jma1st3r

Goodday gents,

I know bike fit has been cover many times before. And i kinda dial in my fit a little bit having watching all them youtube videos, the question is
.. Since I am overwieght by about 30lbs, is the heavy hand thing what i have to deal with until i lose some weight?

I was on a c17 saddle. But wanted to ride longer on the trainer without getting me bum sore. Then i found out its because the saddle wasnt providing enough support so I end up getting a Spec Phenom... Then i learnt my reach was too short and riding position was wrong because i wasn't sitting on the right part of my sitbone etc....

The only problem now is my hands. A bike fitter said i got the wrong bike as cyclocross bike is not a good choice for newbies. But since i got no moolah for a nice synapse or gravel bike... Just working with what i have.

Do i just put up with it, build strength at the same time and hopefully next year it be better?

Dirk de Chablis

Have you got a raiser under the front wheel?

jma1st3r

Yes.

The wahoo kickr snap wheel riser/block

Dirk de Chablis

Measure the centre of the front axle to the ground and the centre of the rear axle to the ground and if there's a difference then raise the front end, it could be you are leaning forward without knowing it and adding extra pressure on your ulnar nerve. Do you wear track mitts with padding? Another option could be to double wrap your bars.

brawlo

You tend to be fairly stagnant on position with a trainer compared to real world riding, depending on what program you're following. Make sure you move around a bit, out of the saddle every so often just to change things up and give pressure points a break

philbob57

My weight-on-hands problem is due to weak core. I don't do well with things like practicing/working out, so I put up with it and just let riding get me stronger. Doing core exercises a few times a week would be a better approach, but I have enough trouble remembering to take meds.

cyclist2000

What is the problem with the hands? are they numb or is there pain? does the pinkie feel numb? or is it that your fitter says the fit is wrong?

jma1st3r

Fair amount of weight on my hands, and then numbs overtime... weak core and weak arm? But i think its just because the overweight situtation.

Havent had a official fit session, dont got the cash for that(but did oresent my setup tonthe fitter and he said the saddle + me + cx bike, wrong combo) . But using all the info availablr on the tube, i said i am within ball park now.

Just got to lose some weight...

cyclist2000

Do you wear gloves? on the trainer? how often do you move your hands around the handlebars?

I ask a lot of questions because I don't know what you are doing.

I ride a lot on a trainer or outside. I spend 3 hours on the bike, I used to get some numbness in my pinkie and ring finger. I would also have shooting pain in my palms. There is a large nerve the runs through the outer palm pad. I found out that I was compressing that nerve. (Verified with a doctors visit) I got the most padded gloves that I could find and over time it helped relieve the numbness.
I discussed this with my doctor during my annual physical and he agreed with my assessment and initial plan to proceed. Which is to wear padded gloves and change hand positions frequently

It could be a lot of things, bike setup, your fitness or a problem like mine. Post some photos of the bike setup and with you on the bike.

jma1st3r

I have what you have. I May give padded glove a go.

When i ride outside, since it has alot more stop and go, this hand(and bum
)pressure thing didnt come to mind. Only became more noticable when i got on to zwifting.

Like mentioned, stagnant position is likely a cause too now that it has been hinted, makes alot of sense

I never had strong forearms, and hands give out earlier doing other work...weak core, weak arm, weak hands.

brawlo

With that ^^^ in mind, for your inside riding try just putting a towel across your bars It will meet 2 needs and soak your sweat instead of it soaking you bar tape = longer bar tape life, plus it increases the cushioning to the bars. Depending on how thick the towel is you can double or triple it for more comfort

Moisture

How long is your stem? Do you feel likenits causing you to lean forward too much?

My solution was to simply eat much slower while maintaining my strict excersise routine. Im down to about 185lb from 240lb last March. It has tremendously helped with adapting to a more aggressive frame fit while still being comfortable. Try a shorter stem in the meantime and get to work strengthening your core and lower back for a start.

jma1st3r

Wow, good for you... Don't know if i can do that lol.

So i did further tweaking... I found my bike on the trainer was not level... The 32c front tire with riser block made the front higher which threw everything off...

*edited no bar to saddle drop... , ..

Definitely need to work diet lol, but i love fuud!

100mm stem, -6d, on 72.5d head angle. Bike came with 90 but i felt it was too cramped.

Oso Polar

Pressure on the hands and on the butt (especially!) is always bigger on the trainer compared to real roads.
Now, the pressure on the hands first and foremost depends on your saddle setback - if you feel too much pressure on your hands try to move your seat backwards! Try in 5 mm increments, difference should be very noticeable, more so on the real roads though.
Don't mess with your stem - its length is pretty much irrelevant.

And no, losing weight will not help with the hands pressure a bit. And yes, it is very desirable to do exercises for your core to increase comfort on the bike. And if you are planning to actively lose weight, I'd really recommend to regularly do strength exercises in addition to riding a bike (or you'll lose all muscles except for the ones involved in the bike riding). Believe me, I lost 75 pounds riding the bike, so I know pretty much everything about this process. :-)

Oso Polar

Well, you've omitted probably the most important measurement in your case - saddle setback. If by C17 you mean Brooks Cambium C17 then I'm 99% sure that it is impossible to get a proper setback with this saddle (with extremely short rails) and 0 offset seat post *especially* if your torso is longer than average (=you'll need bigger setback). Shin pain is usually associated with running, not cycling...

downtube42

Concur on saddle setback. I suggest a different method. First mark or measure where the saddle is now in case things don't go well, so you have a baseline. Then move it back as far as possible. If your hands feel significantly unweighted, move it forward a few mm at a time until you find the weight coming back. That's the balance point, settle there. As your power output, flexibility, weight, and core strength change, this may change as well.
If anyone says "but KOPS", walk away.
OTOH, if moving it back all the way doesn't unweight the hands, look into a seatpost with more setback.

jma1st3r

My bad on the wording previously. i changed to Specialized Phenom partially because this reason, i may®©™ switch it back to c17 for experiment, but i am happy with the Phenom right now, no plans for other saddles(maybe©®™ vento r3 just for testing since the position has gotten more aggresive)

**bike fitters dont like brooks dont they

Not shin pain, but the shin muscle are engaged...which they are not suppose to from reading existing forum posts...

More troubleshooting...

jma1st3r

I have tried those. I found i have the tendency to move forward. So i got the zero offset to find how far. I guess i have short-er®™ legs...its fairbit forward.

Oso Polar

Shorter legs affect saddle height, not setback. Saddle setback depends mostly on your body weight distribution and your typical power output. The first - body weight distribution - is mostly about torso length, the longer - the bigger setback you'll need to be comfortable.

I was adjusting it other way round: started with KOPS, rode about a week, moved a few mm back, rode about a week. At first it results in very noticeable excessive pressure on hands (right at KOPS), then it progresses to just some numbness on long rides (i.e. 60-80 miles), then even this goes away. And if you move it even further back then there is hardly any difference in hand pressure anymore, which means that you probably just passed the optimal point and should move the saddle a bit forward. Too far back IMHO makes it more difficult to ride fast.

Oso Polar

About moving forward. Your saddle may be too high or nose down. Both of these also cause literal PITA.

jma1st3r

That reminds me the bike i had before this one, when i first took up biking....

I had a fabric cel saddle.......nose down, too high of saddle, you name it lol

Oso Polar

Hmm, it seems to me that you are just changing too many things at once and in too big steps. You'll never find a good position this way, you'll just confuse yourself.

So:
1) Set your seat height.
2) Set your saddle setback.
3) Adjust bars position.
In this order.

Now, first crucial thing - body takes time to get accustomed to any new position, even if this new position is objectively better, it may feel worse at first. And by at first I mean at least couple of weeks, may be a month (or 500-1000 miles in other units of measure). So, anytime you do the change, give your body plenty of time to adjust to the new position.
Second crucial thing, related to the first - never ever do adjustments in big steps (unless you are not even in the ballpark of correct position at the start)! There are two reasons for this: first - the bigger the change, the more likely is that your body will not like new position at first, it'll take way more time to adjust; second - you may easily pass the optimal point, first position may be "not enough" and the second already "too much", so you'll never be happy.

To put things into perspective: 3 mm of seat height do make a difference. Just 5 mm difference in saddle setback can be a difference between perfect position and too much weight on the hands and numb hands. I adjust saddle angle in 0.5 degree increments because 1 degree change means going from one uncomfortable angle to another uncomfortable angle - so this angle must be measured if you want reproducible results (there are smartphone apps that can measure incline, they work wonders together with a cutting board over the saddle).

For example, I went to professional bike fit. Fitter lowered my saddle by 17 mm. It felt strange on the plains. And I lost ability to climb hills. And we have plenty of them here. I actually told this to him and he advised to move it half the way back (9 mm up, so just 8 mm lower compared to the original position). And it felt much better and I got accustomed to this position. And after a few months out of curiosity decided to lower it to the originally recommended height. And you know what? This time it felt great! 17 mm at once resulted being not the same as 8 mm + 9 mm. :-)

downtube42

If you're sliding forward, there is some force causing you to slide forward.
- Saddle angle. If your saddle is tilted forward, it will tend to pitch your forward.
- Saddle already too far forward. Perhaps counter-intuitive, but if your saddle is forward, pedaling forces will push your forward.
- Reach is too long for you. You're unconsciously scooting up for a more comfortable. Shorten the stem.

Moving the saddle forward is not the correct response to sliding forward.

I did forget to mention earlier, as you move your saddle aft, you'll need to lower it slights since it's moving further away from the BB.

jma1st3r

Well i need something to keep me occupied, i was a gamer...

I will keep at it thank you sir.

Burnt quad and sore hands is still better than "click click click"...

HIPCHIP

I had problems with my hands going numb. We put padded tape wrap and foam under the wrap on my bars, making them nice and thick and soft. Haven't had a problem since. Of course the proper bike and a good fit will go a long way too, but you can try the padding for not much $$$.