A new addition to the stable. Heavy pipe tubed Montgomery Ward
01-22-17, 10:16 AM
#26
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 203
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 23 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
-----
The OEM chainset is not cottered but rather Thun pattern. This arrangement does not employ the shell's threads. What appears to be a cotter on left side crank arm is actually a pinch bolt. Loosen the nut and arm will slide off the spindle's splines. You can then unthread left side bearings and right hand arm with chainwheels will come right out. Spindle is permanently affixed to rh crank arm.
Since the shell's threads were not employed by the chainset you may discover that they need to be chased/cleaned to get BSC dimension fittings to thread in.
-----
The OEM chainset is not cottered but rather Thun pattern. This arrangement does not employ the shell's threads. What appears to be a cotter on left side crank arm is actually a pinch bolt. Loosen the nut and arm will slide off the spindle's splines. You can then unthread left side bearings and right hand arm with chainwheels will come right out. Spindle is permanently affixed to rh crank arm.
Since the shell's threads were not employed by the chainset you may discover that they need to be chased/cleaned to get BSC dimension fittings to thread in.
-----
01-22-17, 10:52 AM
#27
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Alta California
Posts: 14,271
Mentioned: 415 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3814 Post(s)
Liked 3,345 Times
in
2,182 Posts
-----
"...jammed or something..."
Can you be more specific regarding what you encountered upon attempting disassembly?
-----
"...jammed or something..."
Can you be more specific regarding what you encountered upon attempting disassembly?
-----
01-22-17, 01:11 PM
#29
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Alta California
Posts: 14,271
Mentioned: 415 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3814 Post(s)
Liked 3,345 Times
in
2,182 Posts
-----
The type of bottom bracket assembly/crankset found on this Wards Styria product bicycle is termed variously "Thun pattern", Thompson and Thompson-Simplex (no relation to Juy).
Here is a photo of a fully cottered version so you can see the bearing arrangement. Bike under discussion has spindle permanently affixed to the right hand crank arm.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...sonlager-1.jpg
Next, a stop by step servicing video.
-----
The type of bottom bracket assembly/crankset found on this Wards Styria product bicycle is termed variously "Thun pattern", Thompson and Thompson-Simplex (no relation to Juy).
Here is a photo of a fully cottered version so you can see the bearing arrangement. Bike under discussion has spindle permanently affixed to the right hand crank arm.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...sonlager-1.jpg
Next, a stop by step servicing video.
-----
01-22-17, 09:19 PM
#30
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Richmond VA area
Posts: 2,618
Bikes: '00 Koga Miyata Full Pro Oval Road bike.
Mentioned: 17 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 475 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 8 Times
in
7 Posts
Although this isnt a project I would start, it does look like it should provide a fun old bike to cruise around on - kind of a vintage vibe. As others have said though, watch how much money you put into it. Once you get a LBS involved expenses can multiply quickly.
01-23-17, 10:30 AM
#31
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 203
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 23 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Sound advice. I'm fortunate to have a LBS that'll quickly assess things and let me know if it's safe for around 20 bucks. Also fortunate to have a bike builder that will do braze-ons and frame settings, etc etc for under 50.00.
01-23-17, 10:44 AM
#32
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 203
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 23 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
-----
The type of bottom bracket assembly/crankset found on this Wards Styria product bicycle is termed variously "Thun pattern", Thompson and Thompson-Simplex (no relation to Juy).
Here is a photo of a fully cottered version so you can see the bearing arrangement. Bike under discussion has spindle permanently affixed to the right hand crank arm.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...sonlager-1.jpg
Next, a stop by step servicing video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U3NFZ_zD5as
-----
The type of bottom bracket assembly/crankset found on this Wards Styria product bicycle is termed variously "Thun pattern", Thompson and Thompson-Simplex (no relation to Juy).
Here is a photo of a fully cottered version so you can see the bearing arrangement. Bike under discussion has spindle permanently affixed to the right hand crank arm.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...sonlager-1.jpg
Next, a stop by step servicing video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U3NFZ_zD5as
-----
.
01-23-17, 11:04 AM
#33
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 203
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 23 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
I gave the pin few good whacks and it's not budging. Apartment life so project is back on hold. I see a couple people have converted it to fixed with 700c's so that may be the route I take. I have a single speed 44T cottered crank and bb laying around.
02-17-17, 02:13 PM
#34
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 203
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 23 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
I'm at a loss. It won't take 700c wheels without modding because of a tab on the rear stay. The brakes aren't good enough to reuse and replacement 26x1 3/8 wheels only seem to be made of steel. I may end up scrapping this bike but I don't want to. I'm willing to turn into any kind of bike so long as it isn't insanely expensive. Also found out the inside had sitting water in it, guess the storage room it was in had a really bad leak.
02-17-17, 03:06 PM
#35
Senior Member
My advice would be to start with a better, more standard bike. Sell this one for $25 and buy yourself an ice cream.
02-17-17, 04:37 PM
#36
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Alta California
Posts: 14,271
Mentioned: 415 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3814 Post(s)
Liked 3,345 Times
in
2,182 Posts
-----
02-17-17, 04:57 PM
#37
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Oakland, CA
Posts: 3,265
Bikes: '82 Univega Competizione, '72 Motobecane Grand Record, '83 Mercian KOM Touring, '85 Univega Alpina Uno, '76 Eisentraut Limited
Mentioned: 57 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1088 Post(s)
Liked 1,205 Times
in
701 Posts
If this bike had sentimental value, I would say forge ahead, but in this case, why beat your head against the wall? Scrap exists to put this back into the cycle of raw material, so maybe it will reincarnate as something more useful...
02-26-17, 07:21 PM
#38
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 203
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 23 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
So I found a Square Taper Thomson bottom bracket and a good deal on alloy 26x1 3/8 wheels. Are the axles on some of these vintage bikes a different size than the ones used now?. When I tried to mock up the 700c wheels they wouldn't slide into the fork. They were nowhere near fitting in the rear. Ben Cole at velomine asked me this as well. I never considered it lol.
02-27-17, 07:45 AM
#39
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Alta California
Posts: 14,271
Mentioned: 415 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3814 Post(s)
Liked 3,345 Times
in
2,182 Posts
------
Unclear if you question regards axle diameter or hub width.
If hub width -
You do not state the over the locknuts dimensions of the new wheels, nor the originals. Would have expected the OEM wheels to be 100mm front and 120mm rear. But since they are 26 X 1 3/8" wheels the front may be somewhat narrower than 100mm. Styria may have employed an Union front hub for the bicycle.
-----
Unclear if you question regards axle diameter or hub width.
If hub width -
You do not state the over the locknuts dimensions of the new wheels, nor the originals. Would have expected the OEM wheels to be 100mm front and 120mm rear. But since they are 26 X 1 3/8" wheels the front may be somewhat narrower than 100mm. Styria may have employed an Union front hub for the bicycle.
-----
Last edited by juvela; 02-27-17 at 07:47 AM. Reason: addition
02-27-17, 01:31 PM
#40
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 203
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 23 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
------
Unclear if you question regards axle diameter or hub width.
If hub width -
You do not state the over the locknuts dimensions of the new wheels, nor the originals. Would have expected the OEM wheels to be 100mm front and 120mm rear. But since they are 26 X 1 3/8" wheels the front may be somewhat narrower than 100mm. Styria may have employed an Union front hub for the bicycle.
-----
Unclear if you question regards axle diameter or hub width.
If hub width -
You do not state the over the locknuts dimensions of the new wheels, nor the originals. Would have expected the OEM wheels to be 100mm front and 120mm rear. But since they are 26 X 1 3/8" wheels the front may be somewhat narrower than 100mm. Styria may have employed an Union front hub for the bicycle.
-----
02-27-17, 02:00 PM
#41
Senior Member
I have an old ccm that i converted to 700c fixed gear and i have to deflate the tire to get the wheel into the rear drop outs but then it clears no problem. I'm not sure if you have the same problem or not but i saw this and thought i would mention it
02-27-17, 03:13 PM
#42
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Alta California
Posts: 14,271
Mentioned: 415 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3814 Post(s)
Liked 3,345 Times
in
2,182 Posts
Do not hesitate to open the slots to accommodate the new hub axles.
I keep a round bastard file to hand in the workshop for doing this procedure.
A faster way is to employ a die grinder, should you have one available.
Typically, hollow axles will be larger in diameter than solid ones.
-----
02-28-17, 05:18 PM
#43
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 203
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 23 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Thanks for the clarification.
Do not hesitate to open the slots to accommodate the new hub axles.
I keep a round bastard file to hand in the workshop for doing this procedure.
A faster way is to employ a die grinder, should you have one available.
Typically, hollow axles will be larger in diameter than solid ones.
-----
Do not hesitate to open the slots to accommodate the new hub axles.
I keep a round bastard file to hand in the workshop for doing this procedure.
A faster way is to employ a die grinder, should you have one available.
Typically, hollow axles will be larger in diameter than solid ones.
-----
02-28-17, 05:28 PM
#44
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Alta California
Posts: 14,271
Mentioned: 415 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3814 Post(s)
Liked 3,345 Times
in
2,182 Posts
-----
You'll have to erect some new imagery when completed.
-----
You'll have to erect some new imagery when completed.
-----
02-28-17, 06:35 PM
#45
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 203
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 23 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Cool. How do you like it as a fixed?. I'm debating between a multi-speed or fixed.
03-01-17, 09:27 AM
#46
feros ferio
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: www.ci.encinitas.ca.us
Posts: 21,799
Bikes: 1959 Capo Modell Campagnolo; 1960 Capo Sieger (2); 1962 Carlton Franco Suisse; 1970 Peugeot UO-8; 1982 Bianchi Campione d'Italia; 1988 Schwinn Project KOM-10;
Mentioned: 44 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1393 Post(s)
Liked 1,329 Times
in
837 Posts
That reminds me a lot of my old yellow Sears Free Spirit, a $10 yard sale treasure(?). I converted mine to downtube shifters with open cables and a 16-17-18-19-21 corncob to go with the 52-39 up front. I intended it as a theft-resistant bike to keep at work for lunchtime errands, but it got stolen(!) from the bike racks at the rear/guard entrance of our building.
__________________
"Far and away the best prize that life offers is the chance to work hard at work worth doing." --Theodore Roosevelt
Capo: 1959 Modell Campagnolo, S/N 40324; 1960 Sieger (2), S/N 42624, 42597
Carlton: 1962 Franco Suisse, S/N K7911
Peugeot: 1970 UO-8, S/N 0010468
Bianchi: 1982 Campione d'Italia, S/N 1.M9914
Schwinn: 1988 Project KOM-10, S/N F804069
"Far and away the best prize that life offers is the chance to work hard at work worth doing." --Theodore Roosevelt
Capo: 1959 Modell Campagnolo, S/N 40324; 1960 Sieger (2), S/N 42624, 42597
Carlton: 1962 Franco Suisse, S/N K7911
Peugeot: 1970 UO-8, S/N 0010468
Bianchi: 1982 Campione d'Italia, S/N 1.M9914
Schwinn: 1988 Project KOM-10, S/N F804069
03-01-17, 03:46 PM
#47
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 203
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 23 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
That reminds me a lot of my old yellow Sears Free Spirit, a $10 yard sale treasure(?). I converted mine to downtube shifters with open cables and a 16-17-18-19-21 corncob to go with the 52-39 up front. I intended it as a theft-resistant bike to keep at work for lunchtime errands, but it got stolen(!) from the bike racks at the rear/guard entrance of our building.
If anyone has pics of similar projects they want to post I don't mind if you post them here. I favor older bikes in general and am happy to get my hands on the 26x1 3/8 size just to understand them better. I could use the inspiration
03-01-17, 03:47 PM
#48
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 203
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 23 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
03-04-17, 04:42 PM
#49
Senior Member
It's ok, the frame is heavy and hard to get up the hills sometimes but otherwise it's super smooth and fun for running errands and even on some longer rides too. It used to be a 3-speed with a Sturmey Archer so the chainline was already pretty good without having to make any adjustments.
03-06-17, 05:18 PM
#50
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 203
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 23 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
It's ok, the frame is heavy and hard to get up the hills sometimes but otherwise it's super smooth and fun for running errands and even on some longer rides too. It used to be a 3-speed with a Sturmey Archer so the chainline was already pretty good without having to make any adjustments.