Bianchigirll 

I stumbled on a post in facistbook Steel is Real CLassic and VIntage this morning woith a Chris Pauley frame. I know this is long shot but it's one the few bikes I've seen with a tal point on the front of the seat lug. The treatment of the seat stays is a similar plain style, similar headlugs and I believe reinforcements on brake bridge. Link to Ugly Betty's "Name That Frame" post https://www.bikeforums.net/classic-v...ame-frame.html









This beautiful Columbine was in the same post. Too bad someone removed the 50th Ann group for this....

P!N20

You’ve got a strong argument, plenty of similarities there.

Looks like yours has a three digit serial on the steerer, wondering if exhibit A has the same?

Bianchigirll 

P!N20 Don't know I could try and ask but I doubt he has had the headset apart.

BTW Everyone here is the CR's page on Pauley and one of them is a real head turner over the top custome https://classicrendezvous.com/countr.../pauley-chris/

Mr. 66

let’s see some more pictures of Betty. I do like how the seat lug cluster is looking

Mad Honk 

Do I have on beer goggles, or is Betty getting a lot prettier? Smiles, MH

unworthy1

hmmm...I am not in the Chris Pauley camp for this one, but don't have any better guess either!
There was/is a guy in Santa Rosa who had a shop in town that got burned out (or might have been the owner's residence and not the shop, maybe both!) in one of those disastrous fires that destroyed large areas of Santa Rosa, but he was said to be a Chris Pauley expert.
If I can find his name again I'd say reach out to him and see what he thinks...

bibliobob

Looks similar. Pauleys usually used Shimano dropouts, but Campy were an option. They frequently were in a similar shade of blue?

I think that that top tube guides were off center.. Are yours off center?



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Doug Fattic 

I don't think there is any chance your frame is a Chris Pauley. The rear dropouts to stays treatment looks kind of similar but they are not the same. It is very doubtful a framebuilder would do both styles. Once you get proficient doing it one way, you are going to stay doing it that way. By the way you rear brake bridge is not reversed. Back in the early 80's Cinelli (I think it was Cinelli) supplied those exact bridges and they had a brass piece that was pressed on after the frame was painted. That made the big hole a normal 6mm hole. Your brass piece for that bridge has been lost.

Your frame was built with Henry James lugs. They were very popular during that time period and lots of builders used them. They came in different angles making frame assembly easier. No blacksmithing was required to change their angle to match the frame design. Two builders that lives near T-town was Jim Redcay and Tom Kellogg. Have you explored if either of them built your frame? I know Jim did the kind of dropout treatment as on your frame but not on the Pauley. I don't remember how they did the top of the seat stay treatment. Of course both of those builders made Ross Professional frames for awhile too. Everything on your frame was built wth common frame materials.

Bianchigirll 

Of course she is. You know Strays always start to shine when someone takes them in and loves them.

No they are pretty well centered

So Betty is a common "Streetrider"? LOL


Well I guess the Ugly Betty mystery lives on for another day just like Emilia or BigFoot.... Sept 2023

sd5782 

Per speculation on Tom Kellog, Jim Redkay style is a 1984 Ross Signature Triad from just after Redkay, but perhaps influenced by him.



Seat cluster with point but different stays



Seat stay to dropout brazing style

Just for data point on styles mentioned.

Chombi1 

BG. Please, just keep the "Ugly Betty" mystery alive forever!!

Doug Fattic 

It is a very well made frame. I could have explained better that the very fine materials it was made out of were common in the sense easily ordered and used by many framebuilders so the choice of materials doesn't narrow down much who could have made it.

Doug Fattic 

Just by chance a frame I made in the early 80's has come back to me for a bit of a paint refresh. I don't have to strip and repaint the whole thing but rather patch up the damages and put on fresh new coats of clear. This frame has the kind of Cinelli brake bridge that is on Bianchigril's frame. These bridges came with a separate brass piece that would be press fit into the bridge after the frame was painted. I suppose that kept the paint from being squished when the brake was installed and as a result that paint in that location might flake off of the frame and the area eventually rust. Of course the downside is that the brass piece could be easily lost and finding another one difficult. These weren't on the market very long before their problems outweighed their advantages. I was always very concerned that one of my customers might lose one and then expect me to have in stock a replacement when they were no longer available for sale. They are kinda cool though.

I took this picture in the middle of the sanding process. It will get another wet sand before the new final clears are applied. I don't do general painting anymore except for frames made in one of my framebuilding classes or old Doug Fattic frames. A good wet paint job is a huge amount of work, the materials are expensive (I figure about $150 per frame) and the expectation of how much it will cost is unreasonably low. It is easy for a customer to not understand how much work is involved and think they are being overcharged.

Because these Cinelli brake bridges were only sold for a short amount of time in the early 80's, it provides a bench mark for when the Bianchigirl's frame was probably made. Of course a builder could keep one in inventory and use it long after they were no longer available from suppliers. Sorry Bianchigirl I don't have any spares.


This picture shows the seperate brass piece that requires press fitting into Cinelli brake bridges made in the early 80's.

Wildwood 

For years now I have been believing the Hilda model was top o' th line from U. Betty..
especially with the shorties, and color coordinated stem/saddle/bell/rear light band.
with spirited Ahearne accoutrements, the ride quality must be intoxicating.
Please don't burst my ... bubble? . I prefer illusion.
besides, most of a bike's ride quality is in the tubulars.

Chombi1 

After anyone sees a chisel style seatstay end for the first time,.....dome ended seststays just don't look good, anymore....

Mad Honk 

In reference to Doug's comments; I have found that a common bronze bearing can be used as a shim to fill the space in the brake bridge. Cost is about $3 in the local hardware store. It may need to be shortened with a bit of work with a belt sander or a sanding disc. But they fit correctly and work quite nicely. Smiles, MH