Scarbo

So, this weekend I was finally able to talk my father into handing over his 1972 Raleigh Supercourse, which is still in really fine condition (all original parts as far as I can see); and am now thinking of possible changes that I'd like to make.

Since almost everything on the bike is still in good shape, I plan to ride it as is and I'm not going to do anything immediately; but the first change I'm contemplating regards the drivetrain of this venerable bike. It still has the standard 52-40 Stronglight chainrings wedded to a 14-28 cassette in the back. This yields, effectively, between 41 and 101 gear inches (27 x 1 1/4" tires). Since I now live in a very mountainous region, I would love to take advantage of some lower gearing so I'm thinking of mating a 46/30 Crankset to, perhaps, a Shimano XT rear derailleur (11-36), which would give me something like 23 to 114 gear inches.

What do y'all think about this? Are there any considerations I should be aware of in making a change like this? I have no idea (yet) what kind of thread count exists in the bottom bracket--I've read elsewhere that it could be non-standard so I have no idea what headaches I'm in for!

Thank you, as usual.

Salamandrine 

IMHO, ride it as is for a few rides before making any big plans for changes. Put some new modern tires on there before doing anything else. New clinchers (assuming that's what is on there) are vastly superior to old ones. You may find that it's lighter than what you are used to and doesn't require lower gearing. To me, a ~40" gear is as low as you could possibly need in CA unless doing loaded touring. It's rare for roads to be steeper than 8 to 10%.

If you do decide you want to change gearing, I suggest going to a long arm rear derailleur and a bigger cluster only. It's quick easy and reversible. Swapping BB and cranks is a pain even for pro mechanics.

Personally I would suggest a vintage Suntour derailleur rather than a Shimano XT. Because it will work fine, and won't be ugly as hell. (my personal opinion)

Anyhow, if after trying these things first you would like lower gearing because of your terrain etc, yeah a 46/30 like those VO ones or whatever would look nice and give you the mountain gears. You'd need a new BB and crank, which might cost more than the bike is worth.

CliffordK

I would think that by 1972, the threads would be pretty much standard "English" on the Raleigh. See if you can see something stamped on the BB.

That is mighty low gearing. But you also need to make the bike usable to your riding style.

What BCD does your crankset have?
I'm seeing 122 BCD, 37T.
122 BCD Conventional Chainring, 37 Teeth

I'm seeing a few misc rings here.
Hilary Stone Chainrings 122mm BCD

If your bike is fairly original, then I doubt it has a cassette. You probably have a 5 or 6 speed freewheel.

It starts to get a pretty tight squeeze to get much more than 7 speeds into 120 or 126mm rear dropout spacing. Measure what spacing you have.

New wheels?

I'm seeing the Shimano MegaRange 14-34 (7spd) freewheel with a pretty HUGE jump at the end.

DNP Epoch will also have some 7spd, 11T freewheels. 11-32?

Salamandrine 

Yeah, if it's a 122BCD crank as in a Stronglight 93 (etc), it is already almost compact double. Swapping in a smaller chainring would be much easier. Didn't these come with a cottered steel crank though? At least in 1972.

repechage

To me it is a test, don't guess on the threading of the bottom bracket for this one.
Might be 26threads per inch, Raleigh specific or 24 tpi
Simplex shift levers... The whole Simplex drivetrain, I would change.
Suntour would be good.
A bike Co-op could really assist in getting the answers fast and for reasonable cost.
Crankset... Depends on your budget. Aesthetic tolerance and desire.

gugie 

+1 on new tires, then ride the thing. Us old farts need that lower gearing, you might get by as is.

One more thing: Pix or it didn't happen!

CliffordK

Oh, that

Sheldon brown's website talks about cottered cranks and the 26tpi Raleigh threading.

Threading/interchangeability Issues for Older Raleigh Bicycles
Sheldon Brown's Bicycle Bicycle Bottom Bracket Crib Sheet

What is indicated is that a 68mm shell width is probably standard British ISO (24 TPI), and 71mm or wider is probably Raleigh 24 TPI.

CliffordK

Really?

I grew up in an era that anything with lower gearing than say 42x23 was considered department store junk.

I've played around a bit recently, but I just don't use the really low gears unless I'm hauling cargo.

gugie 

Man oh man, next time I recruit a fire road ride to Tillamook, you're in, but you hafta use a fixie.

Lascauxcaveman 

My '72 Super Course turned out to be standard English threading on the bottom bracket, not some proprietary Raleigh size, so you may be OK on just swapping in a generic bottom bracket like I did after managing to get off the old cotters n' stuff steel crank set (mine was a Nervar).

If you want to try the compact double crankset (one with a 110bcd would be a good choice), you don't have to change anything else on the bike to get some pretty darn low gearing, except maybe take a link pair out of the chain. Whole new chain might be a good idea, depending.

As always, pix would be helpful to determine what you're starting with.

CliffordK

Oh...
I was going to make a s3x fixie.

Is that gravel? I may have to adjust the gearing slightly for gravel. I've discovered that weight distribution and even strokes help.

There is a pretty wicked hill climb ride up in Portland in the spring. I might be up there again next spring Hopefully the weather will be nicer next year. I will admit, however, that I've been contemplating a gearing change, mainly for about a 3 block section of the ride, but who knows.

Michael Angelo 

Super Course's are nice. This is one I built up and gave to my Kid brother.

Scarbo

Wow--I've already got a ton of responses. Thank you all so much. I can see that I have some studying to do before I make any changes of consequence on this bike. It might make more sense to change out a Chainring before doing anything more drastic. Right now I'm beginning to break the bike down and clean parts and when I have it put together again I will take some pics and post them. Also, I have to buy a new leather saddle (the Brooks that is on there now is really old and cracked). I've always loved the old-style lugs on this bike's frame!

OK. I can see that the rear derailleur must not be the original, Simplex because it is a Suntour derailleur. Apart from this the rest is original--even the cable housings, it looks like. I don't think my dad did very much with this bike except he might have changed out the rear derailleur at some point--I'll have to ask him.

Low gearing is kind of important where I live. In the Sierras, proper, as well as in the Sierra foothills there are tons of climbs between 15-20 percent and more that go for miles! Maybe I'm getting lazy (I just got married not too long ago so that might be it!)?

--CliffordK: Thanks so much for the links! And, if anybody can point me in the direction of co-ops and websites where I can source vintage parts I would appreciate it immensely! Thanks again.

T-Mar

The Super Course of this era were typically built by Carlton and if so, used English threading. Mine did, I believe I see a Carlton decal on the fork blade.

If this were bicycle, the first upgrade I be looking at would be a Hyperglide compatible freewheel and chain, as the shifting is so much better under load and it's relatively cheap. Unfortunately, Hyperglide compatible freewheels have a relatively limited ratio selection, which will probably mandate new chainrings. Be aware that you may have to change out both chainrings, as there is a limit to much tooth differential a front derailleur can handle and this varies from model to model.

Scarbo

Thanks! Yes, this bike has Carlton decals and also Carlton is stamped on the brake hoods. I will check out Hyperglide.

Scarbo

Nice work, Michael! What all did you do to this bike? I notice it has a water bottle--is that a clamp-on water bottle holder (these bikes--or, at least, the 1972--did not have braze-ons for holders)? If so, where did you get it? Thanks!

nlerner

I suggest browsing through this thread for lots of modification ideas:

https://www.bikeforums.net/classic-vi...er-course.html

due ruote 

If you do have a Stronglight 93 crankset, the smallest chainring it will take is 38t and good luck finding one. However there is BF member who makes triplizers for these under the name Red Clover (iirc) and that may be an option worth considering.

Salamandrine 

It is forum member jonwvara that does Red Clover components. Red Clovers sells both a 122 BCD triplizer, and a 122 BCD 37t small position chainring.

randyjawa 

How about a Stronglight triple ring crank set, coupled with the appropriate Stronglight bottom bracket. I also have the appropriate Simplex front derailleur. Unfortunately, one one of my stupid days, I sold the matching long cage rear derailleur for cheap. Pooey-stinko!

Salamandrine 

I think we need pictures at this point...

due ruote 

+1 Otherwise it's guesswork; not entirely random but not exactly focused either.

Noah Scape

It's most likely a Stronglight 3-pin steel cottered crank.

rfmarotti

Not sure how far out of Sacramento you are, but Velo Trap and the Sac Bike Kitchen are both sources for such things.

Michael Angelo 

Braze on were added before paint.