Motobecane Le Champion with non-stock fork?
#1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Berkeley CA
Posts: 2,533
Bikes: 1981 Ron Cooper, 1974 Cinelli Speciale Corsa, 2000 Gary Fisher Sugar 1, 1986 Miyata 710, 1982 Raleigh "International"
Mentioned: 97 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 929 Post(s)
Liked 1,289 Times
in
486 Posts
Motobecane Le Champion with non-stock fork?
A friend is looking at a Motobecane Le Champion that has a non-stock fork with fully sloping fork crown. Other than that the bike looks really nice and no obvious signs of frame damage. I think it's all original with Campy NR and Mafac Competition brakes. Any thoughts on what this would be worth? I presume that it would be extremely difficult to source the proper fork, though it would probably look pretty nice if repainted. SF Bay Area.
#2
Senior Member
Interesting. Looks like maybe a Raleigh Pro fork??? Probably pretty close in geometry to the fork that came on it. Maybe $500 value. Parts alone are worth that. But the frame sans original fork has little value. Good rider though.
They are asking $695. Maybe $600, looks to be in great condition.
They are asking $695. Maybe $600, looks to be in great condition.
Last edited by big chainring; 01-03-16 at 04:04 PM.
#4
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Niagara Region, Canada
Posts: 1,451
Bikes: 1970s Alex Singer, 1960s Peugeot PX 10, 1960s Bertin C37, 1973 Carre Bertin C 37, 1972 Carlton Kermesse, 1981 Peugeot PX 14 Super Competition
Mentioned: 65 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 344 Post(s)
Liked 266 Times
in
157 Posts
davester-
The fork is off a Raleigh Professional/Competition/Super Tourer. Look at the down tube below the head tube bottom lug. Check for wrinkles or cracked paint. It is possible that bike had an accident and wrote off the original fork. Your friend may need to get a new fork made if the rake of the Raleigh fork does not suit. Also, the headset is now going to be English threaded which is a consideration. If a test ride reveals that the fork and handling are fine, your friend may want to strip the fork back to chrome to avoid the mismatch of the colours. Given the equipment but the questionable frame/fork issue a price in the $200 - 300 range might be suitable especially if he is unfamiliar with older bikes and will need to hire out assistance to solve its issues.
The fork is off a Raleigh Professional/Competition/Super Tourer. Look at the down tube below the head tube bottom lug. Check for wrinkles or cracked paint. It is possible that bike had an accident and wrote off the original fork. Your friend may need to get a new fork made if the rake of the Raleigh fork does not suit. Also, the headset is now going to be English threaded which is a consideration. If a test ride reveals that the fork and handling are fine, your friend may want to strip the fork back to chrome to avoid the mismatch of the colours. Given the equipment but the questionable frame/fork issue a price in the $200 - 300 range might be suitable especially if he is unfamiliar with older bikes and will need to hire out assistance to solve its issues.
#5
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Berkeley CA
Posts: 2,533
Bikes: 1981 Ron Cooper, 1974 Cinelli Speciale Corsa, 2000 Gary Fisher Sugar 1, 1986 Miyata 710, 1982 Raleigh "International"
Mentioned: 97 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 929 Post(s)
Liked 1,289 Times
in
486 Posts
#6
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Western MI
Posts: 2,767
Mentioned: 45 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 654 Post(s)
Liked 466 Times
in
300 Posts
These are nice bikes and I've been following them on eBay. There are a few listed ranging from $600-$1,000 (includes shipping) but they aren't selling at this price.
A very nice Le Chanpion sold a couple of weeks ago for $399 + $100 shipping. Was relisted many times before one bidder finally grabbed it. I personally thought it was a good deal and would have bid it up if it weren't the holiday season.
Given the non-matching fork, I think you're looking at $350 ish. Maybe worth more parting out.
A very nice Le Chanpion sold a couple of weeks ago for $399 + $100 shipping. Was relisted many times before one bidder finally grabbed it. I personally thought it was a good deal and would have bid it up if it weren't the holiday season.
Given the non-matching fork, I think you're looking at $350 ish. Maybe worth more parting out.
#7
Friendship is Magic
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Sacramento, CA
Posts: 22,983
Bikes: old ones
Mentioned: 304 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 26380 Post(s)
Liked 10,357 Times
in
7,194 Posts
.
...I looked at that bike myself, on and off over a couple of weeks here, but I just could not get past the new fork.
If you read the same Bay Area CL I do, you see some pretty swell bikes in the 5-600 dollar range, without the associated considerations this one carries. Maybe I'm spoiled.
...I looked at that bike myself, on and off over a couple of weeks here, but I just could not get past the new fork.
If you read the same Bay Area CL I do, you see some pretty swell bikes in the 5-600 dollar range, without the associated considerations this one carries. Maybe I'm spoiled.
__________________
#8
verktyg
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 4,030
Bikes: Current favorites: 1988 Peugeot Birraritz, 1984 Gitane Super Corsa, 1980s DeRosa, 1981 Bianchi Campione Del Mondo, 1992 Paramount OS, 1988 Colnago Technos, 1985 RalieghUSA SBDU Team Pro
Mentioned: 207 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1036 Post(s)
Liked 1,237 Times
in
653 Posts
When I see a missing or mismatched fork, I immediately think: "What happened? Why?"
The bike is silver and probably a 1976 model. The 1974 and 1975 bikes were mostly lilac.
The fork doesn't really look like a Raleigh fork. I built a number of bikes with full sloping crowns like that.... Those crowns were made by 3-4 companies back in the 70's.
My guess is the fork came from a smaller US or UK builder.
Ed Litton could build a fork for that bike. My guess is that with chrome and paint, at least $150.00 - $200.00???
The first pictures are one of my frames, the next are a Holdsworth Pro and the last 2 are Raleighs:
As to price? $695... with the correct fork would be a good deal if everything thing else was in decent condition but that's a bit spendy for a "rider"!
Fork - $150, MAFAC brakes (rather than Universal Mod 68) - $50, so you're down to $495.
$350 to $450 would be OK, assuming that there's no frame damage.
I sold a 1974 Le Champion frame last year in 9 out of 10 condition with like a new Campy headset and BB. The alignment was checked and the head tube, fork and BB were refaced plus the seat tube was honed and deburred.
verktyg
Chas.
The bike is silver and probably a 1976 model. The 1974 and 1975 bikes were mostly lilac.
The fork doesn't really look like a Raleigh fork. I built a number of bikes with full sloping crowns like that.... Those crowns were made by 3-4 companies back in the 70's.
My guess is the fork came from a smaller US or UK builder.
Ed Litton could build a fork for that bike. My guess is that with chrome and paint, at least $150.00 - $200.00???
The first pictures are one of my frames, the next are a Holdsworth Pro and the last 2 are Raleighs:
As to price? $695... with the correct fork would be a good deal if everything thing else was in decent condition but that's a bit spendy for a "rider"!
Fork - $150, MAFAC brakes (rather than Universal Mod 68) - $50, so you're down to $495.
$350 to $450 would be OK, assuming that there's no frame damage.
I sold a 1974 Le Champion frame last year in 9 out of 10 condition with like a new Campy headset and BB. The alignment was checked and the head tube, fork and BB were refaced plus the seat tube was honed and deburred.
verktyg
Chas.
__________________
Don't believe everything you think! History is written by those who weren't there....
Chas. ;-)
Don't believe everything you think! History is written by those who weren't there....
Chas. ;-)
#9
Senior Member
These are nice bikes and I've been following them on eBay. There are a few listed ranging from $600-$1,000 (includes shipping) but they aren't selling at this price.
A very nice Le Chanpion sold a couple of weeks ago for $399 + $100 shipping. Was relisted many times before one bidder finally grabbed it. I personally thought it was a good deal and would have bid it up if it weren't the holiday season.
Given the non-matching fork, I think you're looking at $350 ish. Maybe worth more parting out.
A very nice Le Chanpion sold a couple of weeks ago for $399 + $100 shipping. Was relisted many times before one bidder finally grabbed it. I personally thought it was a good deal and would have bid it up if it weren't the holiday season.
Given the non-matching fork, I think you're looking at $350 ish. Maybe worth more parting out.
#10
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Middle Earth (aka IA)
Posts: 20,433
Bikes: A bunch of old bikes and a few new ones
Mentioned: 178 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5887 Post(s)
Liked 3,469 Times
in
2,079 Posts
#11
Still learning
It's not like any vintage Motobecane in San Francisco and vicinity is cheap! I realize a lot of American Picker dreamers, but it is the land of mad money and instant gratification. Given the bay area location, despite the new fork, I could justify $450-$500. A respray of the fork would add $100 or less and you'd have a fine rider.
Last edited by oddjob2; 01-05-16 at 06:21 PM.
#12
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Berkeley CA
Posts: 2,533
Bikes: 1981 Ron Cooper, 1974 Cinelli Speciale Corsa, 2000 Gary Fisher Sugar 1, 1986 Miyata 710, 1982 Raleigh "International"
Mentioned: 97 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 929 Post(s)
Liked 1,289 Times
in
486 Posts
Thanks for all the info guys. While deciding whether to try to negotiate the seller way down due to the fork issue, a much better deal came up on a pristine Panasonic Team Europe II with Columbus SL/SP and Campy Victory parts, so he went with that instead.
#13
Friendship is Magic
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Sacramento, CA
Posts: 22,983
Bikes: old ones
Mentioned: 304 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 26380 Post(s)
Liked 10,357 Times
in
7,194 Posts
__________________
#14
old guy with a new bike
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Petaluma CA
Posts: 99
Bikes: Motobecane Le Champion, Specialized something or other f.s. mountain bike
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
And yeah, Bay Area is a different market for these kind of bikes...
Last edited by mark_m; 01-09-16 at 12:59 AM. Reason: Corrections.
#15
old guy with a new bike
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Petaluma CA
Posts: 99
Bikes: Motobecane Le Champion, Specialized something or other f.s. mountain bike
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
I picked up the LC for $570. Bike is great overall, super clean, smooth, quiet. Fork rides fine but I have a feeling it might be a bit slower geometry than stock. Not sure though, only one very brief ride so far.
And yeah, Bay Area is a different market for these kind of bikes...
And yeah, Bay Area is a different market for these kind of bikes...
#16
old guy with a new bike
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Petaluma CA
Posts: 99
Bikes: Motobecane Le Champion, Specialized something or other f.s. mountain bike
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Have not been able to detect any frame damage, distortion or paint crinkling. The fork extends about an inch further forward than the stock fork, softening the feel of the front end a bit and steering somewhat more like a Grand Touring. Rides fine but I will have my eyes open (probably for a few years for the correct fork either from an LC or from a Grand Record which I believe is the same fork. Only thing I've done so far is swap out the 20mm Michelins for a pair of 32mm Compass tires. Rain has prevented me from riding it much so far, one 10 mile ride and once around the block
#17
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Knoxville, TN
Posts: 1,977
Bikes: Schwinn Paramount P15, Fisher Montare, Proteus, Rivendell Quickbeam
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 4 Times
in
4 Posts
Looks nice. As a fellow tall guy, I swapped out my stem on my GR for a Nitto Technomic so I could get the bars up some.
#18
old guy with a new bike
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Petaluma CA
Posts: 99
Bikes: Motobecane Le Champion, Specialized something or other f.s. mountain bike
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
The GR's are such wonderful bikes. All of them are I guess... My baby brother had a GR that I rode for a couple years while he was in Peace Corps. I loved that thing, much sentimental attachment to these bikes for me.
#19
old guy with a new bike
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Petaluma CA
Posts: 99
Bikes: Motobecane Le Champion, Specialized something or other f.s. mountain bike
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
After a bit more riding I realize the bar is a bit low, you're right It's ok until I drop down so I think I'll see how much stem there is to the Cinelli stem that's on there...
#20
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Knoxville, TN
Posts: 1,977
Bikes: Schwinn Paramount P15, Fisher Montare, Proteus, Rivendell Quickbeam
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 4 Times
in
4 Posts
Most stems from that era don't have a whole lot of height. I usually swap the stem & bars at the same time. I would wager that the width on those bars is pretty narrow. I am usually more comfortable with a 44 cm bar. I keep the originals in case I ever want to sell.
#21
old guy with a new bike
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Petaluma CA
Posts: 99
Bikes: Motobecane Le Champion, Specialized something or other f.s. mountain bike
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
The bars aren't overly narrow (I'll measure them though) and I'm guessing the p.o. was a good sized rider as well, but I'm thinking of going to a randonneur style of bar with the slight rise on either side, to see if it helps with the joint pain I have in my hands. Or some other style of bar. I guess that would be the perfect time to switch out the stem. In fact if I picked up a spare set of levers I could just swap that whole section out at once. Have thought about getting levers with the horizontal extensions, whatever they're called. Pretty convenient for when you're on the top of the bar. I don't know if they're considered uncool or anything but my brother had them and I got used to them on his bike.
Last edited by mark_m; 01-27-16 at 02:52 PM. Reason: small edit
#22
old guy with a new bike
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Petaluma CA
Posts: 99
Bikes: Motobecane Le Champion, Specialized something or other f.s. mountain bike
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
What about it says not Raleigh? Just curious; I'm spending a bit of time trying to figure out what this fork is. I've found some Professionals of similar vintage with very similar looking forks, 'though most have chrome on the top surface of the crown. I did find two - one white and one I can't remember, which did not have the chrome revealed on the top of the crown. Also some similar forks on some Mercians. Hard to tell the geometry from pictures... Ultimately I don't care so much, I understand what it is to some degree - a good 531 fork with more rake than the stock fork; it works well and might actually be a better fork in terms of comfort, me being old and all...
#23
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Bike Heaven (Sunnyvale CA)
Posts: 767
Bikes: No-name LH drive track. Also ride an Exxon Graftek, a Masi, a Trek R200 or a RR Boneshaker for fun!
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 60 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times
in
3 Posts
As a fellow "old guy" I make a couple of points -
!. The fork looks like a Raleigh to me, with all due respect to Chas.
2. Please don't get the "horizontal extensions" also known by the oxymoronic name "safety levers." Please. Please.
3. Instead, get one of the "3-speed" style "touring" handlebars. I find them quite comfy and they have lots of positions for my numb-prone hands to use.
Whatever you do, enjoy your great bike!
!. The fork looks like a Raleigh to me, with all due respect to Chas.
2. Please don't get the "horizontal extensions" also known by the oxymoronic name "safety levers." Please. Please.
3. Instead, get one of the "3-speed" style "touring" handlebars. I find them quite comfy and they have lots of positions for my numb-prone hands to use.
Whatever you do, enjoy your great bike!
#24
old guy with a new bike
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Petaluma CA
Posts: 99
Bikes: Motobecane Le Champion, Specialized something or other f.s. mountain bike
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
As a fellow "old guy" I make a couple of points -
!. The fork looks like a Raleigh to me, with all due respect to Chas.
2. Please don't get the "horizontal extensions" also known by the oxymoronic name "safety levers." Please. Please.
3. Instead, get one of the "3-speed" style "touring" handlebars. I find them quite comfy and they have lots of positions for my numb-prone hands to use.
Whatever you do, enjoy your great bike!
!. The fork looks like a Raleigh to me, with all due respect to Chas.
2. Please don't get the "horizontal extensions" also known by the oxymoronic name "safety levers." Please. Please.
3. Instead, get one of the "3-speed" style "touring" handlebars. I find them quite comfy and they have lots of positions for my numb-prone hands to use.
Whatever you do, enjoy your great bike!
#25
old guy with a new bike
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Petaluma CA
Posts: 99
Bikes: Motobecane Le Champion, Specialized something or other f.s. mountain bike
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
New Nitto bars/stem and Carradice Barley bag, Compass 32mm tires, swapped out the Mafac Competition brakes for 2000's and Koolstop pads.
A few more new pics on the website.
A few more new pics on the website.