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Track Tire Questions

Old 08-31-18, 06:38 AM
  #326  
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Originally Posted by rensho3 View Post
LOL-I can't figure out how to multiquote, so this for Baby Puke too.
There are three buttons in the lower right corner. The middle one with what looks like two sheets of paper and a plus sign is the multi-quote option. Click it in the first posts you want to quote, then click Quote in the last post you want to quote. All the quotes should be there.
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Old 08-31-18, 03:57 PM
  #327  
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Originally Posted by Morelock View Post
Shade. That's what the kids are throwing these days.
I had to look that one up:

https://www.merriam-webster.com/words-at-play/shade
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Old 09-01-18, 06:58 AM
  #328  
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see, I'm hip.
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Old 09-02-18, 02:11 AM
  #329  
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Originally Posted by Morelock View Post
see, I'm hip.
Unfortunately immediately revoked for using the word hip...
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Old 09-02-18, 05:34 PM
  #330  
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A Mavic iO (old version) has fallen into my lap, basically. I've heard these prefer a 19mm tire, but I have a 22mm on hand. How important is the 19mm?
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Old 09-02-18, 06:20 PM
  #331  
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Originally Posted by Baby Puke View Post
A Mavic iO (old version) has fallen into my lap, basically. I've heard these prefer a 19mm tire, but I have a 22mm on hand. How important is the 19mm?
Go with 19. 22mm will mushroom over the sides. The rim bed is made for 19mm.

I did this very thing. When I got my Io, I had a 22mm Conti Steher tire and had it installed. Nope. I then swapped it for 19mm Veloflex Record. Was perfect.

That tire also lasted until I sold the wheel a couple of years later. Big fan of Veloflex Record.
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Old 09-02-18, 07:40 PM
  #332  
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^ +1

The old rims like the iO and trispoke's aerodynamics are VERY dependent on the tyre and how it mates with the rim. Running a wider tyre on them is very, very bad aerodynamically.
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Old 09-02-18, 08:41 PM
  #333  
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Thanks guys. Dang it. Spouse won't be thrilled to spend MORE money on this "sweet deal" haha...
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Old 09-03-18, 03:13 AM
  #334  
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Tangentially related to track tire questions:
This iO wheel just showed up (it's very sexy) and the (dead) tire was affixed with tubular tape. I know some people use this, but I've never seen it close up before.

PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT: Please do not use tape to mount your tires. The previous owner used two layers of tape, which were stuck to each other pretty darn well. Unfortunately, the tape was not stuck well at all to either the base tape or the rim bed. It was frighteningly easy to remove this tire. The tire in question was Vittoria Pista EVO and I have never successfully removed one of these from my own wheels (I use Mastik 1) without destroying the base tape. The base tape on this tire looked factory fresh. Scary.
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Old 09-03-18, 05:05 PM
  #335  
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Originally Posted by Baby Puke View Post
Tangentially related to track tire questions:
This iO wheel just showed up (it's very sexy) and the (dead) tire was affixed with tubular tape. I know some people use this, but I've never seen it close up before.

PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT: Please do not use tape to mount your tires. The previous owner used two layers of tape, which were stuck to each other pretty darn well. Unfortunately, the tape was not stuck well at all to either the base tape or the rim bed. It was frighteningly easy to remove this tire. The tire in question was Vittoria Pista EVO and I have never successfully removed one of these from my own wheels (I use Mastik 1) without destroying the base tape. The base tape on this tire looked factory fresh. Scary.
1) Time to renegotiate with the wife for your monthly (okozukai) allowance. Araya disc + Mavic Io in exchange for not staggering home from a hostess bar on a nightly basis.

2) In all seriousness, it's pretty crazy that people use tubular tape, even if they use the "Belgian method". Mastik 1 yay!

3) A 22mm tubular isn't bad aerodynamically if you use it on the back wheel -- the 105% rule doesn't really apply when it's sheltered by the seat tube -- so it'll be useful at some point.
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Old 09-03-18, 05:37 PM
  #336  
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The older fat spoke Io looks best. The newer thin spokes look like Aerospoke wheels.

I honestly believe that there is absolutely no functional difference between the two. Companies do this from time to time to mix it up and have people buy new stuff. For example, how much faster can the modern LOOK 496 be when compared to the original 496 “Athenes” which are still being ridden today.

BT was cool about sticking with designs that worked for years and not changing to increase sales.

Originally Posted by tobukog View Post
1) Time to renegotiate with the wife for your monthly (okozukai) allowance. Araya disc + Mavic Io in exchange for not staggering home from a hostess bar on a nightly basis.

2) In all seriousness, it's pretty crazy that people use tubular tape, even if they use the "Belgian method". Mastik 1 yay!

3) A 22mm tubular isn't bad aerodynamically if you use it on the back wheel -- the 105% rule doesn't really apply when it's sheltered by the seat tube -- so it'll be useful at some point.
The rim bed of the mating Comete is much wider and designed for 22/23mm tires.

You are also right about the seat tube. Of all the aero equipment options, it’s either the rear wheel or the frame that is at the bottom of the list of gains.

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Old 09-04-18, 05:01 AM
  #337  
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Originally Posted by tobukog View Post
1) Time to renegotiate with the wife for your monthly (okozukai) allowance. Araya disc + Mavic Io in exchange for not staggering home from a hostess bar on a nightly basis.
I keep telling her this. It's not working.
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Old 09-04-18, 07:03 AM
  #338  
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My wife rides and races. And early in her life, she was a bit more of a profligate spender. As a result, she never questions any of my cycling purchases, and often encourages them - which is not good. I don't need encouragement - our budget can't handle it.
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Old 09-04-18, 08:07 AM
  #339  
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Originally Posted by carleton View Post
The older fat spoke Io looks best. The newer thin spokes look like Aerospoke wheels.

I honestly believe that there is absolutely no functional difference between the two. Companies do this from time to time to mix it up and have people buy new stuff. For example, how much faster can the modern LOOK 496 be when compared to the original 496 “Athenes” which are still being ridden today.


I think the main purpose of the iO RIO was to allow the use of wider tyres without the aero penalty. It would gain you some nonzero bit of crr as well. That said... the old "narrow is aero" matters with the leading tyre... so it's possibly a wash between the two (as the 19mm Vitt is a fast tyre to begin with) especially in the low yaw scenario you'd expect the velodrome to be. Still, wider tyre has a few other benefits when you're looking for every last thousandth of a second.

Fwiw, Josh Poertner found the 5 spokes to be slower than 808's... but, basically they didn't look as cool and so riders didn't like (or ride) them.
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Old 09-04-18, 12:27 PM
  #340  
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Originally Posted by Morelock View Post
I think the main purpose of the iO RIO was to allow the use of wider tyres without the aero penalty. It would gain you some nonzero bit of crr as well. That said... the old "narrow is aero" matters with the leading tyre... so it's possibly a wash between the two (as the 19mm Vitt is a fast tyre to begin with) especially in the low yaw scenario you'd expect the velodrome to be. Still, wider tyre has a few other benefits when you're looking for every last thousandth of a second.

Fwiw, Josh Poertner found the 5 spokes to be slower than 808's... but, basically they didn't look as cool and so riders didn't like (or ride) them.
Having owned the older IO (like Baby Puke) and 2 sets of 808 track (early model and Firecrest), my anecdotal testing revealed no measurable difference between the two...except in my bank account
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Old 09-04-18, 12:34 PM
  #341  
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@carleton
Even more reason to look cool
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Old 09-04-18, 04:38 PM
  #342  
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This thing was a screaming deal, much less than you'd expect to pay even for a used 808. I couldn't say no!
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Old 09-04-18, 07:32 PM
  #343  
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Originally Posted by carleton View Post
I honestly believe that there is absolutely no functional difference between the two. Companies do this from time to time to mix it up and have people buy new stuff. For example, how much faster can the modern LOOK 496 be when compared to the original 496 “Athenes” which are still being ridden today.


I haven't seen one of the new iO's in person, but I'm guessing that in addition to the wider rim they must have gone to a U-shaped rim profile (ala Zipp), and would guess that the thinner spokes are to reduce the pulse turbulence that testers have found with carbon spoked wheels. The Mavic materials claim a 20 watt improvement over the old wheel, but that's a bit vague without the context of the test.

But I agree, the older wheel is better looking.
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Old 09-04-18, 10:42 PM
  #344  
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Originally Posted by Baby Puke View Post
I haven't seen one of the new iO's in person, but I'm guessing that in addition to the wider rim they must have gone to a U-shaped rim profile (ala Zipp), and would guess that the thinner spokes are to reduce the pulse turbulence that testers have found with carbon spoked wheels. The Mavic materials claim a 20 watt improvement over the old wheel, but that's a bit vague without the context of the test.

But I agree, the older wheel is better looking.[/left]
I'm glad you got a smoking deal. I paid A LOT for my Io/Comete set.

Mavic won't publish the test results.

This has got to be their singular most expensive wheel at $4,000 USD (front wheel only). Also note that they don't make a version of this wheel available for road TT use. They only offer a 64mm wheel (front or front+rear combo). The wheelSET is $2,100USD.

I've seen and handled a new Io in person. The fit and finish are nice as expected...still reminded me of an Aerospoke


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Old 09-04-18, 10:52 PM
  #345  
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Ouch.
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Old 09-05-18, 03:56 AM
  #346  
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In a dystopian future, hipsters will do skids on Mavic iO Rio's.
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Old 09-05-18, 03:07 PM
  #347  
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Originally Posted by Morelock View Post
In a dystopian future, hipsters will do skids on Mavic iO Rio's.
We are already there.




It gets worse...much worse...
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Old 09-05-18, 05:08 PM
  #348  
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interesting
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Old 09-05-18, 09:23 PM
  #349  
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Trust fund, obviously.
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Old 09-06-18, 08:30 AM
  #350  
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That image just makes me weep.
Instagram profile says he is an ex track pro, so i guess theres at least some reason for him to have that equipment.
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