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Ceramicspeed shaft drive Venge

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Road Cycling It is by riding a bicycle that you learn the contours of a country best, since you have to sweat up the hills and coast down them. Thus you remember them as they actually are, while in a motor car only a high hill impresses you, and you have no such accurate remembrance of country you have driven through as you gain by riding a bicycle. -- Ernest Hemingway

Ceramicspeed shaft drive Venge

Old 09-11-19, 02:11 PM
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nycphotography
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Ceramicspeed shaft drive Venge

This has been discussed here previously, though not really to death.

But this flavor, with covers and a Venge is actually starting to look kinda sexy...

instagram.com/p/B2Qs83Nohfd




Last edited by nycphotography; 09-11-19 at 02:14 PM.
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Old 09-11-19, 02:52 PM
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Has anyone actually ridden it? Lack of pedals makes me think answer is no.
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Old 09-11-19, 03:07 PM
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Old 09-11-19, 04:30 PM
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So apparently they've got it shifting now... kinda.

I don't think it's viable for a multi speed drivetrain. Maybe it'll be a thing on a few track bikes one day, at most.
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Old 09-11-19, 08:42 PM
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Hopefully, it will come in a different color. Maybe this is the Henry Ford model.
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Old 09-11-19, 08:57 PM
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Originally Posted by datlas View Post
Has anyone actually ridden it? Lack of pedals makes me think answer is no.
Not a single bike on the Specialized website has pedals. It's all vaporware!
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Old 09-11-19, 09:13 PM
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THAT has got to be the mofuggliest BSO I've ever seen. I hope my eyes don't start bleedin'.
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Old 09-11-19, 09:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Jon T View Post
THAT has got to be the mofuggliest BSO I've ever seen. I hope my eyes don't start bleedin'.
Jon
I have to agree.

Last edited by TimothyH; 09-11-19 at 09:38 PM.
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Old 09-11-19, 10:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Jon T View Post
THAT has got to be the mofuggliest BSO I've ever seen. I hope my eyes don't start bleedin'.
Jon
I'm not a fan of the bright silver ring on the crank set, otherwise it pretty much looks like a regular Venge. (Without the derailleurs and chain, of course.)

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Old 09-12-19, 06:24 AM
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Odd Job would approve of the frisbee dummy chainring/chainguard.
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Old 09-12-19, 06:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Kimmo View Post
So apparently they've got it shifting now... kinda.

I don't think it's viable for a multi speed drivetrain. Maybe it'll be a thing on a few track bikes one day, at most.
I was wondering about that....if it wasn't shifting--measuring aerodynamics seems rather cart/horse-ish.
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Old 09-12-19, 07:19 AM
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I think it looks way better than a chain/cog setup. It'll be interesting to see if they can get it to market.
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Old 09-12-19, 08:52 AM
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Originally Posted by Rides4Beer View Post
I think it looks way better than a chain/cog setup. It'll be interesting to see if they can get it to market.
That's the big unknown. If it doesn't work right, or rides like crap, then obviously nothing else matters.
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Old 09-12-19, 09:08 AM
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I think it would be pretty nifty if they could combine the chain stay with the drivetrain, say by using some CeramicSpeed bearings... Otherwise, it just looks like it has two chainstays on the drive side.
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Old 09-12-19, 09:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Rides4Beer View Post
I think it looks way better than a chain/cog setup.
In a George Jetson/Spacely Sprockets kind of way, yes.

The crank arm and cover looks like a turntable from the 1950's.


-Tim-
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Old 09-12-19, 10:04 AM
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Originally Posted by nycphotography View Post
That's the big unknown. If it doesn't work right, or rides like crap, then obviously nothing else matters.
Without a doubt, cool concepts don't mean much if they don't work.


Originally Posted by TimothyH View Post
In a George Jetson/Spacely Sprockets kind of way, yes.

The crank arm and cover looks like a turntable from the 1950's.

-Tim-
Absolutely, but I like modern looking stuff. Can't say I care for the silver ring, but the overall shape/design is nice. Would look better on a bike with some color too.
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Old 09-12-19, 10:35 AM
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For me to be on board, components would need to have a reasonable lifespan and be able to handle big power. Looks like only one little bearing is in contact with the cassette at any given time. Maybe it can handle it?
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Old 09-12-19, 11:03 AM
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Obviously it depends on execution, but if this works, I could see a version of this on commuters or bike-share bikes. Combine the shaft drive with a commuter-style internally geared rear hub, there's potential for lower drivetrain maintenance.

I think it looks cool, but I wonder how it deals with shock, bumps, and vibration. Chains have links, derailleurs have springs. If these things aren't adequately resolved, I don't think we'd see this working for commuters, let alone enthusiasts or professionals.
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Old 09-12-19, 11:49 AM
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Originally Posted by aliasfox View Post
Obviously it depends on execution, but if this works, I could see a version of this on commuters or bike-share bikes. Combine the shaft drive with a commuter-style internally geared rear hub, there's potential for lower drivetrain maintenance.

I think it looks cool, but I wonder how it deals with shock, bumps, and vibration. Chains have links, derailleurs have springs. If these things aren't adequately resolved, I don't think we'd see this working for commuters, let alone enthusiasts or professionals.
Shaft drive commuter bikes have existed for years. I believe these have struggled with high-ish power even using conventional right angle gear components. As have internally geared hubs. And the big downside is that you have all those issues plus *more* drivetrain frictional losses. I'll be shocked if this is not the dead-end that many are already speculating it is.
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Old 09-12-19, 01:54 PM
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Originally Posted by joejack951 View Post
Shaft drive commuter bikes have existed for years. I believe these have struggled with high-ish power even using conventional right angle gear components. As have internally geared hubs. And the big downside is that you have all those issues plus *more* drivetrain frictional losses. I'll be shocked if this is not the dead-end that many are already speculating it is.
They were heavy and limited to fixed gear, basically.

Given this is one OEM vendors pet system....I don't see widespread adoption no matter what.
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Old 09-12-19, 02:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Marcus_Ti View Post
They were heavy and limited to fixed gear, basically.

Given this is one OEM vendors pet system....I don't see widespread adoption no matter what.
Pretty sure there are others like it but this shaft driven bike has an internally geared hub, *best* of both worlds, right?

https://beixo.com/product/beixo-comp...al_information
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Old 09-12-19, 02:42 PM
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Putting a drive through 90 degrees has always been rather inefficient.
They are doing it twice.
Even with the roller bearings, strange drive teeth etc, I just can't see it being more efficient than a chain.
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Old 09-12-19, 02:43 PM
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I can't afford this. And, thankfully, I don't need it. That about sums up my take on it. If it works for others...great.
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Old 09-12-19, 03:07 PM
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I hope Rapha rebrands it.


-Tim-
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Old 09-12-19, 03:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Dean V View Post
Putting a drive through 90 degrees has always been rather inefficient.
They are doing it twice.
Even with the roller bearings, strange drive teeth etc, I just can't see it being more efficient than a chain.
I can see it being slightly more efficient if they build a nice, closed, drive system.

I can can never see it being *simpler* than a chain-drive, though. See, I get the gates belt-drive; it replaces all the links of a chain with a single belt. Very straightforward. Fewer moving parts. The shaft drive, though, is replacing the chain links with, as you say, 2x 90deg pivots, which are more complex than the chainlinks, and will probably have to be sealed to keep the road-spray out.

It ignores that the beauty of a bicycle is its simplicity. A 10 year old can learn to maintain a chain-drive derailleur gearing system. The shaft-drive system looks like something that youll have to take into a dealer every time it starts skipping.

I cant see it ever catching on, or replacing the chain drive, but at the same time, Hats off to Ceramic Speed for trying it, building prototypes, exploring new things. Even if it never goes into production, its a forward-thinking idea. And its more interesting to look at than just we saved a half a watt by lowering the seat stays 2cm.
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