RIP, the classic touring bike?
06-10-15, 10:00 AM
#51
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The same TW companies that most brands go to can make thousands of bike frames/forks to your specifications.
.. thats what they do.. order enough and they will put your Logo On..
.. thats what they do.. order enough and they will put your Logo On..
06-16-15, 11:04 PM
#52
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My 2007 REI Safari is a great touring bike in the classic design. 26", disc brake, aluminum frame. I have upgraded a few components over the years. This a dependable and sturdy touring bike even on gravel or dirt routes. It was designed by REI to ride the Great Divide MTB Route.
Last edited by JoeMan; 06-16-15 at 11:08 PM. Reason: Typo
06-17-15, 05:30 AM
#53
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My 2007 REI Safari is a great touring bike in the classic design. 26", disc brake, aluminum frame. I have upgraded a few components over the years. This a dependable and sturdy touring bike even on gravel or dirt routes. It was designed by REI to ride the Great Divide MTB Route.
I am not knocking the Safari, I just don't think it fits the classic touring bike category.
BTW, my touring bike choice these days isn't a classic touring bike either.
06-17-15, 07:09 AM
#55
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My 2007 REI Safari is a great touring bike in the classic design. 26", disc brake, aluminum frame. I have upgraded a few components over the years. This a dependable and sturdy touring bike even on gravel or dirt routes. It was designed by REI to ride the Great Divide MTB Route.
While the Safari is a nice bike, it doesn't fit my idea of a classic touring bike. It has more in common with a mountain bike than a classic touring bike. IMO, classic bikes aren't aluminum, don't have 26" wheels, and do have drop bars. Of course folks will disagree on what constitutes a classic touring bike, but I doubt the Safari fits that category for most.
I am not knocking the Safari, I just don't think it fits the classic touring bike category.
BTW, my touring bike choice these days isn't a classic touring bike either.
I am not knocking the Safari, I just don't think it fits the classic touring bike category.
BTW, my touring bike choice these days isn't a classic touring bike either.
06-17-15, 07:33 AM
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Maybe we classify bikes too ridgidly, give a type of bike too much importance. Most frames and rims are pretty flexible when it comes to use. The classic trecking bikes with the slightly strengthened tubing, 28" wheels, often with the option of adding mudguards. Isn't this the basic bike? It's aslo ideal for commuting, trips, getting about on your every day errands? I don't think it's out of favor or popularity, people still go on the road for days and weeks. For decades the fashion has been towards MTB frames and suspension forks with exactly the same purpose and still is to a large degree. It's like meeting the requirements of the road from an off road view point rather than the racer. I think the racer will always be an ideal though, minimal weight, narrow rims and tires, optimised for efficient use of energy and easy riding; it just needs slightly tweaking for a different job. I hope it makes sense ;- )
06-20-15, 04:19 PM
#57
Individual variety and choice is where things have been going and continue to head. I never see anyone touring on a bike/rig that's identical to anyone else's. Choice rules to meet the needs of each touring cyclist.
06-20-15, 04:44 PM
#58
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In biology, when a species evolves into a new species, the parent species is said to be extinct. The individuals all died, but their progeny live on.
By analogy, everything related to touring has evolved since the days of the "classic touring bike." Back in the late 70's, a lot of guys toured on racing bikes, and using the racks available at the time, and the panniers available at the time, they were having trouble with their heels hitting the panniers. So when Trek designed their ultimate touring frame, the 720, they made the chain stays really long so this wouldn't happen.
Now when I decided to go for a tour last summer, I hadn't ridden my 720 in quite a while; it wasn't even in rideable condition. Putting it back together I ran into various problems (see below) and, running out of time, I decided to do what I'd considered unthinkable back in 1983 when I bought the 720: I would tour on a racing bike
I set up this 1976 Holdsworth '531 Special' with the racks I used to have on my Trek, and new panniers...
and wouldn't you know it, I had no heel strike issues at all. Zero. It turns out you can avoid heel strike by redesigning panniers; long chain stays aren't necessary after all, or at least not for that reason.
I'm going to get my old 720 on the road again soon. It's at the powder coater now; I hope to have it back this week. But I realize it really is pretty obsolete. It wasn't made for cantilever brakes (or V-brakes, etc). It wasn't made for a low rider rack. It won't take a tire fatter than 35 mm. Even though it was made for Jim Blackburn touring racks, they never fit all that well anyway. I realize they fixed those problems in subsequent years, but even so, the model was soon discontinued. So, I will get my old bike rolling, and it will be fine, but it will always be a vintage bike with some limitations in comparison with a modern bike; I can live with that. If no one makes a frame like this any more... well, I can live with that, too.
By analogy, everything related to touring has evolved since the days of the "classic touring bike." Back in the late 70's, a lot of guys toured on racing bikes, and using the racks available at the time, and the panniers available at the time, they were having trouble with their heels hitting the panniers. So when Trek designed their ultimate touring frame, the 720, they made the chain stays really long so this wouldn't happen.
Now when I decided to go for a tour last summer, I hadn't ridden my 720 in quite a while; it wasn't even in rideable condition. Putting it back together I ran into various problems (see below) and, running out of time, I decided to do what I'd considered unthinkable back in 1983 when I bought the 720: I would tour on a racing bike
I set up this 1976 Holdsworth '531 Special' with the racks I used to have on my Trek, and new panniers...
and wouldn't you know it, I had no heel strike issues at all. Zero. It turns out you can avoid heel strike by redesigning panniers; long chain stays aren't necessary after all, or at least not for that reason.
I'm going to get my old 720 on the road again soon. It's at the powder coater now; I hope to have it back this week. But I realize it really is pretty obsolete. It wasn't made for cantilever brakes (or V-brakes, etc). It wasn't made for a low rider rack. It won't take a tire fatter than 35 mm. Even though it was made for Jim Blackburn touring racks, they never fit all that well anyway. I realize they fixed those problems in subsequent years, but even so, the model was soon discontinued. So, I will get my old bike rolling, and it will be fine, but it will always be a vintage bike with some limitations in comparison with a modern bike; I can live with that. If no one makes a frame like this any more... well, I can live with that, too.
I think the long chain stays are a plus on a touring bike as it lets you get the center of gravity over the rear hub but I agree longer racks and skinnier panniers can take care of the heel strike issue.
Biggest downside on the vintage 720s is that they won't take much fatter than a 35c tire. I used to think a 32c is all I'd ever want for touring but I'm not so sure anymore. I've been riding a trek XO-2 with 26 x 1.5 and I really like the plush ride for touring.
Love to see the pics of your 720 once you have it powder coated. I need to decide whether I'm going to repaint my bike or just sell it and buy a new "touring" bike (assuming that the parent species hasn't died off yet,
).
06-20-15, 05:14 PM
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One can "tour" on just about anything. I don't do a lot of multi-day tours, but I've done a couple. Always on an older steel frame road bike with narrow rims/tires.
I had considered for a few moments taking my Tricross.... but couldn't bring myself to riding 100+ mile days on heavy fat tires
The Tricross, however, may head out if I try some gravel touring.
I had considered for a few moments taking my Tricross.... but couldn't bring myself to riding 100+ mile days on heavy fat tires
The Tricross, however, may head out if I try some gravel touring.
06-21-15, 09:01 AM
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There is a lot more interest now in off road touring and touring where even 4X4 vehicles don't go than there used to be. I think some of that interest is because the equipment is available to do it now, such equipment was not sold until recently.
This summer I plan on a week of single track with my expedition bike. But I have three touring bikes that cover the range from light touring to heavier touring to off road in the middle of nowhere touring. I would not want to use my expedition bike on a lighter weight road tour.
One thing that concerns me is the lack of good touring components in the future. The increase in specialized components for smaller markets may make it a lot harder in the future to put together a really good touring machine.
https://www.adventurecycling.org/defa..._DAmbrosio.pdf
06-21-15, 09:10 AM
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One thing that concerns me is the lack of good touring components in the future. The increase in specialized components for smaller markets may make it a lot harder in the future to put together a really good touring machine.
https://www.adventurecycling.org/defa..._DAmbrosio.pdf
https://www.adventurecycling.org/defa..._DAmbrosio.pdf
One of the big differences between today and a few years back is the huge access of parts through the internet. Just about anything one's heart desires is available.... somewhere.
06-22-15, 07:31 PM
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DC area has a sizable touring contingent but most LBS have either no or perhaps 1 touring bike on display. REI has 2 or 3 I think. It is nice to have the internet to source obscure parts. I worry most about availability of suitable cranksets & derailleurs for touring. For instance many tourists use MTB cranksets & are satisfied with smallish big chainring...right now my touring bike has 46-tooth big ring--I'd prefer perhaps 50-tooth for descents. It's nice to have a high-enough gear to pedal at slowish cadence downhill, more stable than spinning.
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