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Can anyone identify if this is a Colnago?

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Can anyone identify if this is a Colnago?

Old 11-09-19, 08:57 PM
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guelphite
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Can anyone identify if this is a Colnago?

Hello, my friend and I have acquired two Colnagos.

Mine is the unlabeled red. (Sorry about the mess but I wasn't expecting company).
On both, the top tube has a single 'crimp' and the down tube has a double 'crimp'.
Both has 130mm rear space which makes me think as them for the 1990s.
One thing that concerns me that both do not have serial numbers.

Any help will be much appreciated.

I'll try to take better pics tomorrow night.




Colnago headtube / forks


Colnago Downtube


Colnago seat tube


Red Colnago
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Old 11-09-19, 09:02 PM
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The purple one looks like it has a weird downturn at the top tube lug where it meets the head tube, like maybe a collision?

Anyway, nobody can tell you based on pics you showed. We need to see lugs and under the bottom bracket, at least. Most Colnagos will have club cutouts in the fork crown, in the bottom headtube lug where it extends to the downtube, and cutout of the bottom bracket, amongst other places. A lot of times either a club or COLNAGO at the seat stay caps, or on the fork crown if no club. Absence of any/all of these things would scream FAKE to me.

Based on what I'm seeing, not Colnagos. But there's so much I'm not seeing, I could easily be wrong.

PS, two links may be of interest to you to compare:

https://saarf.london/2013/02/19/how-...-fake-colnago/

Colnago, main

Last edited by francophile; 11-09-19 at 09:14 PM.
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Old 11-09-19, 11:50 PM
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Not enough photos to make an honest determination. However, having stated that:

Purple one, if authentic, has a replacement fork that is NOT Colnago. The bike might have been crashed and it was replaced, then repainted along with the frame. Replacement decals such as the type shown are available. I can just make out the diamond-shaped brake bridge reinforcements in the third, but that's it. Even then, that's not necessarily exclusive to Colnagos. Need shots of the BB shell, lower head lug and seat lug arrangement to be sure.

Red one: no identifying marks to be seen. However, that fork also looks to be a replacement. Both forks, at a minimum, should have a clover or a clover in a large C cast into the shoulders of the crown.

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Old 11-10-19, 01:13 AM
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If you have the frames in your possession, then take a bunch of photos including photos of the tops of all the lugs and the bottom of the bottom bracket. Also can you discern any branding on the dropouts (fork and rear)?

Can you make a hand drawing of the shape of each of the tubes to the best of your ability?

Like @francophile and @Drillium Dude, I am extremely skeptical that either bike is actually a Colnago. And, I am also concerned about a possible bent head tube on the purple bike.

I'm having difficulties discerning the tubing shapes that you mentioned. However, while Colnago was one of the major manufactures using shaped tubes, they weren't the only one.

Stuff that says "Not Colnago" to me:
  • Pump Nipple. I don't believe Colnago used them on their bikes. Certainly not a common feature.
  • Non Colnago Fork. While some of the early ones weren't branded, those all had flat fork crowns. Yours is a later design, and if it was Colnago, it should be branded.
  • I can't discern any clover cutouts or pantographs, or Colnago script on any part. Common locations would include:
    * Top of the main tube lugs. (a couple of lugs appear to be visible on the red bike without the cutouts).
    * Dropouts should be either "Colnago" or "Campagnolo"
    * Square brake bridges usually have a clover.
    * Fork Crown Markings. "C", "Colnago", Clovers, etc.
    * Bottom of bottom bracket.
    * Seat Stay Caps
  • Also note the rounded seat stay caps (red bike). These are a relatively later introduction, but I believe almost all have the clover pantograph. Other models had the "Colnago script". Very early models had a concave seatstay cap, without markings. But, that isn't your bike.
  • No script visible on chainstays.
  • Brazing the seat stays and chainstays to the rear dropouts, Colnago tends to use a very crisp concave half-round connection. Yours seems to have either a simple taper or a simple flat overlap.

More photos and diagrams of the tubing shapes for each main tube will help confirm, but at the moment, I'm leaning towards fakes.
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Old 11-10-19, 11:25 AM
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Old 11-10-19, 08:15 PM
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Thanks all. That's the reason I posted it because I thought it wasn't due to the bottom bracket and no club.
Seen a few Vagacini pics and it looks like that brand.
As promised, here is some details of the frame:




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Old 11-10-19, 08:20 PM
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Even if Vagacini, it's a solid frame, nothing to shrug about. But if I paid a 'nago premium price on it, I'd be less than happy.
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Old 11-10-19, 08:45 PM
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I like the crimped frame. I paid $300 for it and it was painted by the famous Canadian bike restorer Tony Beak I do believe its a Columbus SL tubing. I just didn't want to stick Colnago decals on it.
I'll have to see if it is a Vagicini and if so, label it correctly.
Thanks all, you to quirky Bianchi Girl!
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Old 11-10-19, 10:25 PM
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Quello rosso non sicuramente un Colnago

They look like well made frames but neither are Colnagos.

My 1983 Colnago Super with all the traditional symptoms of frames from the same era as the OP's. Also I didn't get into depth on seat stay tops because Colnago used a number of different styles on those frames:






Rear stays to dropout treatment



My Colnago Technos with the same rear stays to dropout treatment as on my Super.



This Technos has the same rounded seat stay tops as the OP's but with a logo an the fancy lugs. Note the fluted/crimped oversize top tub with a bulge in the middle.




There is a slim possibility that the frames are Colnago Sport which were farmed out products. EDIT (except for the crimped tubes per @CliffordK post)

verktyg

Last edited by verktyg; 11-11-19 at 07:42 AM.
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Old 11-10-19, 11:35 PM
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Originally Posted by verktyg View Post
There is a slim possibility that the frames are Colnago Sport which were farmed out products.

verktyg
The Colnago Sport breaks a lot of rules.

However, I don't believe the Sport comes with crimped tubes.
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Old 11-10-19, 11:36 PM
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If you look up "Gilco" on E-Bay, you'll find a number of bikes with crimped or fluted tubing. I'm not seeing any quite like yours, but similar. Of course models change somewhat over the years, so it might be close one year, and not quite the next.
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Old 11-11-19, 06:44 AM
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verktyg That is a hefty brake caliper! is the brake bridge strong enough to support it? Bontrager version of a Monoplaner?
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Old 11-11-19, 07:38 AM
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Bontrager Speed Limit Brakes

Originally Posted by SJX426 View Post
verktyg That is a hefty brake caliper! is the brake bridge strong enough to support it? Bontrager version of a Monoplaner?
I got this prototype set of Bontrager Speed Limit brakes to evaluate. I found a "little" problem with the QRs... They could come open in use. As I said they were final prototypes and I'd heard the problem was corrected when they went into production.





Whenever I have to "lock em up", I like to start to feel some retinal detachment - the Big Daddy Don Garlits effect!

These are the most powerful brakes I've ever used.

I bought the frame from Ed Litton. He took it in for a trade on a custom frame and had it boxed up for years.

I'd never seen a bike like this one so I went full tilt weird on the build with mostly Shimano Deore XT MTB components. It's super light and climbs like a goat.




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Old 11-26-19, 09:58 PM
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Hey everybody, just by chance I found what it is. A friend of mine saw my frame and he identified it as the same as his Rossin Record Professional which was posted in Pedal Room.
Did Rossin ever had frames made with Colnago or visa versa?
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Old 11-26-19, 10:07 PM
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Originally Posted by guelphite View Post
Hey everybody, just by chance I found what it is. A friend of mine saw my frame and he identified it as the same as his Rossin Record Professional which was posted in Pedal Room.
Did Rossin ever had frames made with Colnago or visa versa?
The bike in your link is a repaint, too, so I'd take the suggestion it's a Rossin Record Professional with a huge grain of salt.

Rossin, Colnago...these builders incorporated lots of distinguishing engravings/castings/pantographs into their lugs, BB shells, fork crowns and seat stay caps. Neither the red one or the one in the link show any evidence of engravings.

Beware of repaints because before you know it you're down the rabbit hole trying to ID the thing. There are plenty of examples here on this very forum

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Old 11-26-19, 10:28 PM
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Firstly, we're talking about the red frame, right?

Originally Posted by guelphite View Post
A friend of mine saw my frame and he identified it as the same as his Rossin Record Professional which was posted in Pedal Room.
I'm not even convinced that's a genuine Rossin. Like DD said, Rossin would typically have at least an 'R' engraved somewhere. If it is a Rossin, it should have a serial number somewhere.

Originally Posted by guelphite View Post
Did Rossin ever had frames made with Colnago or visa versa?
Don't think so. Mario Rossin was trained by Ernesto, but went off with a few other dudes to start Rossin in the mid 70's...I think.
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