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Yet a new bike category? Salsa’s new Warroad (no bird required)

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Cyclocross and Gravelbiking (Recreational) This has to be the most physically intense sport ever invented. It's high speed bicycle racing on a short off road course or riding the off pavement rides on gravel like :The Dirty Kanza". We also have a dedicated Racing forum for the Cyclocross Hard Core Racers.

Yet a new bike category? Salsa’s new Warroad (no bird required)

Old 03-30-19, 08:07 AM
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I really wanted a new warbird, since i had an older model. But i too was shocked at the price for the components you get. I have never owned a giant, never really liked them, but i loved the new revolt and after salsa's offering, i got the revolt advanced 0, the new warroad does nothing for me, the price is just too crazy for what you are getting. i have a santa cruz MTB and they got the best warranty in the business, i ordered a new set of their reserve gravel wheels for my giant. I also ordered a new set of i9 wheels for my old warbird. I dont think i will buy another salsa for a long time, the bike market prices are just sky high for what you receive. I would start buying canyon but i am too loyal to my local bike shops to do that.
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Old 03-30-19, 08:41 AM
  #52  
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Originally Posted by Marcus_Ti View Post
Yea...I laughed a bit. $4,400 for a middling-tier component bike. The gentrification and unaffordability problems keep escalating.

I bought a 10 year old gas-hybrid car for not much more than that 3 months back.
Considering a Canyon Endurace with 105 can be had for $2200. and can fit any 700x33 Cyclocross tire, I'd also say the Salsa is $1200. overpriced.

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Old 03-30-19, 09:02 AM
  #53  
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Originally Posted by zaxmalloy View Post

I am seriously impressed by the Giant Revolt Advanced 0 but not enough (yet) to pull out the credit card.
I am confused

$3,465 for Giant with Carbon wheels, Ultegra or $3,400 for a Salsa with alloy wheels and 105

I mean I am sure there are arguments to be given for buying a salsa over the giant, but $ isn't one of them!!!
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Old 03-30-19, 02:40 PM
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Originally Posted by chas58 View Post
I don't know nothin, but on the road I would do the 700c wheels, and gravel the 650b wheels
I am always confused when people say that they use two sets of wheels on a bike that is advertised as go anywhere bike - do you go with a spare set of wheels in the bag just in case you want to go beyond the road? Salsa is saying that this bike is for roadies who enjoy some gravel which means they sell it mostly with beefy 650b tires for primary road usage just to have an option to enjoy some gravel. This makes little sense to me.

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Old 03-30-19, 03:39 PM
  #55  
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Originally Posted by sweetspot View Post
I am always confused when people say that they use two sets of wheels on a bike that is advertised as go anywhere bike - do you go with a spare set of wheels in the bag just in case you want to go beyond the road? Salsa is saying that this bike is for roadies who enjoy some gravel which means they sell it mostly with beefy 650b tires for primary road usage just to have an option to enjoy some gravel. This makes little sense to me.
yes and no

While I enjoy gravel, the paved roads are getting worse than gravel. Gravel may have washboards here and there, but... some of this pavement , cracks, pot holes, joints, worn down to cobble. Is worse than gravel. which has me looking at road plus. nothing like hitting frost cracks for a 8 mile section on regular intervals at 18 + mph after 70 miles...... neck/ nerves, elbows... SCREAMING. worse thing ever.
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Old 03-30-19, 09:23 PM
  #56  
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Originally Posted by ThermionicScott View Post
I think "new bike category" might be a stretch. Seems to me that the ideal "gravel bike" all along was essentially a mountain bike that handled and felt like a road bike. So we're just getting closer and closer to that ideal.
I do not agree with this at all. Gravel bikes weigh 10 - 12 pounds less, have no front suspension, do not use heavy tires, have completely different handling and geometry, have drop bars, etc. I do not see much similarity at all. Gravel bikes fall into two categories, "traditional" that have a longer wheelbase and geometry akin to touring bikes (Warbird, Renegade) and a smallwer category more like road bikes with short wheelbase, more vertical steerer and shorter stack (Open, 3T). Neither are very much like a mountain bike. Both are a lot of fun though!
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Old 03-30-19, 09:31 PM
  #57  
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Originally Posted by FlashBazbo View Post
You, too? At last notice, my September 2018 Warbird frameset order, last promised by the end of March 2019, was then promised the first week of May then, the last week of May . . . and now . . . "indeterminate." If Salsa's manufacturing ever catches up with their marketing department, they're going to eclipse Trek and Specialized in sales!


Our local shop here in Pittsburgh has Warbirds in stock, including the new DI2. sweetwaterbicycles.com. They stock 18 different gravel bike models on the floor and really specialize in gravel bikes. They even have Open, 3T, Bomtrack, Jamis, Salsa and Felt all at the same place.
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Old 03-30-19, 09:34 PM
  #58  
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Originally Posted by gravelslider View Post
I do not agree with this at all. Gravel bikes weigh 10 - 12 pounds less, have no front suspension, do not use heavy tires, have completely different handling and geometry, have drop bars, etc. I do not see much similarity at all. Gravel bikes fall into two categories, "traditional" that have a longer wheelbase and geometry akin to touring bikes (Warbird, Renegade) and a smallwer category more like road bikes with short wheelbase, more vertical steerer and shorter stack (Open, 3T). Neither are very much like a mountain bike. Both are a lot of fun though!
I'm thinking of the "what", you're stuck on the "how".

Mountain bikes were alternately known as "all-terrain bikes" in the beginning. Like I said, "gravel bikes" are approaching that ideal with more road manners.
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Old 03-30-19, 09:41 PM
  #59  
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Originally Posted by Darth Lefty View Post
Salsa’s new mountain bikes were in stock almost immediately upon their launch. I dare say you don’t have your Warbird because they were working on this instead.
The recently imposed tariffs screwed up the bike industry and ports royally and has hit some bike makers harder than others this spring. Many tried to get what they could get imported early before the tariffs hit. Ithers switeche massive production lines to Taiwan. All of the ports got backed up in December when all of that stuff tried to come in to the US before tariffs hit and backlogged ports a month or more.
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Old 03-30-19, 09:47 PM
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Originally Posted by prj71 View Post
As I stated previously this bike is no better or different than the Giant Revolt Advanced or other similar bikes now available. Only difference is the Giant cost less and has better components.

$3500 gets you a carbon bike, carbon wheels and Ultrega components.

https://www.giant-bicycles.com/us/revolt-advanced-0

$4300 get you a Carbon Warroad Ultegra with alloy wheels. They are nuts.

https://salsacycles.com/bikes/warroa...on_ultegra_700
Is this opinion based on extensive riding of both, or armchair looking at the pictures?
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Old 03-30-19, 09:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Darth Lefty View Post
Giants are always a really good value.

Salsas are maybe a good value with your 15% back by using your REI card...
Any Salsa dealer will match REI (10%, not 15%) if you mention REI. REI just means all Salsa's are now discounted 10% by good solid dealer network that helped Salsa grow to the point that Salsa undercut them with their REI deal...
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Old 03-30-19, 09:56 PM
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Originally Posted by prj71 View Post
Even the carbon Diverge with Ultegra and alloy wheels is less than the Salsa Warroad. Again...Salsa is nuts on their pricing.

https://www.specialized.com/us/en/me...=227302-154306
The Carbon Diverge is not really a gravel bike. They just rebranded their endurance bike and sold it a s a gravel bike when they were caught flat-footed and slow responding to an emerging market trend. I have ridden both on gravel and the Diverge is no where near as good at gravel as the Warbird.
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Old 03-30-19, 10:01 PM
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Originally Posted by ThermionicScott View Post
I'm thinking of the "what", you're stuck on the "how".

Mountain bikes were alternately known as "all-terrain bikes" in the beginning. Like I said, "gravel bikes" are approaching that ideal with more road manners.
Yeah, I could agree with that...
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Old 03-30-19, 10:14 PM
  #64  
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This might do it for some, but it can't replace a road bike for me no matter the amount of potholes encountered. Too much of a compromise, starting with the 1x drivetrain (edit: 2x versions available).

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Old 03-31-19, 10:32 AM
  #65  
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Originally Posted by gravelslider View Post
Any Salsa dealer will match REI (10%, not 15%) if you mention REI. REI just means all Salsa's are now discounted 10% by good solid dealer network that helped Salsa grow to the point that Salsa undercut them with their REI deal...
their pricing should just be 10% less then.

if everyone involved recognizes that the bikes are worth 10% less than listed to customers, then price them that way. It will help with everyone who internet researches and eliminates options based on price before further investigation of a final few bikes because Salsa may not immediately be dismissed since bikes are no longer as unjustifiably expensive.

as for REI, just have them contractually eliminate salsa bikes as a dividend eligible product. They change their pricing and benefits policies when needed and this could be one of those times.

of course this would mean all those who don't know they can get a discount then pay full price and that extra $ gets pocketed.
...not how I think brand loyalty and consumer goodwill should work, but to each their own, I guess.
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Old 03-31-19, 04:13 PM
  #66  
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Originally Posted by jan nikolajsen View Post
This might do it for some, but it can't replace a road bike for me no matter the amount of potholes encountered. Too much of a compromise, starting with the 1x drivetrain (edit: 2x versions available).
Have you ridden a good gravel bike set upo wih 32 -35 mm fast tires to compare? If not you might just be pleasantly surprised. Also, as you approach your 50s and 60s the extra comfort advantage of a good gravel bike set up for road may keep you riding more often and further...
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Old 03-31-19, 04:16 PM
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Originally Posted by mstateglfr View Post
their pricing should just be 10% less then.

if everyone involved recognizes that the bikes are worth 10% less than listed to customers, then price them that way. It will help with everyone who internet researches and eliminates options based on price before further investigation of a final few bikes because Salsa may not immediately be dismissed since bikes are no longer as unjustifiably expensive.

as for REI, just have them contractually eliminate salsa bikes as a dividend eligible product. They change their pricing and benefits policies when needed and this could be one of those times.

of course this would mean all those who don't know they can get a discount then pay full price and that extra $ gets pocketed.
...not how I think brand loyalty and consumer goodwill should work, but to each their own, I guess.
Not everyone recognizes this. That is why dealers keep the higher retail price (required by Salsa) and for those that are price savvy and more cost concious they can lower the price. Basic marketing to make the most money. Lots of things sell at higher than the minimum price out there...
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Old 03-31-19, 06:00 PM
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Originally Posted by gravelslider View Post
Is this opinion based on extensive riding of both, or armchair looking at the pictures?
Looking at the geometry charts they are similar. Both bikes accept 700c and 650b tires.
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Old 04-01-19, 09:14 AM
  #69  
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Originally Posted by dwmckee View Post
Have you ridden a good gravel bike set upo wih 32 -35 mm fast tires to compare? If not you might just be pleasantly surprised. Also, as you approach your 50s and 60s the extra comfort advantage of a good gravel bike set up for road may keep you riding more often and further...
Yeah, I've probably tried a gravel bike or two in the past. They were nice and I liked them, but not snappy/fast enough to replace my Tarmac; and not versatile enough to replace my Cutthroat. I guess I could dig up an excuse to fit an expensive purpose built modern gravel bike in between the two (nothing wrong with more bikes!), but honestly not sure if I would get enough miles on it to justify.
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Old 04-01-19, 01:00 PM
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I am always confused when people say that they use two sets of wheels on a bike that is advertised as go anywhere bike - do you go with a spare set of wheels in the bag just in case you want to go beyond the road?
Takes seconds to change wheels before I head out. I tend to ride 32mm in summer/fall, and 40mm (or larger) in winter and spring and when doing long summer gravel rides.
We all live in different places, but honestly the “gravel” around here is smoother than the asphalt, 6 months out of the year (we use a lot of chloride to keep the dust down).
I go on some fast road rides where the paceline is doing 30mph in the flats when they spin it up – and I need a good road tire for that.
Yeah, I go anywhere (that doesn’t require a suspension). Fast road rides, CX, gravel, urban.

Yeah, I've probably tried a gravel bike or two in the past. They were nice and I liked them, but not snappy/fast enough to replace my Tarmac; and not versatile enough to replace my Cutthroat
Well, you certainly have the best of both worlds. But for those of us that need to boil it down to one bike, you can get a snappy/fast gravel bike with a lot of versatility. It looks like the warbird is trying to do this – giving you a bike that rides as well on 28mm tires as it rides on 47mm tires. For the some of us, that is a lot of versatility.
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Old 04-01-19, 08:02 PM
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Isn't this category of bike Road Plus? Salsa created a need for the Warroad with their geometry on the Warbird, which has incredibly high trail. The Warroad still has a lot of trail, but less than the Warbird.

I really like Road Plus. It is great for all day rides, for handling the horrible pavement that I occasionally encounter, for handling my daily commute, and for gravel. I use it on group rides, and find the extra tire to be no problem. In call cases, Road Plus lowers fatigue, which lets me go faster for longer. I ride safer because hitting potholes and other debris is no longer a problem, so I can keep my eyes pointed further up the road.
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Old 04-01-19, 11:39 PM
  #72  
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Originally Posted by 79pmooney View Post
... They knew the roads they'd be riding if not the pavement. I didn't know what coast I would be living on. I also didn't know the wheel standard I would be using. 700c or 27"? In 1978, not knowing where I'd be living, that wasn't at all obvious.

Well, 38 years later, my Mooney had a new focus - as a fix gear to ride Crater Lake with Cycle Oregon AND ride the promised 30 miles of gravel with its 1000' ups and downs. I did it. ...
Huh??? “The Classic” 2017 Cycle Oregon ride was cancelled due to wildfires.

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Old 04-02-19, 12:09 PM
  #73  
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Originally Posted by stanion View Post
Isn't this category of bike Road Plus? Salsa created a need for the Warroad with their geometry on the Warbird, which has incredibly high trail. The Warroad still has a lot of trail, but less than the Warbird.

I really like Road Plus. It is great for all day rides, for handling the horrible pavement that I occasionally encounter, for handling my daily commute, and for gravel. I use it on group rides, and find the extra tire to be no problem. In call cases, Road Plus lowers fatigue, which lets me go faster for longer. I ride safer because hitting potholes and other debris is no longer a problem, so I can keep my eyes pointed further up the road.
Exactly! Most of my routes are part paved, part dirt. Surface quality of both can vary wildly. Road plus/Allroad bikes make a ton of sense for me and have few to no downsides.
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Old 04-03-19, 08:40 AM
  #74  
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I've come to really appreciate the term "all-road." Maybe since this subforum has nothing to do with actual cyclocross, the name could be changed to "Gravel/All-road riding" or something like that.
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Old 04-03-19, 09:12 AM
  #75  
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Originally Posted by stanion View Post
Isn't this category of bike Road Plus? Salsa created a need for the Warroad with their geometry on the Warbird, which has incredibly high trail. The Warroad still has a lot of trail, but less than the Warbird.
How do you know the Trail. Do they post it,or did you calculate it? Specialized is good about posting trail, but I can’t always get their numbers to match up to the calculations.

Originally Posted by ThermionicScott View Post
I've come to really appreciate the term "all-road." Maybe since this subforum has nothing to do with actual cyclocross, the name could be changed to "Gravel/All-road riding" or something like that.
Good point. Road Plus, All road…

Some people argue in threads “that isn’what you need for a gravel bike” True, but a lot of us are really doing all road riding. If I had a gravel only bike, it would be a bit different than the “all road” bike I actually ride.
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