burnthesheep

This falls under "once you see it in the mirror".

I now feel like an ass. Once or twice one of the guys in the group took me out to the local rails to trails to paceline about 20ish miles or something. Not a recovery cruise. He was hunting for segments and I gladly obliged.

Now that I see a different guy from the B group posting stuff up doing the same, I feel guilty about doing it.

I know for sure the two guys had to cut a lot of blind corners at speed to do what they did. Now I feel stupid for doing that same thing.

If they show up to the group ride, would you ever kindly say something like "looking nice, but you guys might want to be a little safer and come join the A-group instead of racing the trails and apartment complexes".

This is a group of two to four guys who like to bash around town on greenways and do hot laps of apartment complexes running about 50 stop signs per ride.

I think the "a-ha" for myself was encountering the unexpected around some blind corners a few times but managing to not cause a problem. Then realizing I was being foolish.

What do you think? Those guys as a whole have a mildly unhealthy outlook on the whole thing. It's basically the "street racer" syndrome applied to bicycles. And not a one of them would probably ever take up actual racing.

rumrunn6

of course you can say something. imagine if a kid or elderly person like your grandmother was struck & injured or worse & you said nothing or did nothing

I would not ride with them & I would tell them why

Witterings

Interesting question given that in the UK news within the last couple of days there's been discussion about passing a new law - "death by dangerous cycling" .... like to see what other people's opinions are.

burnthesheep

Agreed. It could lead to something bad.

Maybe in addition to saying something, I should propose that we offer a safe environment for beginners to try out a "hammer ride". There are such things for stronger riders, maybe it's a gap that could be filled.

jefnvk

Start flagging all the segements as dangerous. If they aren't getting a Strava reward, they'll likely move on.

jasnooks

X2 on this.
Although I doubt saying something will change the way they ride, but at least your conscience is clear.

burnthesheep

I used to think that this was BS, but now I totally get it. If a segment exists on a bike path, the leaderboard will escalate attempts until it gets silly.

What keyed me off was they posted a ride up bragging about pacelining a local rails-trail at 24mph to go grab a 5 mile segment. This area has lots of good vis straights, but also a lot of tight and blind corners. And lots of foot traffic in summer.

Colnago Mixte

These CAT 7 racers would probably look at you as if you were a kid or someone's grandmother if you told them to slow down.

wphamilton

It's a hot-button for me, people who take the blind corners fast on a MUP in the wrong lane, passing little groups sometimes with small children in them. Partly because one of them panicked one time, target fixation, and ran into me leaving me with a 6 inch scar on my arm.


I don't have angry discussions with them when I see it, but when it's close and particularly bone-headed I tend to let them know on the way by.


7 or 8 years ago, like you @burnthesheep I did like to go pretty fast on our Greenway, but it was in off-hours when hardly anyone was about and when I did see pedestrians or cyclists I'd just slow down and abandon any idea of a fast segment. When it got more popular, and the behavior got worse, I got embarrassed seeing my name on Strava and flagged my faster rides, and stay off the leader boards now. The last thing I need is for people to think I'm one of those guys.

MoAlpha

Downside of being an adult.

rumrunn6

& cops often say: "there's nothing we can do" that doesn't mean we shouldn't report an incident

TimothyH

Call the police, that's all.

They are not going to listen to a fellow cyclists and will just tell you to mind your business.

If they are really running 50 stops signs per ride and you feel strong enough about it then just report it and they will listen to the police. This avoids an argument, stops the problem and your conscience will be clean.

Enforcing traffic laws is part of what we pay taxes for and what the police get paid to do.


-Tim-

zoolzoo

do you really give a ****?

livedarklions

I will go very fast on a path, but only on straight passages where I can see a quarter mile or so ahead of me, which gives me plenty of time to make my presence known and/or slow down. I slow down a lot and then accelerate very quickly after passing on a straightaway. It's great exercise for the legs.

If I see kids or a dog, I slow way down whether or not I've had a chance to warn. It only takes one time of not giving yourself enough time to react if the kid or dog does something you couldn't have anticipated, and no parent or dog owner can absolutely prevent that from happening.

I save myself from my worst competitive instincts by avoiding Strava.

Maelochs

If you talk to the riders, tell them you've decided not to ride that way because it is unsafe and irresponsible and you don't want to hurt one of their grandmothers out on her walker ..... point it too directly at them and (competitive people being what they are) they will insult you and do it with greater glee.

Not sure about flagging segments only because i had never heard of it, but if it makes KOMs worthless, do it.

Police is a last recourse .... because without a resident complaint the cops might not do anything, depends on a lot of things ... but decide First---if you are planning to call the cops, for sure don't say anything to the riders, and vice versa.

chicagogal

Most MUPs have 15mph seed limits. Thus, this group is actually breaking the law. When cyclists break laws, it looks bad on all of us.

mstateglfr 

Why not ask them if they want to join you to hunt some road segments? Thats a natural transition into why you want to go for road segments and you can explain why you are uncomfortable with doing trail segment hunting. They can then decide whether they want to continue riding that way.

Nonconfrontational and you offer an alternative.

livedarklions

That must be a regional thing. I saw a posted limit of 25 mph on one around here, bot otherwise I don't beleve any of them I've been on have speed limits.

Clyde1820

If a user of a MUP and I find that some folks are really abusing it and putting others at risk, I'd certainly say something.

And if it came to such folks frequently doing so on that route, such as frequently disregarding traffic controls and/or whizzing by people unsafely, I'd probably mention it to local LE so they could be aware and begin enforcing the laws/regs there.

Now, if it were a bike-only type route, that'd be something completely different. But, still, since everyone else has every right to also use the path reasonably, and to be free from deliberately-induced unsafe conditions, it'd be much like the MUP example.

Do I really care? Insofar as serious threat of injuries exist in such mixed-use situations where one party is grossly abusing things to the point of recklessness/wantonness? Yup, at that level of risk.

But, that's me.

livedarklions

I have definitely yelled at strangers for riding like that on MUPs, especially after they've had close calls with kids they seemed utterly oblivious to.

Clyde1820

^ That's my big fear on true multi-use, multi-mode pathways. It's the kids, typically, who jet off in an unanticipated direction, seemingly at random, but invariably whenever suddenly scared from an approaching person on bike/board. (Some adults do this, too.)

If the kids are put at risk, I also have howled warnings to such groups and asked the overtaking (speeding) folks to have more caution since everyone else is attempting to safely enjoy use of the path as well. Wish it weren't necessary, but sometimes it certainly is.

chicagogal

Perhaps. I have lived in several states in the east, west, south, and midwest, and have only known 15mph for MUPs.

livedarklions

I've recently ridden on many, many miles of paths in 4 New England states. I've never seen this anywhere. There could be local ordinances, but it's definitely not state law here, it's definitely not an ordinance in the city I live in, and there are no posted limits on any of the paths in the region that I'm aware of other than one in NH that posts 25 mph. Where have you seen speed limits in the east? Not interrogating or challenging you, I'm just curious.

Wildwood 

I have a friend who rides a crowded MUP too fast, I've told him his riding style/speed scare me. He refuses to admit it is dangerous. I won't ride with him on that trail. Period.

wipekitty

I agree with starting by just flagging the Strava segments. If it continues, more drastic steps may need to be taken.

Indeed. I recall 15MPH speed limits on the SART in SoCal as well as some of the MUPs in the Denver area. Someone can correct me if I'm wrong or it's changed since I've lived in those places.

La Crosse, WI has no speed limits on the MUP, and AFAIK no limits on the regional bike trails (which also function as snowmobile trails in winter). I also recall no speed limits on the very tiny sections of MUP in Mobile, AL.