woodcraft

It's kind of a grey area- officially tolerated, but not in the code.

From DMV: "California law does not allow or prohibit motorcycles from passing other vehicles proceeding in the same direction within the same lane, a practice often called "lane splitting," "lane sharing" or "filtering.""

livedarklions

OK, so the one that annoys me is the three way intersection with a stoplight or three way stop sign, and I'm FRAP out of the traffic lane on the non-intersected side. There is literally no lane of vehicles crossing my path, so I take the position that I might as well be on the sidewalk and absolutely ignore the lights or signs. That's definitely a shout from someone who just loves their own voice.

billridesbikes

Why do you still stop for stop signs in Oregon if you can see you would have the right of way when you arrive? Is it a personal virtue thing or force of habit now?

noimagination

This is how I (try to) look at it, too.

Like you, though, a couple of times having someone call me out on a traffic infraction has made me upset. In my particular case, I've gotten upset because I felt guilty, not because of what the critic did. Also like you, I try pretty hard to ride cautiously, legally and courteously, so on the rare occasion when I consciously break the rules, that just exacerbates my feelings of guilt and makes me more likely to react badly to criticism.

I'm not saying that you are reacting the same way, I'm just describing what might go on in my own head in circumstances similar to yours, in case it might be helpful. If not, feel free to completely ignore my post.

caloso

Exactly. In my experience, the only thing that annoys motorists more than cyclists flouting traffic laws is cyclists strictly obeying them.

caloso

I don't know about Cali. I don't follow Colombian law. However, in California lane splitting is not prohibited.

Retro Grouch 

In Missouri it's illegal but, unless it causes an accident, it's a "no harm no foul" infraction. No fine, no points off your license.

Pavol Stromcek

The overwhelming majority of cyclists where I live in the Bay Area run stop signs when there are no cars around. I do it too, but I always yield the right of way to any cars who legally have it. Most cyclists that I see do this safely (i.e., they slow down, look both ways, etc.), but I occasionally see idiots who don't.

I got yelled at once by a driver when I ran a stop sign. He rolled down his window and shouted "Stop signs are for everyone!" I shrugged my shoulders. He wasn't wrong, obviously, but I don't like feeding other people's attempts at confrontation.

I was also once yelled at by someone in the passenger seat of a passing car who shouted "Move over!" on a narrow, winding road. I was already about as over to the right as I could be - I wasn't hogging the lane at all - so I'm not sure what this imbecile was thinking.

Retro Grouch 

Fair's fair. I've offered a couple acquaintances the opportunity to meet me at a four way stop intersection of their choice. I'll give them a dollar for every car that makes a full stop if they'll give me a dollar for every one that doesn't. Nobody has ever wanted to take me up on that.

livedarklions

This is one of those dumb arguments I hear from drivers--"cars don't run red lights". Yeah, right, they invented the delayed green as some sort of joke, right?

canklecat

In January I was ticketed for slow rolling a right turn at a 4-way stop with no traffic other than a single car behind me, which I saw in my mirror but couldn't otherwise identify.

It was a cop.

Later, reviewing my video, I realized he'd been shadowing me for a mile, waiting for me to make a mistake. He saw me come to complete stops where appropriate, because he was directly behind me. But he had a quota to fill on the last day of the month and pounced the instant I made one mistake -- which, technically, was outside his jurisdiction, on a street boundary shared with the larger main city.

I gave him the usual Idaho Stop explanation. He listened politely, and ticketed me anyway. No drama. But at least he heard my rationale.

I've been hit several times by cars, as a cyclist, motorcyclists, pedestrian and driver. The most dangerous place by far is an intersection. I've been rear-ended many times, usually at slow speed. But even a slow speed bump on a bike can result in serious injuries.

And the offending negligent driver always says the same stupid damned thing: "I didn't see you!"

Right. I'm directly in front of you at a stop sign intersection, lighted up like a Christmas tree. Didn't see me. Drivers who spout such BS should have their licenses revoked.

So if the only vehicle in sight is behind me, and the car is either approaching too fast or tailgating, I'm still gonna slow-and-roll through a stop sign intersection after checking for oncoming traffic from directly ahead and both sides. A $300 ticket is still cheaper than the thousands of dollars lost being struck by an uninsured or under-insured motorist. Texas liability insurance is minimal, half of which goes to your attorney. When I was struck and seriously injured in 2001 I was lucky to get $5,000, which didn't come close to covering my medical expenses. I was on a cane for the next 14 years, unable to work a full time job. More than a decade lost to a negligent, under-insured driver.

I don't blow through stop sign intersections. I've always slow-and-rolled. Which is why I don't join most fast roadie group rides, because they do blow heedlessly through intersections. So every "no-drop" ride turns into a grudge-fest with most of the group waiting impatiently for the stragglers who actually do approach intersections cautiously. Not worth the aggravation.

For now -- because I'm on 90-day probation -- I am coming to complete stops, foot-down when necessary, in the jurisdiction where I was ticketed. And I'm nervous as a cat in a roomful of rocking chairs, whenever I see a car behind me. Once I'm outside that ticket-trap's jurisdiction I resume my usual slow-and-roll practice.

Do whatever you believe works best for you in your area. And keep some spare cash in the bank and an attorney on speed dial for when you get caught. It's still cheaper than being clobbered from behind by a negligent driver.

Miele Man

That reminds me of a joke about two car drivers.

One driver is driving a car with a passenger in it. He's driving at a good speed and comes to a red light and blows right through it.

Passenger yells at him: "you just went through a red light!"

Driver: "I know. Don't worry. My brother does it all the time."

They go a few more blocks and there's another red light facing them and the driver blows through it too.

Passenger yells: " You did it again!"

Driver: "Don't worry! My brother does it all the time."

This happens at a number of consecutive red lights. then they come to agreen light and the driver slams on the brakes and the car skids to a stop before going into the intersection.

Passenger: "Are you crazy? You had a green light! why'd you slam on the brakes?"

Driver: "In case my brother was coming to the red light."

Cheers

Doug64

I stop at stop signs because I teach bike safety to 5th graders, and I don't want kids seeing me "blow" through stop signs. We are going to teach them, if we have any classes this spring, to use the stop arm signal and stop. We will explain the Idaho stop to them, and discuss how to use it when they gain skills.Stopping and signaling will be easier and safer when they are learning to ride in traffic. It is also a force of habit

Digger Goreman

Checked with Apollo, and the switchboard at Delphi... no calls made....

downtube42

Imagine you're driving on an empty road in the middle of Kansas. You're coming up to a 4-way stop, and there's not a car in sight in any direction. The speed limit is 50 mph. THree questions:
1) How fast are you going?
2) What do you do at the stop sign?
3) How fast are you going after the stop sign?

I've asked this question a hundred times in a training class I used to teach. Answers range from
50/0/50
90/75/90
What kind of car am I driving?

It really doesn't have much to do with the vehicle.

The car passenger and their response - that had everything to do with their baggage about your vehicle. Let it go.

RMoudatir

In California I see cyclists running through stop signs in front of police cars and they don't do anything.

Road Fan

A few of the responses amount to, "if they want to be angry at me, let them, it doesn't matter once they drive away." But it does, in terms of the potential for that anger being vented against other cyclists, or just against others.

Moe Zhoost

Your big mistake is letting this bother you so much that you have to post it here. Mellow out, dude.

hrdknox1

Yes. You make a valid point. It probably created a feeling of guilt knowing that I predominantly obey traffic rules. If she had, instead, yelled "Go Man Go" it would have boosted my ego and made me feel like a pro.

Maelochs

even though she could have been telling to go far away and never come back .....

wolfchild

I don't think civilians should be calling out people for breaking traffic laws, unless that particular law breaker has directly put you in danger at the time when they were breaking the law... I roll through stop signs early in the morning when there isn't a lot of traffic and I see a lot of drivers doing the same thing.

wolfchild

Both of you were in the wrong...She was wrong for calling you out for breaking the traffic law and you were wrong for getting offended and upset when she told you that you broke the law. The worse part was when you wanted to catch up with her and get into a roadside argument. If you break the law then you need to own up to it and take responsibility for your actions...Don't forget that we have a pandemic going around which is highly infectious, so it's best to keep your mouth shut , keep your distance and not get into arguments with strangers.

CoffeedrinkerNC

Another, I did not need to follow the rules, but the cagers must...

SethAZ 

Did he pull you over to tell you that? :-)

No doubt. I pretty much never roll through a stoplight (where I'm at stoplights are only at very serious intersections), but a stop sign on a tiny side road out in the middle of nowhere with great visibility on all sides and nobody around? All bets are off. My rule is I'll do what seems safest. When I'm interacting with traffic I'll try to do whatever is most predictable and what most drivers would expect, make eye contact with drivers, do the little head nod, whatever. Whatever's safest for all concerned is what I worry about, avoiding getting pulled over by cops on my bike is a very close second, and earning brownie points with The Man comes in at a distant third.

That being said, I ride most often in some relatively rural (suburb of the suburbs as it were) territory, with some more city-like riding where I'm much stricter on my adherence to the traffic laws, and some straight up city riding as part of group rides, where I'm very strict on traffic laws. I've been on some group rides where parts of the group have blown red lights at intersections in situations where I was absolutely appalled by the decision, and personally stopped. Some cyclists really do take that cavalier attitude to an extreme.

Koyote

This ruined your ride? Sheesh.

A couple months ago, as I was coming back into town after a long ride, an old minivan passed me - a dude leaned out of the passenger window and yelled "F--K you, you f---ing f----t!"

Actually, that didn't even ruin my ride. I really wanted to catch up and ask the guy how he can determine someone's sexual orientation just by glancing out of a passing car. That's some talent. I also wanted to give him a long, tight hug, and maybe a wet kiss. I think he needed it. I think he wanted it.