CrimsonEclipse

I need a zero reach (length?) stem.
It's the one that lets the handlebar sit directly on top of the steering tube.
I know there are stems that have an adjustable angle but I don't want an additional moving part and they usually add 65-120mm of height and I don't need that.


I've tried several searches but I'm probably messing up the terminology.

veganbikes

You probably need a bike that fits, no? It seems like a stem that short would be less than ideal for steering and general bike handling. They do make sweptback bars if you need them.

urbanknight

Yep, I believe you can't find them because they would make your bike dangerously difficult to handle. And if you're looking for that short of a stem, your frame is way too big/long.

LesterOfPuppets

What kind of bars are you doing this with? Drop/MTB/alt?

The only setup I know of that goes right on top of the steerer tube is a BMX bar, but it has massive rise.

There was/is a really short reach MTB bar/stem combo wherein the bar actually had an indent so that it could kinda wrap around the steerer tube so to speak.

If MTB and you want to get your hands back some there are several swept bars to choose from if you think you'd be OK with some sweep.

For instance, the Soma Osprey bar has only 12mm rise and gets your hands back quite a bit

LesterOfPuppets

I still can't remember what the system with the indented bar is, but I found a super short stem. 1-1/8" steerer clamp

ONOFF Stoic in 10mm and 20mm lengths. I looked a couple of places and they say out of stock though.

indyfabz

If you find one, post the video of the crash on YouTube.

CrimsonEclipse

Pretty damn close.
Still hard to get ahold of.

I appreciate a real answer.
Unlike the rest of these knucklleheads....

Johnny Alien

It will handle differently but won't be problematic. You might prefer it. I have seen people try out stems reversed and coming back toward them. The report was that shockingly it didn't ride weird.

Analog Cycles sells some but they aren't cheap.

CrimsonEclipse

Yeah, 35mm stems are everywhere and cheap.
One company is charging $170 for a 0mm length and they're still always sold out.

trashbiker

Why would it be difficult to handle? I tried doing some reading and found there are "negative" lengths stems being used in dh racing so my understanding of how steering works on a bike is in peices right now.

urbanknight

Apparently my understanding is outdated and inaccurate as well. I had read that it would be way too twitchy and had something to do with where your hands are placed relative to the pivot point. But people here are saying they’ve seen it done with no problems, and I can’t say I’ve ever seen it don’t WITH problems. Fork rake, trail, and head tube angle may play a factor, but that’s definitely beyond my understanding.

79pmooney

An easy fix. It will require finding the right framebuilder, waiting and paying but there is nothing inherently difficult about making such a stem in TIG welded steel or ti. (Well, ti takes skill, care and equipment so that rules out most framebuilders. TIG welding will rule out some more but open the door for those outside the bike world.)

TiCycles has made me three stems; two in steel and one in ti. Granted they are all traditional (sorta); 175mm -22, 155 - 27 and an "ordinary" 130 -17 in ti. First two are quill, last threadless.

Edit: The mild understatement of the day. Dave Levy of TiCycles enjoys challenges. I'm betting he will question you closely as to whether you really know you want this but if you can sell him on it, he'll make it and get right.

skidder

I've got a bicycle with a really short stem (30mm, IIRC) holding a pair of flat bars and don't have a problem with steering he bike. I always thought front end 'twitchiness' came from the fork angle and any 'sweep' angle/fork leg curve (is that the right erm?) at the bottom of the forks that put the wheel farther forward (the 'sweep' or curve also helps dampen the road buzz a little bit).

CrimsonEclipse

A bit of information on the "twitchiness"

https://www.cyclingabout.com/steerin...teering-speed/

Wildwood 

Why will it affect the handling? If the frame was designed for that set-up, it won't. If the frame was designed for a conventional stem, one could still ride the bike, but handling is very likely suboptimal. Without more basics, like which bar will be used, no one can answer the question.

As to looking for an unusual (unique?) part produced by only one company that is constantly OOS - we call that vaporware, not unsatisfied market demand.

I can sell you "the World's most ventilated and comfortable saddle" that was never produced beyond prototype (to my knowledge). Unless I threw it in the garbage.

icemilkcoffee 

When the kids were little I put Crupi 0 reach stems on their Specialized Hotrock BMX bikes. They rode the bikes all over and there were no issues.

Gresp15C

All of my bikes have conventional frames and forks (salvaged old road bikes, and one new-ish hybrid), fairly short stems, and swept bars, meaning that my hands are behind the steering axis, by as much as a couple of inches. I find it to be perfectly stable. Also, every old roadster was built that way. Many of the earlier Raleigh Sports bikes had exceptionally short stems. But in terms of maintaining normal maneuverability and control of my bike without much effort, the swept bars are just fine. I use them for commuting, city traffic, recreational rides in the countryside, etc.

Now, I offer my comments while acknowledging that the people who are engaged in more sportive riding tend to settle on their preferences for good reasons. So I'm not contradicting their advice. One thing I can think about, just based on the physics, is that with a more cozy cockpit, your contact points will be closer to your center of gravity, making it easier to go over the bars under conditions such as heavy braking or hitting a bump on a steep descent. My bikes are controllable in terms of steering, but in terms of staying on the bike under adverse conditions, you probably want a more stretched out posture.

tFUnK

Reminded me of these integrated bar/stem setups:
https://a.aliexpress.com/_mL3Hv90

SkinGriz

I put a super short stem on one of my kids bikes.
It was fine.

The primary thing that would affect handling would simply be how far your hands are from the steering axis, bar angle and how that effects each riders anatomy, and maybe where the weight ends up.

If having your hands perfectly in line with the steering axis made for an uncontrollable bike, thousands of BMXers would crash every day.
Wait, they do crash all the time… but I don’t know bar placement can be blamed.

PDKL45

Analog Cycles has some 0 mm stems: Stems (analogcycles.com) The guy has issued a Fatwah vis a vis low trail and word is, it made Jan Heine cry: Debunking Low Trail (analogcycles.com)

Ergotec offers some interesting options (and yes, I know you don't want adjustable stems, there are some very short and/or fixed stems here): Products - Ergotec

PeteHski

Yeah, stem length in isolation is not very meaningful.

If you shorten the stem length on any given bike (using the same bars) then the steering gets quicker and heavier ie. Less movement at the end of the bar per degree of wheel steer. You also sit more upright on the bike. The opposite happens with a longer stem ie lighter, slower steering and longer reach.

But you can get the same changes in steering weight and speed by changing the width of your bars with the same stem length. Wider bars are slower, lighter steering.

So wide bars with a short stem can be equivalent in steering feel to narrow bars with a long stem. That’s one reason why my road bike has a relatively long stem with 420mm bars compared to my MTB with 760 mm bars.

So you always have to look at the bigger picture, including frame geometry. A zero length stem may or may not be appropriate depending on the other bike parameters ie. bar width/shape, frame reach, trail etc.

Jeff Neese

There's nothing inherently dangerous, or even "bad" about having your hand position in the same plane as, or even behind, the pivot point. Chances are that's the way it was on our kids bikes and that's what we learned on. Cruisers have them that way and so do other styles.

I have Albatross bars on one of my gravel bikes, which give you a hand position behind the pivot point. The front is of course where you have more control and where the brakes are, but the back is nice for an upright change of position, when the road gets easy and you want to relax and stretch. It definitely handles differently at the back, what's called "tiller" steering like on a beach cruiser, but certainly not dangerous or unstable.

Jeff Neese

I think it's already been said, but if you need that short of a stem then you probably have the wrong size frame for you.

I may have missed it but I don't think you shared what kind of bike it is or the kind of riding you do, but sometimes (for me at least) you really need to shift your weight forward and put some weight onto that front wheel. That's impossible if you move your hands back too far.

CrimsonEclipse

I absolutely love the: "We're not going to answer your question so you need a whole new bike" response

squirtdad

IMHO it is more you really did not fully explain why you need a zero length stem and how you plan on suing it i.e need, design, expectation. opening up the conversation to speculation.

so my speculation is you have a super secret prototype handle bar that is still in stealth development mode that requires that type of stem