jppe

Great two weeks of vacation doing the typical tourist stuff in Central to Northern Italy. I did not take a bike nor did I ride. In fact I have not been on a bike for over two weeks. Hope to go back with a group just to do some riding at some point.

We visited Rome, Florence, Siena, Chuisi, Montepulciano, Pienza, Pisa, Livorno, Milan, Como, Bellagio and Venice. I took about 1600 pictures but currently don't have a website I can throw them out on, currently I'm at a maximum for my free website. Any suggestions for free or cheap sites???

From what I observed.......very few if any bikes in the area of Rome we were in (Don-we were all around Borghese Park but times just didn't allow for it). Bikes were the mode of choice in Florence. In fact it was easy to get run over by a cyclist in Florence there were so many.....I saw several groups of roadies south of Florence on some great rural curvy roads. There were some terrific roads where I'd love to ride around Siena. Lots of curvy hilly roads. There was one road from the west coast (Livorno/Cecina area) to Siena that went through Volterra that would have been terrific.

Another place I saw a group of roadies was north of Milan around Como. I'd love to do the road around Lake Como........but it is very narrow and curvy but worth doing on a bike. Part of it goes from Como to Bellagio and is about 50 km. Bellagio might just be one of the most scenic spots I've ever been. It is on a point on Lake Como and has the Dolomites across the lake with many of the peaks covered in snow.

If the tower wasn't leaning in Pisa I'm not sure that area would survive. Not a really small town but just didn't seem to have anything going for it other than the tourist attraction. However the Basicila and Battiste there next to the tower were beautiful and were a pleasant surprise.

I wish we hadn't spent much time in Milan......felt more like NYC than Italy. But since it was the fashion capital of the world we were able to pick up some things for my daughter in the fashion industry. The mode of transportation of choice in Milan is scooters with "super chargers"...........I had the privilege of driving a car in and around Milan for a few days and scooters broke every safe driving rule in the book. You really had to be careful not to run over someone on a scooter as they darted around you between lanes and came from every direction. Also, it didn't help that all the traffic signs were in Italian.......and there weren't any street signs except on the sides of the buildings on the street corners. Needed binoculars........

Venice was a welcome sight after Milan.....what a unique place. all the transportation there was either on foot or by something on the water. The water taxis were on strike while we were there. We were welcomed to Venice by a full moon.

The biggest disappointment was not getting a case of wine on the plane with us back to the States. We had bought a special box for shipping wine while there and picked up bottles in the various towns we visited. Inexpensive but some great wines. It was very well packed and taped. When we got to the airport the airlines agent said it was "cargo" and wouldn't let us check it as a second bag..........the folks were with got a different agent and they let them check theirs.........go figure.

With the current exchange rate it was not a cheap trip. I took what I thought was enough Euros and had to get more US currency converted in the first week. However the wine was inexpensive. We'd go into a super market and but some really, really good wine for 3-4 Euros. Loved the food as well. Their pastas and sauces are super fresh and seem lighter than what we typically experience in the US. Our worst meal was mid ways of our trip. We were driving from Siena to Milan on their auto strada. We stopped at a Mega sized rest area that had a Burger King in it. Got a cheeseburger and fries.....amazing we in US eat that stuff and live to tell about it!!!

I did pick up a few pounds but gratefully not a many as I feared. We did tons of walking so hopefully that helped. My body is still on Italian time trying to get back readjusted to the 6 hours time difference. The older I get the longer it seems to take to get things back to normal.......

Looking forward to getting back on the bike.......hopefully I can remember how to ride 20-30 miles and build up to the longer rides.

Yankeetowner

Sounds like a great trip. From my experience, I don't think it is very safe to bike in most of the larger Italian cities, particularly Rome, Milan, and Florence. It's not even safe to walk on the sidewalk in Naples.

VNA

That is funny that you mentioned your trip to Italy, I was there a week ago and was not impressed:

I think Italy is held together by graffiti particularly around big cities like Milano and surprisingly Venice, although my wife and I stopped in Mantua or Mantova (50 miles before Venice) which was a gorgeous and charming small "medieval" town with no graffiti, the town was full of bicycles but mostly as transportation and everyone from the little old ladies doing their shopping to the young athletes.

We drove from Northern France (Normandie) to Venice with incredible sceneries until a little before Milano and then it was incredibly industrial with roads and freeways choked with an incredible amount of trucks all the way to Venice--never saw so many!

Venice was absolutely beautiful, and aside from graffiti everywhere it was choked (again) not with trucks but with way too many tourists. I think the ratio of habitants to tourists must be at the very least 1 to 5 tourists. It is a "must see."

The town of Como was also very nice and was somewhat similar to Mantova, quaint and simply beautiful! But so overbuilt around the lakes!

We went back to Paris through Switzerland which is unfortunately also so overbuilt in the Alps.

I have to add that I am spoiled with the wide and wild american West! Also I cannot comment on France because I am from there!

Prior to these 3 countries we visited Ireland for a week and it is absolutely gorgeous with incredibly friendly people and on that subject of friendly people we had no "problems" until we got to Italy with some rather rude individuals! I thought Italians were "happy" and "sunny"!

At last if you drive in Ireland (on the left) wait a couple of days because of jet lag, driving on the left is not so hard but it takes some concentration but with the time difference it makes things challenging!

Next year we go spend two weeks at one location in the SouthWest of France (Dordogne) most likely and I will have my bike!

Happy travel.

VNA

A lot of bicycles in Paris and major cities in France and you can rent them: Velib!

https://en.velib.paris.fr/How-it-works

The same system is here in San Francisco!

1nterceptor

Sounds like a nice trip. If you're not currently using Flikr.com for photo hosting,
I suggest to try them. I've been to Rome 3 times now; each time I spend a few
days. Every time I visit; I find new places to see. There's just so much historical
and beautiful sites there. Venice the last time I visited a few years ago; in addition
to the water taxis - also have public boats that serve as subway/metro equivalent.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3kIsFD0an0

Dfrost 

The small roads in Tuscany, Umbria, and particularly Marche are fabulous bike riding. At least they were when we did a three week self-guided credit-card tour there in 2001. The cities were never great, but the towns, villages and local people we met along the way were fabulous. Getting away from the usual tourist places really helped. We had a very memorable several hours walking around a cemetery in Umbria, and ended up staying in Spello, a small town just south of Assisi, when a map error led us there. Wish we'd spent more time in and around there since we'd stumbled into a lovely apartment that was literally part of the wall around Spello.

I don't remember any graffiti, except perhaps the signs that were hand-written expressing care and concern for Americans (this was immediately after the 911 attacks).

One thing we've learned in our travels - we interact more with locals as just a couple on bikes then we ever have with larger groups, even when it was just a second couple.

Biker395 

We were in Italy about two years ago. Our daughter was studying in Torino, so we went up at Christmas to go pick her up and bring her home. Along the way, we took the opportunity to visit Rome, Florence, Venice, and Torino.

It was not at all what I expected. I expected the Italians to be be like the ones I knew at home (I'm 1/2 Sicilian) ... moderately plump and babushkaed. Something like this ... only younger:



Boy, was I wrong on that one. The Italians we met were uniformly thin, attractive, and impeccably dressed. We were there in the winter and I think the uniform is: Black pants, black boots, black winter coat, with a scarf for a splash of color Boy, did I look out of place. Not nearly attractive enough to fit in, and I was wearing jeans and a Showers Pass jacket. Talk about Jed Clampitt.

But there was the dark side ... they smoked like fiends. VERY different than SoCal.

The food was great. I fell in love with Italian pizza. Such a delicate crust. OMG, I still miss it.

And I fell in love with Florence. Rome is more cosmopolitan, Venice more quaint, Torino more industrial. But ah, Florence. Something about setting foot in the hotspot of the Renaissance. Like being in the presence of genius.

The transportation we saw was a mix of autos, scooters, and bikes. About equal thirds in Florence and Rome, and a heavier proportion of autos in Torino. Venice was all by watercraft, of course. And it appeared that the major factor in the choice of transportation had nothing to do with the cost of fuel ... it was the availability of parking. Check out this little dude ... smallest auto I've ever seen.



Glad you had fun. I would LOVE to go back and do some riding in Tuscany.

jppe

Your observations are spot on. We noticed how fit the folks seem to be.............but there were a lot more smokers than what we now see in the US. The food just seemed to be lighter and much, much fresher. We met some great people along the way as well. One was Daniella who didn't speak a lick of English but we hit it off and cut up with her just the same. We also were surprised at how folks seem to wear a lot warmer clothing than what we were wearing. I was in blue jeans and a short sleeve golf shirt and the Italians were bundled up in leather jackets and scarves.

volosong

Ah...Italy. "Disneyland for Adults".

VNA

No it is Las Vegas!

billydonn

+1 although I think Italy is much better and more real than Disneyland.

Dfrost has it right .... Umbria in the Spoletto, Spello, Montefalco area is just fabulous... Rideable and affordable. Aside from Venice, the big cities aren't as attractive to me. Jppe, I'm glad you got to Borghese Park, but you did not follow instructions and go to Spoleto. (Wags finger).

billydonn

LOL. Venice is tourism, like Colorado is mountains. Just the way it is. Few Italians actually live there due to gentrification. Still an amazing and beautiful place when you get away from St Marks a block or two.

late

https://www.ciclismoclassico.com/trip...-across-italy/

VNA

As I understand about sixty thousand or so live in Venice and at least one famous american: Dona Leon who writes mysteries called "Comissario Brunetti" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donna_Leon

It was on PBS earlier this year, it was a german production with english subtitles: germans pretending to be italians written by an american! That is international--and of course superb images/views of the city. One can rent episodes on Amazon or other outlets

There were very significant musicians who are from there: Vivaldi and Albinoni and Mozart librettist by the name of Lorenzo Da Ponte. By the way went to a great concert of Baroque music in one of the numerous churches and certainly was the highlight of my Venice stay!

I have to add that this Lorenzo Da Ponte ended up in New York City so far from his "jewish ghetto" in Venice that sill exist and worth visiting. He started the Italian Department at Columbia University after a very tumultuous and extremely rich life, he actually deserves a book and a movie!

Sorry to bore some of you!

But you now know that there is a Venetian influence in New York city!

billydonn

Just to explain my point: Venice is cited by current tourism scholars as a prime example of a place where tourism has harmed the local culture. The 60,000 inhabitants are no longer mostly Italians, but wealthy foreigners. The cost of real estate there has largely driven the native residents out.... To live on the dry side. The majority of people who serve you in Venice are not Italians but young people from elsewhere in Europe that work for fairly low wages and commute from the dry side, where they can afford to live.

It is still a very cool place to visit IMO.

lhbernhardt

How can anyone spend two weeks in Italy without a bike? The Italian countryside is just great for riding. Although the roads are narrow and pot-holed (except for the roads that will be used in the Giro d'Italia, which get improved quickly!), the drivers give you room and are pretty courteous. We were in the Abruzzo region last May, doing self-guided rides with Valle Tours (google it, highly recommended, very reasonable) out of a tiny village near Teramo. On the map, we were about level with Rome, but on the eastern side of the Appenini, so we could do long climbing rides in some pretty good hills, or relatively flat rides out to the Adriatic coast. On one of the days, I rode thru the coastal hills to Pescara to see a Giro stage finish. Of course, when in Abruzzo, you drink lots of Montepulciano and you eat very well!

We were also in Rome to see an opera, but we just did this as a day trip, taking a bus early in the morning and returning by bus late at night, so it wasn't practical to take our bikes with us. However, while we were wandering around in Rome, we were passed at several locations by a big mass bike ride threading its way thru the city. Rome didn't appear to be any more difficult to ride in than any other large city, although it doesn't appear to have the facilities of Paris, or NY City. It seemed to be pretty drab, though, but then we were only there for the day.

There are so many great places to ride in Italy; we've only scratched the surface.

Luis

Dan Burkhart 

Yes. My wife and I were in Venice for a week in May of 2005. We stayed in a hotel well out of the tourist trap zone, and spent every day exploring the city and making wonderful discoveries.
They say Venice is a city of hidden treasures, and we found that to be very true. There are green spaces, but you won't find them unless you poke your nose in a few doors and go through.
We enjoyed the back alleys more than the famed attractions, but we had to see them too.
well worth the time to go to Murano, Burano, and the Lido too.
The biggest disappointment was the grub, except for the day tour we took through several northern Italian towns. Had some incredible food on that trip.

Darth Lefty 

We spent five days in Rome on our honeymoon last month. I loved the history and the art but the restaurants were all the same and you had to make an active effort to keep away from the multitude of (Indian? Pakistani?) street vendors selling wilted roses and plastic toys and pre-rusted umbrellas.

I didn't see bicycles in the same numbers as Paris or Barcelona but they were around. The drivers weren't as accommodating, there was no enforcement of or respect for traffic rules, and there wasn't much bike infrastructure. I might have imagined it, but it seemed like most of the cyclists were young women.

And as I mentioned before, the bike share is a cruel hoax:

Miami Biker

Sounds like great trip in Italy. We spent 32 days in France and mostly italy this May/June. Operas in Paris and Milan and opera rehearsal in Florence. No bike riding though. Took about 1,400 images and kept about half..so far. Went to so many places tough to cut down too much.

we love italy! People lovely and they really know how to eat great food with proper proportions. My wife speaks only Italian from opera but a smile and pointing helped in the more remote areas! No problem in bigger cities (Paris, Rome, Florence, Milan).

After much research selected Zenfolio for pics. There is a charge and paid more for the first year as no limit in number of MBs used so loading last 30+ years of images. Highly recommended and they have an app so you can access all images easily in your iPad.

Having been gone for so long, it took a month to get to 40 mile rides, another month to 50 and then after 2.5 months broke 60 for first time!

Ed

Zinger

Never been to Europe and I highly doubt this is a cheap tour but Andy Hampsten has a company that does cycling tours in Italy. I only know about it through listening to podcast interviews with him and don't know a thing about it.

https://www.cinghiale.com/

billydonn

Drive over Passo Gavia and Bormio Area Northern Italy:

https://s1119.photobucket.com/user/bi...-SantaCatarina

Passo Gavia Bike Ride , Lower Section from Santa Catarina:

https://s1119.photobucket.com/user/bi...3/Gavia%20Ride

Venice:

https://s1119.photobucket.com/user/bi.../Venice%202013

Spoleto, Umbria, Central Italy:

https://s1119.photobucket.com/user/bi...202013/Spoleto

Rimini, Adriatic Coast:

https://s1119.photobucket.com/user/bi...w/Italy%202013

Zinger

^^^^^^

Wow Billy Donn !

Gavia Pass is just an amazingly beautiful pristine place. Just a great set of photos and I'll hafta come back and see the rest. Thanks for posting.

hockey

Just got back from an organized bike/barge tour, Venice to Mantova. Enjoyed a few days in Venice and then a wonderful tour along the Po river through many small towns. Easy cycling for couples of diverse abilities, great food and company. Highly recommended.

jppe

Don-I saw my hotel room in slide 14 in your Venice pics. We were in the Hotel Principe....hotel before Continental walking from the train station. We were on the second floor corner room next to the Continental.

Funny......we had prearranged transportation throughout the trip. Our travel agent arranged a water taxi from the Train Station to our hotel in Venice. Our hotel was like 3 buildings down from where we got on the water taxi........took longer to load and unload luggage on the water taxi than just walk down 3 doors to the hotel. It was really nice having a private taxi back to the airport as the taxi's were on strike.

Pobble.808

Yet another just-back-from-Italy report:

We were in three cities in the northeast, Venice, Bologna, and Trieste. Venice obvously not a bike town, but we did have the distinct pleasure of at least seeing a bike parked near the cruise ship terminal. Nowhere that you could ride it to from there, except for the nearby parking garage at the end of the causeway from the mainland. Maybe it is used by the terminal staff for short trips within the terminal area.

Bologna looked like a big bike town, but not in the famous Italian road bike culture sense. Rather, lots of people going about their daily business on city bikes, most of them (the bikes that is) looking well aged and well used. The riders were wearing regular clothes, as one sees in other European cities, but it was interesting to notice that a substantial minority of them had helmets, something I had not seen in Europe before.

Fewer cyclists in Trieste, which was a little surprising since it has long, broad streets and not a lot of cobblestones. On the other hand it does have a lot of steep climbs, unlike Bologna. Come to think of it, a medieval/renaissance city like Bologna (the old central district anyway) may be more conducive to cycling since the narrow, short, crooked streets and lack of parking spaces keep the volume of car traffic down. We did see a bunch of roadies on the roads just outside Trieste, though.

Parenthetical observation: In most or all of the airports we were in (Frankfurt, Venice, Trieste, Munich), we saw bikes parked inside the terminal buildings, used by the staff to get around. Can't recall ever having seen this in the US...