Late 1960s Bottecchia
#1
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Late 1960s Bottecchia
Interesting bike I just picked up, mostly for the derailleurs and brake levers. Wondering what you can tell me about it. It has a 1967 Campione Italiano sticker so it is at least that late but the derailleurs and components lead me to believe it is pre-1970.
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fine job with the photos
certainly appears boomery, or very close thereto
fork crown is Agrati "BRIANZA" pattern nr. 000.8038
brakes are Sport model, not 61
Way-Assauto headset
pedals are Sheffield Corsa model Nr. 655
there is a story in the trade regarding the Record model rear mech on the cycle
story goes that R model rear mech had gone out of production and Teddy wished to use it on this model so he persuaded Tullio to put it back into production for him
original wheels were likely Campag Nuovo Tipo large flange with tubular rims from NISI
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fine job with the photos
certainly appears boomery, or very close thereto
fork crown is Agrati "BRIANZA" pattern nr. 000.8038
brakes are Sport model, not 61
Way-Assauto headset
pedals are Sheffield Corsa model Nr. 655
there is a story in the trade regarding the Record model rear mech on the cycle
story goes that R model rear mech had gone out of production and Teddy wished to use it on this model so he persuaded Tullio to put it back into production for him
original wheels were likely Campag Nuovo Tipo large flange with tubular rims from NISI
-----
Last edited by juvela; 06-01-20 at 05:15 PM. Reason: spellin'
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I can’t add to the conversation but would like to say that that’s a good looking Bottecchia.
#4
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-----
fine job with the photos
certainly appears boomery, or very close thereto
fork crown is Agrati "BRIANZA" pattern nr. 000.8038
brakes are Sport model, not 61
Way-Assauto headset
pedals are Sheffield Corsa model Nr. 655
there is a story in the trade regarding the Record model rear mech on the cycle
story goes that R model rear mech had gone out of production and Teddy wished to use it on this model so he persuaded Tullio to put it back into production for him
original wheels were likely Campag Nuovo Tipo large flange with tubular rims from NISI
-----
fine job with the photos
certainly appears boomery, or very close thereto
fork crown is Agrati "BRIANZA" pattern nr. 000.8038
brakes are Sport model, not 61
Way-Assauto headset
pedals are Sheffield Corsa model Nr. 655
there is a story in the trade regarding the Record model rear mech on the cycle
story goes that R model rear mech had gone out of production and Teddy wished to use it on this model so he persuaded Tullio to put it back into production for him
original wheels were likely Campag Nuovo Tipo large flange with tubular rims from NISI
-----
Last edited by Narhay; 06-01-20 at 06:07 PM.
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my estimate for model year would be 1969-70.
agree it looks to be the Giro d'Italia model.
was able to see a few small differences between it and the all out boomer examples owned by members, of which we have several.
seems a shame to break it up for parts when it is so original and in such fine shape - makes a wonderful time capsule item for its moment in history - not often one finds a fifty year old machine so all original and in such fine condition...(due lira di mio )
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my estimate for model year would be 1969-70.
agree it looks to be the Giro d'Italia model.
was able to see a few small differences between it and the all out boomer examples owned by members, of which we have several.
seems a shame to break it up for parts when it is so original and in such fine shape - makes a wonderful time capsule item for its moment in history - not often one finds a fifty year old machine so all original and in such fine condition...(due lira di mio )
-----
#6
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Thread Starter
-----
my estimate for model year would be 1969-70.
agree it looks to be the Giro d'Italia model.
was able to see a few small differences between it and the all out boomer examples owned by members, of which we have several.
seems a shame to break it up for parts when it is so original and in such fine shape - makes a wonderful time capsule item for its moment in history - not often one finds a fifty year old machine so all original and in such fine condition...(due lira di mio )
-----
my estimate for model year would be 1969-70.
agree it looks to be the Giro d'Italia model.
was able to see a few small differences between it and the all out boomer examples owned by members, of which we have several.
seems a shame to break it up for parts when it is so original and in such fine shape - makes a wonderful time capsule item for its moment in history - not often one finds a fifty year old machine so all original and in such fine condition...(due lira di mio )
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#7
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Even as a massive Paramount fan, I categorically disagree with the idea that the Paramount has greater importance. That Bottecchia is arguably a much rarer bird than the well-documented Paramounts, even though the Italian machine may not be of the same build quality. I might add that the level of originality on this Bottecchia is pretty superb. Not often you get to see them this nice, and it'd clean up phenomenally.
Also, I just can't see the logic in replacing the Weinmanns with Universals. Those brakes weren't common on Paramounts ever, and even BITD, I can't see someone making that substitution for the same reason I can't quite fathom it today - the Weinmann calipers work better (though I can see the levers being nicer to use). And if not Weinmanns, there are Mafacs out there which could fit the period and do an even better job.
But as long as there are pieces to pick up off the floor, I have to ask...what's going to happen to the stem?
-Kurt
Also, I just can't see the logic in replacing the Weinmanns with Universals. Those brakes weren't common on Paramounts ever, and even BITD, I can't see someone making that substitution for the same reason I can't quite fathom it today - the Weinmann calipers work better (though I can see the levers being nicer to use). And if not Weinmanns, there are Mafacs out there which could fit the period and do an even better job.
But as long as there are pieces to pick up off the floor, I have to ask...what's going to happen to the stem?
-Kurt
Last edited by cudak888; 06-01-20 at 06:38 PM.
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Narhay -
for mcmlxiii you shall require a Record front mech with a housing stop
also the Record rear mech worn by Teddy is not correct for Arnie, it is a relaunch and has some small differences from the original.
a Record rear mech on a 1963 model year machine is a bit of a grey area as the accepted nominal launch date for the Record rear mech is december 1963.
if was common at one time for parts makers to announce new products at winter trade shows when there were none in inventory to sell. first shipping often did not come until the following spring.
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Narhay -
for mcmlxiii you shall require a Record front mech with a housing stop
also the Record rear mech worn by Teddy is not correct for Arnie, it is a relaunch and has some small differences from the original.
a Record rear mech on a 1963 model year machine is a bit of a grey area as the accepted nominal launch date for the Record rear mech is december 1963.
if was common at one time for parts makers to announce new products at winter trade shows when there were none in inventory to sell. first shipping often did not come until the following spring.
-----
Last edited by juvela; 06-01-20 at 06:56 PM.
#9
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Even as a massive Paramount fan, I categorically disagree with the idea that the Paramount has greater importance. That Bottecchia is arguably a much rarer bird than the well-documented Paramounts, even though the Italian machine may not be of the same build quality. I might add that the level of originality on this Bottecchia is pretty superb. Not often you get to see them this nice, and it'd clean up phenomenally.
Also, I just can't see the logic in replacing the Weinmanns with Universals. Those brakes weren't common on Paramounts ever, and even BITD, I can't see someone making that substitution for the same reason I can't quite fathom it today - the Weinmann calipers work better (though I can see the levers being nicer to use). And if not Weinmanns, there are Mafacs out there which could fit the period and do an even better job.
But as long as there are pieces to pick up off the floor, I have to ask...what's going to happen to the stem?
-Kurt
Also, I just can't see the logic in replacing the Weinmanns with Universals. Those brakes weren't common on Paramounts ever, and even BITD, I can't see someone making that substitution for the same reason I can't quite fathom it today - the Weinmann calipers work better (though I can see the levers being nicer to use). And if not Weinmanns, there are Mafacs out there which could fit the period and do an even better job.
But as long as there are pieces to pick up off the floor, I have to ask...what's going to happen to the stem?
-Kurt
As far as the brakes go I got the 63 paramount as a frame and the brakes I had on hand of a similar period were universal mod 61s and some mafac racers. Ideally I would find a set of early weinmann 999s but a suitable set hasnt cropped up so these levers are a nice matching find. I have mafacs on my px10 so I wanted to try something else, otherwise I feel like I keep building up the same 2 or 3 bikes with the same combination of parts.
I just cant really justify putting the same amount money to a gran sport or record set of mechs when a local bike like this pops up at a good price with the parts I desire. I understand my moral dilemma here as I spend most of my time building bikes back to stock but this frame doesn't fit and I have one that does that these parts would be better suited to.
#10
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Before you take it apart, please see how it rides in its current condition (assuming it's safe).
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Blogs: The Experienced Cyclist; noglider's ride blog
“When man invented the bicycle he reached the peak of his attainments.” — Elizabeth West, US author
Please email me rather than PM'ing me. Thanks.
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I just cant really justify putting the same amount money to a gran sport or record set of mechs when a local bike like this pops up at a good price with the parts I desire. I understand my moral dilemma here as I spend most of my time building bikes back to stock but this frame doesn't fit and I have one that does that these parts would be better suited to.
Might work. Heck, you've got me wondering where I have my one non-matching early Weinmann 999 caliper, though I'm pretty sure it's a pre-1962 version with a single spring.
EDIT: A correct rear brake has shown up on eBay for dirt cheap. Will PM. If you win it, you can have my front caliper.
-Kurt
#12
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Ok, one of you will have to come tell my wife why this bike isnt disappearing bit by bit but instead costing me (her) more money to put right.
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Second rule is, of course: Always have enough bikes so if the wife does see a new one in there, she won't notice the difference.
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● 1971 Grandis SL ● 1972 Lambert Grand Prix frankenbike ● 1972 Raleigh Super Course fixie ● 1973 Nishiki Semi-Pro ● 1979 Motobecane Grand Jubile ●1980 Apollo "Legnano" ● 1984 Peugeot Vagabond ● 1985 Shogun Prairie Breaker ● 1986 Merckx Super Corsa ● 1987 Schwinn Tempo ● 1988 Schwinn Voyageur ● 1989 Bottechia Team ADR replica ● 1990 Cannondale ST600 ● 1993 Technium RT600 ● 1996 Kona Lava Dome ●
● 1971 Grandis SL ● 1972 Lambert Grand Prix frankenbike ● 1972 Raleigh Super Course fixie ● 1973 Nishiki Semi-Pro ● 1979 Motobecane Grand Jubile ●1980 Apollo "Legnano" ● 1984 Peugeot Vagabond ● 1985 Shogun Prairie Breaker ● 1986 Merckx Super Corsa ● 1987 Schwinn Tempo ● 1988 Schwinn Voyageur ● 1989 Bottechia Team ADR replica ● 1990 Cannondale ST600 ● 1993 Technium RT600 ● 1996 Kona Lava Dome ●
Last edited by Lascauxcaveman; 06-01-20 at 09:19 PM.
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Narhay, there’s really nothing to tell her but the truth. The bike is simply too pretty to go away in pieces. I hope she’ll understand.
Last edited by Pcampeau; 06-02-20 at 12:30 AM.
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this mention of sneaking new arrivals past one's SO reminds me of a local vintage collector friend (who also rides a great deal)
he and his wife live in a fairly large two story house with a three-car garage. the garage has its own little attic area for storage. he has spoken of sneaking in new arrivals in order to maintain the "domestic peace and tranquilitude." of course when he has occasion to make a divestiture there is a big show of that.
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this mention of sneaking new arrivals past one's SO reminds me of a local vintage collector friend (who also rides a great deal)
he and his wife live in a fairly large two story house with a three-car garage. the garage has its own little attic area for storage. he has spoken of sneaking in new arrivals in order to maintain the "domestic peace and tranquilitude." of course when he has occasion to make a divestiture there is a big show of that.
-----
#16
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I practice the covert n+1. I don't like doing it but I won/t go there. I have enough hanging together that they don't get noticed. Although, I am surprised that two red bikes don't get attention when there was only one.
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#18
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I agree that is a very attractive bike "as is" and just needs a down tube decal and a Columbus tubing decal to make it complete IMHO. I have a frame like that that I plan to build up to giro d'Italia style, though I don't expect to find a handlebar like that for it.
Would be interested in hearing how many teeth are on the small chainring. I've got a 52 38 Nervar I was planning to use.
I also think the Bottecchia line has its own historical significance, given Ottavio Bottecchia was possibly assassinated by fascists. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ottavio_Bottecchia
Would be interested in hearing how many teeth are on the small chainring. I've got a 52 38 Nervar I was planning to use.
I also think the Bottecchia line has its own historical significance, given Ottavio Bottecchia was possibly assassinated by fascists. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ottavio_Bottecchia
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CL provided one for me. I didn't really know the brand at that point but what sold me were the chrome lugs. It looked like near top of the line so I paid more than I probably should have. It was a franken bike with a few original parts. It was part of an estate sale. Here is the before pic
1972 Bottecchia Giro D'italia 60cm, on Flickr
It is my size so it became a keeper due to the chrome lugs! I know the big ring is 53, not sure what the other is
Since my 1971 Motobecane Le Champion was taken out of service by a car, I took the parts off of it and turned my Giro into a Professional. The only original parts on the bike are the wheels, head set and BB. BTW the frame set is the same between the two. The price difference was in the components.
I have replacement decals to apply. The paint is incredibly blue. Too bad it isn't in as good a shape as Narhay example. Workmanship is not to be envied.
1972 Bottecchia Giro D'Italia (Professional conversion), on Flickr
1972 Bottecchia Giro D'italia 60cm, on Flickr
It is my size so it became a keeper due to the chrome lugs! I know the big ring is 53, not sure what the other is
Since my 1971 Motobecane Le Champion was taken out of service by a car, I took the parts off of it and turned my Giro into a Professional. The only original parts on the bike are the wheels, head set and BB. BTW the frame set is the same between the two. The price difference was in the components.
I have replacement decals to apply. The paint is incredibly blue. Too bad it isn't in as good a shape as Narhay example. Workmanship is not to be envied.
1972 Bottecchia Giro D'Italia (Professional conversion), on Flickr
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If someone posted that photo, we'd all say "that bike is too big for you! "
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#21
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