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Is there a comparison of current narrow/shallow sprint handlebars?

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Is there a comparison of current narrow/shallow sprint handlebars?

Old 03-04-19, 01:45 PM
  #26  
Nate2453
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Originally Posted by brawlo View Post
The ARX is now superseded but there may be some old stock around. I got mine via my bike fitter with connections to the Aus 3T importer. The new 3T Apto stems list up to 150mm on their website
Super D, if you are in AUS, you can get a 150mm Zipp Service Course SL from our distributors. We made a limited run, they have/had some. If they don't have them in stock they should be able to help you find one. Our 140, and 150mm stems are the stiffest alloy stems we have tested. The only thing stiffer is our SL Sprint stem but that only goes to 140mm.

Nate at Zipp.

Last edited by Nate2453; 03-04-19 at 01:49 PM.
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Old 03-04-19, 01:47 PM
  #27  
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Originally Posted by carleton View Post
2 takeaways from this thread:

- This is why the LOOK Ergostem and similar 2-hinge adjustable stems are extremely useful and worth the extra expense when testing fits.
- Finding the right bar + stem + frame combo is a journey. It's also one that many don't put much effort into.
Agreed. I used a hinged stem in the pursuit cockpit I borrowed for worlds and it was terrific (except for the slight play until I cranked it down seriously, was worried about damaging hardware, wasn't used to putting that much torque into anything in the cockpit---ultimately ended up buying a new set of stainless hardware and refreshing everything after racing, just to be sure it was 100%). I think a hinged stem is probably ideal for any road or track bike until you're completely dialed, and then a solid might be good for less elements which need attention, and weight if that's a factor.

It's funny, I didn't realize how much the frame would come into play on the track bike fit, until getting everything set up for UCI regs. Then it was obvious, even though I was on the same size frame as my road bike, I was on one size too short of a frame for track. Funny, this probably happens to lots of people; I've just unknowingly made the same mistake others have made. Part of the learning process.
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Old 03-10-19, 11:51 AM
  #28  
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There was a rule of thumb when I started on the velodrome in the 80ís that said buy size smaller than your road frame. I never felt super dialed in until I bought a frame from a teammate who about my size that he had custom made. Found out that I needed a longer top tube than what a size smaller frame could accommodate.
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Old 03-11-19, 01:50 AM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by colnago62 View Post
There was a rule of thumb when I started on the velodrome in the 80’s that said buy size smaller than your road frame. I never felt super dialed in until I bought a frame from a teammate who about my size that he had custom made. Found out that I needed a longer top tube than what a size smaller frame could accommodate.
That rule of thumb was around in the early 2000s but quickly got debunked when aluminum and carbon frames showed up with shorter head tubes.

Remember, a top track bike in the 1980s looked like this:



Complete with long head tube, long reach stem, long and deep bars.

If anything, the rule of thumb advice now is, "Get a track bike with a TT 1 size larger than your road bike."

Why?

- More aggressive positions (lower back) for the shorter races (shorter than road rides/races).
- Narrow bars push the back up. To reclaim your position, you have to push the front of the bike out forward by increasing the top tube length.
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Old 11-01-19, 12:06 AM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by Nate2453 View Post
Super D, if you are in AUS, you can get a 150mm Zipp Service Course SL from our distributors. We made a limited run, they have/had some. If they don't have them in stock they should be able to help you find one. Our 140, and 150mm stems are the stiffest alloy stems we have tested. The only thing stiffer is our SL Sprint stem but that only goes to 140mm.

Nate at Zipp.
How would a US bloke get ahold of the 150mm SC SL stem?
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Old 11-01-19, 12:32 AM
  #31  
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Originally Posted by carleton View Post
2 takeaways from this thread:

- This is why the LOOK Ergostem and similar 2-hinge adjustable stems are extremely useful and worth the extra expense when testing fits.
- Finding the right bar + stem + frame combo is a journey. It's also one that many don't put much effort into.
So...I'm finally making some progress on this journey. Purchased a slightly-enjoyed DF 60cm, and next will begin experimenting with more stems and bars.

I'd like to try a 150mm stem next, but no way will I buy another 3T Apto (the 140mm I already have); those backside-mounted faceplate bolts are just a mind-bogglingly bad design. Pretty challenging finding a 150mm at all. Some friends at the track are running the (surprisingly inexpensive to obtain) KCNC stems, which do come in a 150. Any opinion on those? They seem stout. I haven't heard of anyone ripping them to pieces during a sprint yet.
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Old 11-13-19, 01:03 AM
  #32  
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Anyone know what the dimensions are for some of the shallower-drop / longer-reach sprint bars in use at the 6-day events currently, and what might be accessible on the market? (Trying to find something similar dimensionally that a regular guy without big budget could afford.)
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Old 11-13-19, 03:45 AM
  #33  
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Someone may have already mentioned this, but if you're looking for stems that long to go with short, shallow bars, have you considered Nitto steel or alloy bars with a slightly higher front end? The drop/reach on them is quite a lot compared to short, shallow road bars, but I have a set of steel B123s with a 6 degree, 130mm stem and run a couple of extra spacers under the front end. I've never, ever, detected the slightest bit of flex from them, (ymmv) but I can feel flex in most alloy road bars (3t, Zipp, Deda). Something to consider, even though it's not quite the answer to the question you're looking for. I think, if you can find the SB models, they are the ones with a 31.8 clamp, see the link

NEW NITTO

about halfway down the page.
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Old 11-13-19, 02:28 PM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by Minion1 View Post
Someone may have already mentioned this, but if you're looking for stems that long to go with short, shallow bars, have you considered Nitto steel or alloy bars with a slightly higher front end? The drop/reach on them is quite a lot compared to short, shallow road bars, but I have a set of steel B123s with a 6 degree, 130mm stem and run a couple of extra spacers under the front end. I've never, ever, detected the slightest bit of flex from them, (ymmv) but I can feel flex in most alloy road bars (3t, Zipp, Deda). Something to consider, even though it's not quite the answer to the question you're looking for. I think, if you can find the SB models, they are the ones with a 31.8 clamp, see the link

NEW NITTO

about halfway down the page.
I'd like to find a track bar with long reach, but shallow drop, ideally. I'm struggling with the idea of raising the bar up to compensate for a bar with too much drop, by angling-up the stem in order to get the hands in the preferred position, versus getting a bar which doesn't have as much drop to begin with---and keeping the stem more horizontal in relation to the ground. It seems now that very shallow bars are being devised, to position the hands in the preferred spot (while still keeping a tidy aero package, without the stem sticking up which would increase frontal area and drag).

I have a Pro Vibe 7S sprint bar which has too much drop, so if I was using that, I'd have to flip the stem to raise the hands. The Zipp I'm running has 80mm reach, which is going in the right direction, getting the hands out in front of me more, and shallow drop, again a positive...it just doesn't have rounded shoulders which would be better for standing starts to clear the forearms. If I could find a short-drop/long-reach bar with a sprint shape, I'd be stoked.

Examples of shallow drop with long reach, and nearly horizontal stem, from the recent 6-day:




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Old 11-14-19, 04:07 AM
  #35  
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Outside Scattos there's probably very little commercially available that will go close to the dimensions of the bars pictured that I know of, though someone else might have some suggestions. Dixie Flyer, BT, and Selcof all make bars with similar shapes to the Scattos, though I don't know anyone making an alloy version (Nitto ABD-X?)

Last edited by Minion1; 11-14-19 at 04:31 AM.
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Old 11-14-19, 07:35 AM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by Minion1 View Post
Outside Scattos there's probably very little commercially available that will go close to the dimensions of the bars pictured that I know of, though someone else might have some suggestions. Dixie Flyer, BT, and Selcof all make bars with similar shapes to the Scattos, though I don't know anyone making an alloy version (Nitto ABD-X?)
I'd add Look to that list.

there are also plenty of alloy short-reach, short-drop handlebars on the market, but they're not going to offer an aero top or much in the way of wrist clearance.
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Old 11-14-19, 07:40 AM
  #37  
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I was all set to replace my ruined Scattos with a Look bar, but then my LBS told me they can no longer get look bars and frames. So, back to a Scatto. I am downsizing though, from 37 to 35.
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Old 11-14-19, 10:51 AM
  #38  
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Originally Posted by queerpunk View Post
I'd add Look to that list.

there are also plenty of alloy short-reach, short-drop handlebars on the market, but they're not going to offer an aero top or much in the way of wrist clearance.
I'm looking for long-reach / short-drop, due to my affliction with "monkey arms".

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Old 11-14-19, 11:48 AM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by Super D View Post
I'm looking for long-reach / short-drop, due to my affliction with "monkey arms".

haha
just get yourself a Kashechkin stem!
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Old 11-14-19, 12:21 PM
  #40  
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Super D, the Bridgestone in your 6 day pictures is using a Look bar. I got mine from a local dealer.
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Old 11-14-19, 10:47 PM
  #41  
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Originally Posted by queerpunk View Post
haha
just get yourself a Kashechkin stem!
Already got my 150 today, so no Kash for me, haha

Originally Posted by jfiveeight View Post
Super D, the Bridgestone in your 6 day pictures is using a Look bar. I got mine from a local dealer.
No Look bar for me for now, out of budget, have to go aluminum. I've got a Zipp SCSL-80 on the bike now, seems to be fine, just wish I could eek out another inch of reach. The 150 stem actually measured out half an inch longer than the 140 for some reason, so that combined with the longer frame I just built up should be a bit of an improvement. Maybe I'll find an affordable bar at some point which has the shallow drop but long reach in the 100mm+ range, and then I'll have done everything I can do to stretch out.
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Old 11-15-19, 07:27 AM
  #42  
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I didn't read the whole thread but apparently Dixie is coming out with a shallow drop, normal reach (90x85) bar for next year. Also potentially some longer stems.
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Old 11-15-19, 07:53 AM
  #43  
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If you can live with a 38cm road bar, the Bontrager VR-C bars are listed as 100mm reach 124mm drop - only 20-25mm more reach than similar compact bars, but it gives you a little more room for sphinxing. They are a pretty traditional shape.
There's a $50 alloy version with no cable grooves.
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Old 11-15-19, 08:49 PM
  #44  
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Originally Posted by Super D View Post
Already got my 150 today, so no Kash for me, haha



No Look bar for me for now, out of budget, have to go aluminum. I've got a Zipp SCSL-80 on the bike now, seems to be fine, just wish I could eek out another inch of reach. The 150 stem actually measured out half an inch longer than the 140 for some reason, so that combined with the longer frame I just built up should be a bit of an improvement. Maybe I'll find an affordable bar at some point which has the shallow drop but long reach in the 100mm+ range, and then I'll have done everything I can do to stretch out.
Not so expensive as Look, very stiff, sprint geometry, etc. I have two of it, felt much better than Scatto when standing accelerations due longer straight drop extensions, parallel drops (Scatto's aren't), etc. etc. 37cm.
https://www.planetx.co.uk/i/q/HBSELV...rack-handlebar
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Old 11-17-19, 01:53 AM
  #45  
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In case someone knows, would it be possible to make a bar similar to the look or FES bar out of alloy or steel? Would that radius be too small or too acute for a metal part?
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Old 11-17-19, 08:43 PM
  #46  
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Originally Posted by Clythio View Post
Not so expensive as Look, very stiff, sprint geometry, etc. I have two of it, felt much better than Scatto when standing accelerations due longer straight drop extensions, parallel drops (Scatto's aren't), etc. etc. 37cm.
https://www.planetx.co.uk/i/q/HBSELV...rack-handlebar
They oughta make these in a 35.
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Old 11-18-19, 05:02 PM
  #47  
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Originally Posted by Minion1 View Post
In case someone knows, would it be possible to make a bar similar to the look or FES bar out of alloy or steel? Would that radius be too small or too acute for a metal part?
Have the hooks bent, then weld them to a T shaped bar/stem assembly. Or make the hooks welded to a crossbar and have a custom long stem made. That would be the easiest route.
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Old 11-18-19, 11:56 PM
  #48  
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Spicer cycles might be able to help with the handlebars. They do a lot of custom welding and fabrication.
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Old 11-19-19, 03:09 AM
  #49  
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Originally Posted by taras0000 View Post
Have the hooks bent, then weld them to a T shaped bar/stem assembly. Or make the hooks welded to a crossbar and have a custom long stem made. That would be the easiest route.
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Old 11-19-19, 10:07 PM
  #50  
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Originally Posted by Minion1 View Post
Sam Whittingham at naked cycles used to make custom drop bars with steel airfoil tubing. His design had the foil sections welded directly to the steerer clamp and the bar hooks. So the "tops" had a very forward sweep. I might have a picture floating around on an album from my junior years. They were similarly designed the ones below, but MUCH, MUCH cleaner and professional looking. His hooks were cut off from standard steel Nittos at the top/shoulder/hood transition, then welded to the outside of the foils for a nice, clean, streamlined form. Anypro would have no problem being seen at an international event with them they were that well made.

Last edited by taras0000; 11-19-19 at 10:11 PM.
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