DrIsotope

I similarly have zero issues braking from the hoods, under any conditions. But I do wear XXXL gloves, and my thumb-to-pinky span is about 10.5". Grip strength is not an issue. So I'm often more comfortable braking from the hoods due to the small diameter of the drops. My grip isn't as comfortable as on the hoods, which are much larger around.

I'm not saying that the drops aren't safer-- I'm just saying that I've never even once been in a situation where any event occurred that brought me anywhere close to losing my grip on the hoods. My two wrecks early this year, I was still holding the hoods with both hands when I hit the ground.

elcruxio

I don't know if it's my large hands (size 11), mountain biking experience, stable riding position or all of the above combined but I too have no issues having secure braking from the hoods.

I can wrap my thumb around the brifter body in a very similar manner as with the drops position. I've also never lost my grip even when hitting road hazards large enough to ruin the rest of my day. The type which makes something go snap in your neck and you can only turn your head to one side for a couple of days.

I also don't really see the risk all the drop hystericals are proposing. When you hit a pothole/other road hazard the movement vector is more vertical than horizontal. In such an instance if you have a good wrap of the hoods, a balanced position and proper conditioning on the bike (strong yet relaxed), that vertical blow upwards should not cause an issue.

On the other hand if the hit is big enough to cause significant enough deceleration for a competent rider to lose grip on the hoods (or truly sprain a thumb) then that rider is also likely going over the bars in the very near future and the front end of the bike is likely toast.

It's a good thing in Europe we don't faff about riding courses and dogmatic following of riding rules. We typically just ride. Though on group rides it's good to have some rules for signalling, etiquette etc but willy nillying about descent hand position is just silly ya'll. As long as the rider can brake it's ok.

As for drops and drops use I think modern tops are mord ergonomic and better for hand health than the drops as they provide more surface area in a convex form as opposed to the concave in the hooks / many drops.

Modern drop bars are also much more compact than those used in 80's and before. There's no point looking at old time racers and how they rode only drops because that was the only ergonomic aerodynamic position they had was in the drops. Now we have the hoods.

So all that in mind I believe drops should be comfortable (obviously) but most riding should be done at the hoods as that is the middle position with most reach. In very broad strokes, hoods for most typical riding and terrain, tops for climbing and resting and drops for efforts and descents. That way the modern compact drop bar is IMO used to its strengths.

On that vein, if you're able to and do spend most of your time at the drops, you likely have quite a bit of mobility left to move your bars down.

But as has been mentioned here several times already, these things are personal. Some people just really prefer the drops to the hoods. And that's ok.

Personally I prefer reach to drop.

Happy Feet

Exactly.

No one said one was better then the other. Just that with modern design, especially with disc, and more so with hydraulics, it's possible for a rider to stop either way safely.

It's funny but predictable in a general internet forum that some would rhetorically insist a position is wrong without really knowing what that position is.

I have drops,
I use drops,
I very intentionally swapped bars and adjusted levers so I could brake from the drops,
but I also recognize it's far easier and safer to brake from the hoods now, with modern levers, so that the issue is mostly mute or perhaps.. personal choice.

The ongoing success and popularity of current hood - centric lever design seems to bear this out as there would probably be a backlash if many people were crashing because that that system did not work.

livedarklions

I notice you didn't include pics of you going over potholes. That's very suspicious.

I'm kidding.

Metieval

one way you will stop with brakes via hands in the drops, the other way includes the possibility of you stopping by sliding to a stop on the ground, because your grip was compromised on the descent when you hit something.



You continue to ignore this about the hoods vs drops braking, and at this point in time it has to be intentional. You will argue that you have grip, then turn it into you can brake. When it never was about braking.

OBoile

[has an evil grin knowing the carnage I'm about to cause...]
Perhaps you should try disc breaks? I can lock up either wheel quite easily from my hoods.

u235

I am over 95% drops except on really long rides where I start to move around. I instinctively go to the drops as my default when something is coming. It is the best comfortable position for me for control and braking. If you can't use the drops or hoods and can't reach shifters or brakes from one or the other then try different bars with a different shape, or don't.

cyccommute 

Look at Happy Feet's pictures in post 172. In particular, look at the 6th picture. That's what I mean by the thumb being extended. There's variability in how close the lever is to the bars with more modern levers being a little closer but if your hand is small, that variability isn't going to matter. Older STI aren't nearly as close to the bar as never versions are. Same holds for all of the other manufacturers as well.

The brakes levers on a drop aren't the same distance from the bar. They are only the same distance in one spot and then the bar curves away from the lever. If you have to get more than just an index finger on the brake you have to let go with the rest of the hand and extend the thumb.

The thumb wraps around the hood as well as it wraps around the bar (when riding in the drops). Failing to hold on to the hoods is no more likely when braking from the hoods.

cyccommute 

Exactly. Many of the older STI systems have levers that are equal to that lever in reach from the bar. About the time 10 speed systems came around, the lever was curved back towards the bars. Lots of us still run those older levers.

It's not any more risky than hyper-extending the thumb and hand to brake. And, if you had taken the picture from the same perspective as the STI shifter, I doubt that the hand would have looked any different.

indyfabz

Despite mostly hood riding even while bombing down mountain roads on a fully loaded touring bike I have never taken a spill. Why not? Because I have a good grip on reality.

cyccommute 

We'll get back to that statement a little later.

Any idiot that would put 3 fingers between a lever and the bar deserves the pinched fingers that are going to result.

What do you base the "moderate[ly] secure grip" and the braking ability on. That is a very secure grip and the fingers on the lever can generate as much force as if the hand were oriented differently. That's essentially the same grip as you'd get on a mountain bike bar. Your hand isn't going to bounce off or let got or slip unless you aren't paying attention.

Same mountain bike type grip like on older mountain bike levers with 3 or 4 finger blades. And, again, how is the hand going to slip off?

The only advantage this has over your first picture is that it avoids pinched fingers. But, again, how to you measure braking ability?

It's the same grip you complained about above with only 2 fingers and the thumb wrapping the bar. If your hand can slip from with 2 fingers and a thumb holding the hoods, they can just as easily slip when holding the bar. Both scenarios are the same.

No, just your opinion. At what point do you think braking from the hoods becomes dangerous? 5mph? 15mph? 20? 45? 49.556? I don't always brake from the hoods but I suspect you don't always brake from the drops either. On the other hand, I have been able to brake successfully and safely from the hoods at stupid speeds with a loaded touring bike and have done it for 40 years. It might fail me one day but it hasn't so far and I really doubt it will in the future.

terrymorse 

You've been fortunate that your poor descending technique has not caused a crash. So far.

cyccommute 

Well said. If someone is going to lose their grip on the bars and slip off, they will do it no matter where their hands are. I suspect it would be more of a problem with the hands then with the levers or the positioning of the hand.

cyccommute 

We ignore it because it isn't true. In 40 years of riding...about half mountain and about half road...I've never gone over the bars or crashed on a road bike because I lost my grip. I'm not that dumb or uncoordinated. I've crashed because of ice or gravel but never because I lost my grip. I've only crashed once because I lost my grip but that was on a mountain bike and coming off a jump...very different dynamics.

I have a life time of experience in mountain riding that includes uncountable hours...yes, hours...of fast downhills. I've come across a lot of holes, rumble strips, and other obstacles in my path. I haven't been able to dodge all of them so I've hit a few. 99% of my time is spent on the hoods and I don't even think about my grip on them. Nor do I even consider the possibility that my hands might slip. It's not an issue.

pvillemasher

Potholes

davei1980

Not to add complexity to the discussion but have you researched Jones Bikes handlebars? I don't have 1st hand experience with them but they claim to have MORE hand positions than drops (wide, narrorow, relaxed, aero, depending on how much you have taped) and they do have more mounting positions for lights and computers. Worth looking in to. They're a little unorthodox looking.

cyccommute 

Give it a rest. indyfabz and I are both touring cyclists. That may bother your racer sensibilities but we do rides that you wouldn't even consider. We load our bikes that already weigh more than double your bike with another 2 to 4 times what your bike weighs and throw ourselves and that load down mountains using exactly the same brakes as you do and often at the same speeds you might ride. Neither of us have "poor descending technique" because we have reached the bottom of every one of those downhill in one piece. Yes, so far but we also have the experience to keep doing it and we really don't think we'll lose our grip.

I can't speak entirely for indyfabz but for myself I also have lighter bikes that I ride the same way. It's never been a problem and won't be a problem in the future.

Metieval

just because it hasn't happened to you, doesn't make the grips equal.

terrymorse 

As long as people continue to promote poor cycling technique in an open forum, I most definitely am not going to give it a rest.

I've lost one too many friends to inadequate descending skills.

Descend in the drops, people!

cyccommute 

Okay, provide the number of people who has crashed because they were using the hoods. While you are at it, find out how many people have crashed while using the drops. I doubt you'll find much on either because it isn't an issue.

Kapusta

The Your point is not being ignored so much as it is being disagreed with.

No how, no way, my hands are sliding off the hoods from an impact. Only way my hands are coming off the hoods (or drops) is when I let go because I am headed over the bars.

Here is a pic of my hoods

I am NOT going to be sliding off the front of those. My thumb and the crotch of my palm would have to go up and over those horns (which can’t really happen unless I open my grip)

If you are having the problems you speak of on the hoods when you hit bumps, then it sounds like you are riding too stiff-armed, and need to learn to relax your arms and let them absorb the impacts. You also might want to look at how you’re holding your hoods.

cyccommute 

So these "friends" you've lost, was it because they were on the hoods? Or was it for other reasons? Since they were "lost", did their spirits come back on Christmas Eve and say "don't descend on the hoods!" in a spooky voice?

Ironfish653

Also agreed with the above. The whole 'your hands will fly off the bars' if you hit a bump is pretty Nervous Nelly stuff.

The idea that you have to hit every pothole because you can't deviate from The Line also seems to indicate a locked-out riding style or lack of faith in one's bike handling skills.

Maybe it's because i'm a Dirty Heathen(tm) I don't always keep a superhuman grip on the bars, tend to ride in a semi-flexed posture in the fast, rough stuff, and, on occasion, when faced with a potentially destabilizing obstacle like a pothole or bridge joint that i'm too close and to fast to go around, I bunny-hop it.

Yes, on the road bike. I might be 'obese', but my bike is half catapult, so: Sproing!, B!itche$!





Btw, this thread is getting up there with the 'Downtube Shifters Should Make A Comeback' thread for pure preposterousness.

cyccommute 

Hadn't thought of that. Maybe that's the problem...projecting their poor technique onto to others.

terrymorse 

If you must know, my friend crashed after hitting a bump while descending Highway 17 near Los Gatos. He died at the scene. I wasn't there to witness it, because I left the ride early.

He often descended on the hoods, he tended to carry too much tension in his arms, and he put too much weight on his saddle. Three bad practices.

"In addition to lowering your center of gravity, riding on the drops will give you much greater control over the bikes handling thanks to better grip and less chance of your hands slipping if you hit a pothole or bump in the road."

— Pro Tips: How to Descend on a Road Bike