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25mm inside width wheels for road, why not?

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25mm inside width wheels for road, why not?

Old 12-11-19, 10:58 AM
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dvdslw
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25mm inside width wheels for road, why not?

Trying to talk myself out of purchasing a set of wide tubeless wheels for my new Domane build. Bontrager has a new set of 37mm deep, 32mm wide, 25mm inside width Aeolus 3v wheels that are fairly inexpensive when you compare them to a similarly spec'd wheelset from Zipp or Enve. I plan to use at least a 30mm tubeless tire and the overall build is comfort/endurance based, not a race bike. Any thoughts?
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Old 12-11-19, 11:22 AM
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Originally Posted by dvdslw View Post
Trying to talk myself out of purchasing a set of wide tubeless wheels for my new Domane build. Bontrager has a new set of 37mm deep, 32mm wide, 25mm inside width Aeolus 3v wheels that are fairly inexpensive when you compare them to a similarly spec'd wheelset from Zipp or Enve. I plan to use at least a 30mm tubeless tire and the overall build is comfort/endurance based, not a race bike. Any thoughts?
I recently got a set of November wheels...50mm deep carbon, 32.5mm external, 25mm internal width. I'm running GP5000TL 28mm tires that measure out to 32mm. These wheels are fantastic!!! Super fast and a nice plush ride. My gravel bike only has 20mm internal width wheels a d now I'm thinking about upgrading these too...
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Old 12-11-19, 01:51 PM
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Make sure your frame can support the wider tires that 25mm inner widths support. I chatted with official Trek support before buying my 3V for my gravel bike and they don’t recommend (read: officially support) mounting less than a 32c on it. The max supported is 64c. I have 38c on mine and wouldn’t hesitate to go as low as 35, but not sure I’d go to 32c.

Either way the 3V won’t go on my roadies because one maxes out at 25c tires and the other 28c.
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Old 12-11-19, 02:17 PM
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Originally Posted by dvdslw View Post
Trying to talk myself out of purchasing a set of wide tubeless wheels for my new Domane build.

. I plan to use at least a 30mm tubeless tire and the overall build is comfort/endurance based, not a race bike. Any thoughts?
Those will work great, but I'd look at these too.

https://www.lightbicycle.com/700C-tu...vel-bikes.html

Last edited by noodle soup; 12-11-19 at 06:16 PM.
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Old 12-11-19, 02:34 PM
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HED's are a smoking deal for what they are. Or used Flo's if you want modern "wide" aero wheels on a good budget.

Owning a set now that's 25mm outside width, I'd never see a purpose for anything wider for road use. Unless doing Roubaix or putting them on a mixed surface bike.

Road only? I think 25mm outside gets the balance of crr, aero, profile just about right. Toss a 23 on the front for a TT or something, otherwise a 25. Really fast.
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Old 12-11-19, 02:44 PM
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Some issues with very wide rims, as the title requested

1) If the tire you use (eg Vittoria Corsa Speed, Pirelli P Zero) has a very narrow usable tread or tread cap, and you don’t pump your tires up very hard, you will run out of tread when cornering. It can lead to a slideout.

2) The rims are more exposed to impact. I have several chips in my rims from random gravel/rocks on the road. You can also damage your rims by hitting lips at the wrong angle, such as turning into a driveway.

3) If the reason you don’t like lower pressures is because the tire gets too floppy in corners, then wider rims are great. If the reason you don’t run lower pressures is because the tire starts to feel slow or you’re pinching rubber/damaging rims from impact, wider rims will not solve these issues. They could potentially make things worse - I have no idea.

4) This is less “confirmed” but the wider the rim, the more exposed the tire sidewalls seem. So you may see a slight increase in sidewall slash frequency.

I would go as far as to say that the best, and nearly only reason to go with wide rims relative to the tire (I’m talking about 30mm tires on 25mm rims, not 2.5 inch tires on 35mm rims etc.) is aerodynamics. It’s one of the best indicators for aero stability, once you control for rim depth.

Mountain bikers bought into the wide rim hype because they were running 2.4-2.5 inch tires on 19mm rims. And they run very low pressures + stiff casings, which significantly amplifies the negative effects of tire floppiness. Even after the “revolution”, people are running 27-35mm rims for 2.3-2.6 inch tires. Maybe 40-45mm for 3.0 inch tires. This would be like running a 35mm tire on a 19mm rim. So we are going well past what the MTB community, where this wide rim hype started, has gone.

Last edited by smashndash; 12-11-19 at 02:53 PM.
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Old 12-11-19, 02:58 PM
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I'm using rims with 25 mm inner width and love them. Sorry not to talk you out of it.
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Old 12-11-19, 04:31 PM
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Originally Posted by CarloM View Post
Make sure your frame can support the wider tires that 25mm inner widths support. I chatted with official Trek support before buying my 3V for my gravel bike and they don’t recommend (read: officially support) mounting less than a 32c on it.
I chatted with Trek directly and they said the 3v's will clear my 2019 Domane slr frame no problem and they have also made a change to their official tire size compatibility which is now a 28mm minimum size.
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Old 12-11-19, 04:34 PM
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Originally Posted by dvdslw View Post
I chatted with Trek directly and they said the 3v's will clear my 2019 Domane slr frame no problem and they have also made a change to their official tire size compatibility which is now a 28mm minimum size.
So what are you waiting for? Buy them and post a review!
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Old 12-11-19, 05:21 PM
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Originally Posted by dvdslw View Post
I chatted with Trek directly and they said the 3v's will clear my 2019 Domane slr frame no problem and they have also made a change to their official tire size compatibility which is now a 28mm minimum size.
Good to hear...although that must have just happened as my chat was literally last week. Or else that info is slowly making it's way through to all their CSRs.

Either way, I'd be interested to hear your experience. As I mentioned, I would hesitate going down as low as 32c since the outer width of the 3Vs is 32mm. I personally wouldn't want to go to 28s for my gravel bike, but I'm curious to hear (and see, if you wouldn't mind posting pics) your experiences.
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Old 12-12-19, 06:48 AM
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Originally Posted by CarloM View Post
Good to hear...although that must have just happened as my chat was literally last week. Or else that info is slowly making it's way through to all their CSRs.

Either way, I'd be interested to hear your experience. As I mentioned, I would hesitate going down as low as 32c since the outer width of the 3Vs is 32mm. I personally wouldn't want to go to 28s for my gravel bike, but I'm curious to hear (and see, if you wouldn't mind posting pics) your experiences.
I don't think they are all informed as of yet. I did two separate chat sessions with Trek yesterday just to confirm and one said yes definitely and the other said 32mm is the smallest tire so who knows? I do know that Enve offers a similar wheelset with the same inner spec that is tubeless and they say 28mm is good to go. I'm sure Envy's on top of safety concerns when it comes to tire fitting standards. I still have a little time before I'm ready to pull the trigger on a set of wheels but I'm leaning towards the 3v's because they appear to be the best value out there for a top name quality wheelset.
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Old 12-12-19, 07:25 AM
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Originally Posted by smashndash View Post
Some issues with very wide rims, as the title requested

1) If the tire you use (eg Vittoria Corsa Speed, Pirelli P Zero) has a very narrow usable tread or tread cap, and you don’t pump your tires up very hard, you will run out of tread when cornering. It can lead to a slideout.

2) The rims are more exposed to impact. I have several chips in my rims from random gravel/rocks on the road. You can also damage your rims by hitting lips at the wrong angle, such as turning into a driveway.

3) If the reason you don’t like lower pressures is because the tire gets too floppy in corners, then wider rims are great. If the reason you don’t run lower pressures is because the tire starts to feel slow or you’re pinching rubber/damaging rims from impact, wider rims will not solve these issues. They could potentially make things worse - I have no idea.

4) This is less “confirmed” but the wider the rim, the more exposed the tire sidewalls seem. So you may see a slight increase in sidewall slash frequency.

I would go as far as to say that the best, and nearly only reason to go with wide rims relative to the tire (I’m talking about 30mm tires on 25mm rims, not 2.5 inch tires on 35mm rims etc.) is aerodynamics. It’s one of the best indicators for aero stability, once you control for rim depth.

Mountain bikers bought into the wide rim hype because they were running 2.4-2.5 inch tires on 19mm rims. And they run very low pressures + stiff casings, which significantly amplifies the negative effects of tire floppiness. Even after the “revolution”, people are running 27-35mm rims for 2.3-2.6 inch tires. Maybe 40-45mm for 3.0 inch tires. This would be like running a 35mm tire on a 19mm rim. So we are going well past what the MTB community, where this wide rim hype started, has gone.
Good post. Wider is better until it isn't. The majority of people who are best served by the 25mm-ish inner width rims are on 32mm road tires or even wider mixed-use tires. Though the "105% rule" is valid in the absolute, it's not tremendously applicable to most people who are out there riding bikes. Top level TT people? Sure - but they're generally not on 28mm tires or anything close to that wide.
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