So are the days of our lives...
08-10-16, 01:15 PM
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 944
Bikes: Scott Foil 10, Di2
Mentioned: 21 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 148 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time
in
1 Post
Oh and I'm not at all annoyed. I know my numbers 
And who cares about numbers per se...I care about winning 
And who cares about numbers per se...I care about winning
08-10-16, 02:11 PM
Senior Member
I recently moved the KK RR resistance unit to a CycleOps frame. It has much better tension on the tire, so much so that I had to loosen it after I maxed the tension as I had to do before.
Then I was a bit worried, probably like if I took a dope test or something. I know I've done what I think is right but what if I was wrong? What if suddenly I was too low or too high? What if the incorrect tension gave me power? (I don't care if I lose power but I care if I've been gaming the system inadvertently or not.)
So I started out, the bike seemed a bit quieter on the trainer, etc. Rolling along, similar Zwift power. Did a sprint, PR (10.x sec, previously 11.05s). That worried me. Then three riders blew my PR out of the water immediately after that. That felt better. Then finally (my SRM isn't reading power right now, nor cadence) I checked the SRM speed after downloading everything - the trainer is the constant and for max power my speed should be in the 37 mph range, at least right now (1100w, give or take). 37.x mph. So it was okay.
I still want to fix the SRM for next week's race, last one of the season for me. I'd like to get some good power readings; this week I had a decent sprint, finally felt like my legs could go a bit.
Related to that the Missus said that she thinks I need to go outside to work on sprints. It's just not the same indoors. I haven't done a rested sprint in a while, several years, so I'm curious what kind of numbers I can generate.
Then I was a bit worried, probably like if I took a dope test or something. I know I've done what I think is right but what if I was wrong? What if suddenly I was too low or too high? What if the incorrect tension gave me power? (I don't care if I lose power but I care if I've been gaming the system inadvertently or not.)
So I started out, the bike seemed a bit quieter on the trainer, etc. Rolling along, similar Zwift power. Did a sprint, PR (10.x sec, previously 11.05s). That worried me. Then three riders blew my PR out of the water immediately after that. That felt better. Then finally (my SRM isn't reading power right now, nor cadence) I checked the SRM speed after downloading everything - the trainer is the constant and for max power my speed should be in the 37 mph range, at least right now (1100w, give or take). 37.x mph. So it was okay.
I still want to fix the SRM for next week's race, last one of the season for me. I'd like to get some good power readings; this week I had a decent sprint, finally felt like my legs could go a bit.
Related to that the Missus said that she thinks I need to go outside to work on sprints. It's just not the same indoors. I haven't done a rested sprint in a while, several years, so I'm curious what kind of numbers I can generate.
__________________
"...during the Lance years, being fit became the No. 1 thing. Totally the only thing. It’s a big part of what we do, but fitness is not the only thing. There’s skills, there’s tactics … there’s all kinds of stuff..." Tim Johnson
"...during the Lance years, being fit became the No. 1 thing. Totally the only thing. It’s a big part of what we do, but fitness is not the only thing. There’s skills, there’s tactics … there’s all kinds of stuff..." Tim Johnson
08-10-16, 02:11 PM
**** that
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: CALI
Posts: 15,402
Mentioned: 151 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1099 Post(s)
Liked 104 Times
in
30 Posts
i'll take that bet!
WKO4 does not filter any data; neither did WKO3.
you should take that data an load it into several programs to confirm. now, depending on how data was recorded i've seen issues. for example, if you had 2 head units recording the same data stream, they record at 1Hz but many meters kick out data at a higher rate; depending on which samples the head unit grabs, you could get 2 different sets of raw data for the same ride. also, depending on how a file is downloaded/processed (raw file v garmin correct), some adjustments may be applied. i can't speak to all combinations -- raw files from the head unit should not have any of this done; i've never seen a case of it for power. (i have seen some HR filtering in the past, but those spikes are easier to detect.)
i haven't used the garmin 520 so can't comment, but i'd REALLY doubt it.
the repetition of missing data is something that happens due to the handling of the wireless signal -- it's how all ANT+ devices handle it. it's not limited to one manufacturer vs another. software/post-processing can correct this, but i know of only one piece of software that does so automatically; others allow manual correction, point by point.
you have to know what to look for, though, and most people are understandably unaware.
WKO4 does not filter any data; neither did WKO3.
you should take that data an load it into several programs to confirm. now, depending on how data was recorded i've seen issues. for example, if you had 2 head units recording the same data stream, they record at 1Hz but many meters kick out data at a higher rate; depending on which samples the head unit grabs, you could get 2 different sets of raw data for the same ride. also, depending on how a file is downloaded/processed (raw file v garmin correct), some adjustments may be applied. i can't speak to all combinations -- raw files from the head unit should not have any of this done; i've never seen a case of it for power. (i have seen some HR filtering in the past, but those spikes are easier to detect.)
i haven't used the garmin 520 so can't comment, but i'd REALLY doubt it.
the repetition of missing data is something that happens due to the handling of the wireless signal -- it's how all ANT+ devices handle it. it's not limited to one manufacturer vs another. software/post-processing can correct this, but i know of only one piece of software that does so automatically; others allow manual correction, point by point.
you have to know what to look for, though, and most people are understandably unaware.
08-10-16, 02:12 PM
**** that
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: CALI
Posts: 15,402
Mentioned: 151 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1099 Post(s)
Liked 104 Times
in
30 Posts
08-10-16, 02:14 PM
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 944
Bikes: Scott Foil 10, Di2
Mentioned: 21 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 148 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time
in
1 Post
08-10-16, 02:29 PM
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Redlands, CA
Posts: 6,313
Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 842 Post(s)
Liked 469 Times
in
250 Posts
annoyed? really?
it's the internet, land of inattention and random tangents. i don't know anything about c-belle other than she wins every race (
). her topic was a good segue to discuss something else.
conversations evolve. if no one's interested in #s branch, it'll die off ... and we can go back to the show or some other topic.
unless someone's here solely to seek approval (i doubt canuckbelle is here for that), i wouldn't think that a side discussion would be annoying. when you win like she does, do you need internet validation?
it's the internet, land of inattention and random tangents. i don't know anything about c-belle other than she wins every race (
). her topic was a good segue to discuss something else. conversations evolve. if no one's interested in #s branch, it'll die off ... and we can go back to the show or some other topic.
unless someone's here solely to seek approval (i doubt canuckbelle is here for that), i wouldn't think that a side discussion would be annoying. when you win like she does, do you need internet validation?
If I needed validation from the 33 I would have left this place a long time ago!
08-10-16, 02:37 PM
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,449
Mentioned: 64 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 693 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
WKO3 and WKO4 do not do any filtering.
OTOH, depending on how one gets a file off their device, that may change.
WKO4 in particular displays actual sensor data and will actually black out various metrics when there is bad data--meaning you won't get an FTP estimate from their model.
i have seen cases where imports into WKO3 via TP DA resulted in differences vs using the SRM tool to pull data off a PC7, but that's not WKO.
you certain you mean WKO3 is filtering data, or do you mean "your process at that time for getting data off your device (LYC or garmin?) and into WKO3"? how did you get the data into GC vs WKO3?
in general i would hope that software doesn't haphazardly apply filters; someone could have a 1900w peak power, but we want to know that it is accurate.
08-10-16, 02:54 PM
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 956
Bikes: Giant TCR, Giant Anthem, Felt CX
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 65 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
08-10-16, 02:58 PM
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 956
Bikes: Giant TCR, Giant Anthem, Felt CX
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 65 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Just started my 15th year of teaching (AZ schools go back early). It would have been my 20th year but I took a few years off when my kids were babies and last year was spent exploring other options because I was burned out. But here I am again: the in-school detention teacher. My room was so full on the first day that I had to find extra desks lol. I'm exhausted already this week but hoping I get used to the routine soon so I can continue to ride decently.
08-10-16, 03:17 PM
**** that
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: CALI
Posts: 15,402
Mentioned: 151 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1099 Post(s)
Liked 104 Times
in
30 Posts
not sure if you mean the training peaks device agent when you say WKO3.
WKO3 and WKO4 do not do any filtering.
OTOH, depending on how one gets a file off their device, that may change.
WKO4 in particular displays actual sensor data and will actually black out various metrics when there is bad data--meaning you won't get an FTP estimate from their model.
i have seen cases where imports into WKO3 via TP DA resulted in differences vs using the SRM tool to pull data off a PC7, but that's not WKO.
you certain you mean WKO3 is filtering data, or do you mean "your process at that time for getting data off your device (LYC or garmin?) and into WKO3"? how did you get the data into GC vs WKO3?
in general i would hope that software doesn't haphazardly apply filters; someone could have a 1900w peak power, but we want to know that it is accurate.
WKO3 and WKO4 do not do any filtering.
OTOH, depending on how one gets a file off their device, that may change.
WKO4 in particular displays actual sensor data and will actually black out various metrics when there is bad data--meaning you won't get an FTP estimate from their model.
i have seen cases where imports into WKO3 via TP DA resulted in differences vs using the SRM tool to pull data off a PC7, but that's not WKO.
you certain you mean WKO3 is filtering data, or do you mean "your process at that time for getting data off your device (LYC or garmin?) and into WKO3"? how did you get the data into GC vs WKO3?
in general i would hope that software doesn't haphazardly apply filters; someone could have a 1900w peak power, but we want to know that it is accurate.
Same process to copy the files, same files, but only Golden Cheeta showed me the bad data.
08-10-16, 03:18 PM
**** that
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: CALI
Posts: 15,402
Mentioned: 151 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1099 Post(s)
Liked 104 Times
in
30 Posts
That's cx, not road racing.
08-10-16, 03:28 PM
No matches
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Eastern PA
Posts: 11,647
Bikes: two wheeled ones
Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1398 Post(s)
Liked 444 Times
in
250 Posts
You wanna have fun, go ride your hybrid on the MUP. This is serious business.
08-10-16, 03:36 PM
Not actually Tmonk
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 14,120
Bikes: road, track, mtb
Mentioned: 140 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2632 Post(s)
Liked 3,145 Times
in
1,655 Posts
ya man i dont **** around
__________________
"Your beauty is an aeroplane;
so high, my heart cannot bear the strain." -A.C. Jobim, Triste
"Your beauty is an aeroplane;
so high, my heart cannot bear the strain." -A.C. Jobim, Triste
08-10-16, 04:24 PM
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 956
Bikes: Giant TCR, Giant Anthem, Felt CX
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 65 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
08-10-16, 04:25 PM
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 944
Bikes: Scott Foil 10, Di2
Mentioned: 21 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 148 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time
in
1 Post
SO MUCH FUN! ^_^
Right now I'm impatiently waiting for the results to hit USAC so I can put in for my Cat 1 upgrade
Right now I'm impatiently waiting for the results to hit USAC so I can put in for my Cat 1 upgrade
08-10-16, 06:15 PM
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 13,444
Mentioned: 33 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4232 Post(s)
Liked 2,947 Times
in
1,806 Posts
Had one of my scariest moments as a dad (at least that didn't involve not being able to find the kids or discovering that no one had remembered to fill the diaper pack at the worst possible time) just now. The youngest goes to sleep every night (and occasionally during the night if I can't get him back down any other way) with a glowing seahorse that plays light classical music and lullabies. It died in the middle of the first song and takes 3 AA batteries. I could only find 2 (and the ones in it didn't have enough juice to make a third). After scrambling throughout the house, I remembered the mouse has AA's and one of those did the trick. Whew, I might be able to get some sleep tonight. All parents of little kids know what I'm talking about - running out of batteries isn't a joke. Hope Fudgy hasn't had to learn that the hard way yet.
08-10-16, 07:22 PM
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Redwood City, CA
Posts: 10,978
Bikes: aggressive agreement is what I ride.
Mentioned: 109 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 967 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 4 Times
in
4 Posts
08-10-16, 07:53 PM
Killing Rabbits
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 5,697
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 278 Post(s)
Liked 217 Times
in
102 Posts
https://www.bicycling.com/culture/peo...-of-a-lifetime
Fasturdays
You're welcome.
08-10-16, 07:59 PM
Senior Member
I googled "what was the name of the book by the couple who traveled around and raced all the local crits?" for you.
Fasturdays: The Ultimate Cycling Road Trip | Bicycling
Fasturdays
You're welcome.
Fasturdays: The Ultimate Cycling Road Trip | Bicycling
Fasturdays
You're welcome.
08-10-16, 08:14 PM
ride lots be safe
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Texas
Posts: 5,224
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time
in
1 Post
I googled "what was the name of the book by the couple who traveled around and raced all the local crits?" for you.
Fasturdays: The Ultimate Cycling Road Trip | Bicycling
Fasturdays
You're welcome.
Fasturdays: The Ultimate Cycling Road Trip | Bicycling
Fasturdays
You're welcome.
by way of thanks:
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science...50413116303552
Last edited by Creakyknees; 08-10-16 at 08:45 PM.
08-10-16, 09:43 PM
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,449
Mentioned: 64 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 693 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
WKO+ doesn't accept FIT (and GPX--but correct me if i'm wrong) files dropped onto the program. the only 2 ways to get them in are (1) use TrainingPeaks DA or (2) import from trainingpeaks.com. either method parses the data before it gets to WKO+.
even further, you can drop a FIT (or GPX) file onto DA, or you can use DA to extract the file from your device.
WKO+ isn't manipulating the data, but the methods of import might.
i've actually seen differences in files whether DA pulled a file off an SRM or SRM's own tool was used before import into WKO+.
GC can directly handle FIT and GPX files (or, better said, their parser is inseparable from the program, at least the last i used GC).
in WKO4 there's no import tool required for FIT files, and i think the problems with import may have been one of the reasons for this call.
WKO+ doesn't manipulate the data, but like i said above the methods of import can and do. i'm still open to that bet.