I feel better. Pretty cool.

TimothyH

Congrats.

13 lb for me.

I was 199 lb on Dec 14 and am now 186 lb. It feels better in the drops and much better climbing.

Yes, very cool.


-Tim-

Seattle Forrest

I've gained ~15 pounds since October. I expect that 6 of it is muscle, the rest split between water and fat.

I'm climbing better and the Garmin says my VO2max has improved on a per pound basis.

I plan to address the fat in coming months but for now the focus is on getting bigger. Had a wellness visit recently and my doctor is happy with the planned weight gain.

But I've been lifting heavy things repeatedly and eating a nutrient dense diet.