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Once Competitive Always Competitive?

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Once Competitive Always Competitive?

Old 12-15-20, 10:09 PM
  #26  
UCantTouchThis
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I'm a steady strong effort type of guy. I could start a ride with a group of 25. I will start at the back and eventually pass 22 of them without chasing anyone. Just a steady consistent effort. I really have no drive to chase or compete with anyone. I just ride my bike for exercise and pass other riders.
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Old 12-15-20, 10:44 PM
  #27  
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Originally Posted by pattrick View Post
Pushing sixty in a couple of weeks. I am a has been and can deal with that at times. At times the arrogance of those passing me inspires me to chase them down then pass them just to to say pfffft. We all ride so at least try to be sociable, we all ride for different goals but being such a minority I feel we need to support each other. Pass me if you will but be sociable. If not I can become a total ass. I will die just to make you feel inferior. Wave or signal and I will politely do the same as you pass me by. I realize that I can ramp up to high speeds quickly for short burst and piss most off in my area by doing so, but sustainabilty for great distances is no longer my strong suit alas. Fortunately that is all it usualy takes. Yes I have a bit of an attitude at times. But for the most part I support all those who ride and tend to do my own thing. I admire those who politely do the same. But......... lets just all be nice ,we are to few to try to be elitist . Race if you must, but please respect those who just tend to meander for the enjoyment of the ride. We are to few to few to segregate , lets just say we all enjoy the ride! Be it fast or slow we all all are bicycleist. sometimes it is just that simple.
Chasing down riders you deem to be insufficiently sociable? Well, that certainly is something.
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Old 12-15-20, 11:52 PM
  #28  
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This thread reminds me of a conversation I had with a lady once on a training run. It seems we had different definitions of the word "competitive." She thought it meant going hard all the time and testing one's limits. I on the other hand, thought it meant you had a good chance to win or place high in a competition.
To answer the OP's question, I am not a competitive person unless I am in an actual competition. Now if someone such as the OP wants to make it a competition, then make it official and set the rules/parameters. I will still make it a friendly competition unless that person decides to run their mouth. At that point, I will do everything I can to destroy/humiliate them and make sure they never want to do it again.
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Old 12-16-20, 12:19 AM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by pattrick View Post
Pushing sixty in a couple of weeks. I am a has been and can deal with that at times. At times the arrogance of those passing me inspires me to chase them down then pass them just to to say pfffft. We all ride so at least try to be sociable, we all ride for different goals but being such a minority I feel we need to support each other. Pass me if you will but be sociable. If not I can become a total ass. I will die just to make you feel inferior. Wave or signal and I will politely do the same as you pass me by. I realize that I can ramp up to high speeds quickly for short burst and piss most off in my area by doing so, but sustainabilty for great distances is no longer my strong suit alas. Fortunately that is all it usualy takes. Yes I have a bit of an attitude at times. But for the most part I support all those who ride and tend to do my own thing. I admire those who politely do the same. But......... lets just all be nice ,we are to few to try to be elitist . Race if you must, but please respect those who just tend to meander for the enjoyment of the ride. We are to few to few to segregate , lets just say we all enjoy the ride! Be it fast or slow we all all are bicycleist. sometimes it is just that simple.
"Can become?"
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Old 12-16-20, 12:37 AM
  #30  
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You should consider doing a Sprint Triathlon as 3 person RELAY TEAM. ALL YOU GOTTA DO IS RIDE THE BIKE after your team mate completes the SWIM and then after you complete the BIKE portion, another team mate does the RUN.

IF YOU WANT TO COMPETE........This is fun......without being the serious Triathlon participant......If you wanna compete....talk is cheap!
Even though the RELAY TEAMS are the 2nd Class Citizens at such triathlons, the competition is there and you know what......your bike portion TIME will be compareable against all others' cycling times as you'll ride the same course........my bet is you aren't as good as you think are.....but talk is cheap and this is a great way to have fun and see just how you might stack up with others.

The Really Cool Thing About RELAY TEAM in these Sprint Triathlons IS THAT YOU CAN HAVE ANYONE, male, and female, YOUNG and OLD.....however you want to mix the makeup your team. Anything you want....... Heck if you're gonna have three twentysomething worldclass superstars in swim, bike , and run..........you're doing it wrong because realistically if you and your members are world-class then you should step up and take the challenge and do the TRI and not simply the Relay Team, but thats your call. IT IS A FUN WAY TO ENTER A TRIATHLON FOR PERSONS THAT OTHERWISE CANNOT or WOULD HAVE DIFFICULTY DOING ALL THREE !!!
It is more friendly and fun than SERIOUS for most RELAY teams, WHICH IS WHY RELAY TEAM PARTICIPANTS are 2nd Class Citizens of the tri world. They respect the RELAY TEAM participants much in the same way that say the oldtimers baseball game with retired hall of famers at Yankee Stadium, Fenway Park, Dodger Stadium or at Wrigley Field. It's somewhat cool but it ain't the big time.

https://www.sdtriseries.com/relays

https://www.redbull.com/gb-en/mixed-relay-triathlon

https://www.chicagotriathlon.com/rac...lon/divisions/


https://www.trisignup.com/Race/SC/Lexington/DamTri

https://www.trisignup.com/Race/DamTri/Page-7


https://www.trisignup.com/Race/SC/Se...emsonTriathlon

https://www.trisignup.com/Race/TheCl...iathlon/Page-7


Obviously it might be 2022 or very late 2021 before Covid-19 is mitigated with enough vaccinated people in the USA such that events like these can return, but even if it takes until 2022, you can bet these triathlon events will just as fun. The RELAY TEAM is the way to go if you wanna do the BIKE portion only....
Heck you can likely find a good SWIMMER in your immediate family and I am sure that there is probably another family member or friend or son-in-law or your grand-daughter who is a good RUNNER......................bingo you just formed a team.....................Then all you gotta do is give your team a cool team name!
It's not like you're gonna be doing the Tour de France or trying to get on the US Olympic team.........................Just like a golfer in a tournament, your TIME in the Bike portion will be exactly compareable just as a golfer's score during the tournament as every player plays the same course on the same day-------so even if you're on a RELAY TEAM, you can compare your bike time with those of the SERIOUS folks who compete in the real tri doing all three events.
You'll enjoy it. Just do it!
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Old 12-16-20, 12:48 AM
  #31  
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I'm not competitive with people on the road because it isnt a competition when the other person doesn't know whats happening.
Also, I simply don't come upon many cyclists on my paved or gravel road rides. Even if I did, why would I compete against them when they may be on mile 80 while I'm on mile 14.


Compete using Strava segments since that's based on everyone competing...or at least everyone opting in to preset arbitrarily established competitons.
Or race on Zwift since everyone in a race is wanting to race. They are super easy to sign up for and there are dozens each day. Get your competition fix going against people who want to compete.
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Old 12-16-20, 06:15 AM
  #32  
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OP, you're using cyclists in front of you as motivation, not competing with them.
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Old 12-16-20, 07:31 AM
  #33  
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This thread reminds me of two cars racing on the highway. One car is pedal-to-the-metal, taking curves as fast as he can, trying to catch the other car against all odds.

And the other car is on cruise control, the driver daydreaming or listening to books on tape.

Is it really a competition?
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Old 12-16-20, 07:32 AM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by rubiksoval View Post
What does this even mean? How are you competing against someone that isn't competing against you?

Say you chase me down and pass me. What does that mean to you? Did you win something? Are you now the fastest person on the road? What was the accomplishment, then?

That's the issue. It's not sensitivity, it's just you having to completely make up whatever you think just happened, because it didn't actually happen. And that's all well and good if it's in your head, but when you go and start proclaiming it on bike forums, it's a bit bizarre. And when you call out people that actually do race because they understand the difference between a race and just riding around, it's even more so. Who's kidding who?
Suppose I'm riding at my normal pace and someone passes me. He's not going a lot faster, so I say, hey, don't mind if I draft you? That's OK, he answers. So I follow him and he begins to up the pace, looking back a couple of times to see if I'm still there. I struggle but keep at his wheel. He tries to drop me but he can't. He eases up a bit, now it's my turn. I pass him and the play begins again. This stretch of road leads to town, there's a big billboard at the entrance. We slow down a bit, looking at each other. With 80 meters to go we start the sprint. Any one of us wins. We smile and say good bye.
How would you call that?
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Old 12-16-20, 07:59 AM
  #35  
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Originally Posted by Reynolds View Post
Suppose I'm riding at my normal pace and someone passes me. He's not going a lot faster, so I say, hey, don't mind if I draft you? That's OK, he answers. So I follow him and he begins to up the pace, looking back a couple of times to see if I'm still there. I struggle but keep at his wheel. He tries to drop me but he can't. He eases up a bit, now it's my turn. I pass him and the play begins again. This stretch of road leads to town, there's a big billboard at the entrance. We slow down a bit, looking at each other. With 80 meters to go we start the sprint. Any one of us wins. We smile and say good bye.
How would you call that?
A story you just made up to make a point that has nothing to do with the post to which you're responding?
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Old 12-16-20, 08:20 AM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by Reynolds View Post
Suppose I'm riding at my normal pace and someone passes me. He's not going a lot faster, so I say, hey, don't mind if I draft you? That's OK, he answers. So I follow him and he begins to up the pace, looking back a couple of times to see if I'm still there. I struggle but keep at his wheel. He tries to drop me but he can't. He eases up a bit, now it's my turn. I pass him and the play begins again. This stretch of road leads to town, there's a big billboard at the entrance. We slow down a bit, looking at each other. With 80 meters to go we start the sprint. Any one of us wins. We smile and say good bye.
How would you call that?
I would call that the closest thing cycling has to a meet cute if it were in a rom-com.
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Old 12-16-20, 08:23 AM
  #37  
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Originally Posted by rsbob View Post
.

In my 30s I was an aggressive rider but when I rode, I rode hard and would chase down anyone I could, even momentarily just to catch them. Now in my mid-60s I still am unable to lose that drive to chase, but now don’t catch but back off.
Sounds like you were a legit Cat 6 racer.

Look it up.

Last edited by Kapusta; 12-16-20 at 08:27 AM.
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Old 12-16-20, 08:30 AM
  #38  
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Originally Posted by wphamilton View Post
I've noticed, in this venue at least, that racers can get sensitive when non-racers talk about competitiveness. Pin on a number, why train if you're not racing, it's not about being fast, all of that sort of business. They don't really get it.
I think it's just the poseur aspect of it. People pretending to do (or be) something they are not.

Years ago, on our regular group ride, one of the riders started talking about the rides in racing terms. He would dissect them afterwards (during the post-ride beer drinking), saying things like, "Did you see how I attacked Steve on Elm Street?," and "How about that leadout that Bob gave to Dave at the county line?" He would recreate (in his narrative) the ride as if it had been a race, rather than a no-drop group ride.

It's an especially weird affectation, given that bike racing is not difficult: all you have to do is get out of bed early and show up, pay a few bucks, and ride your bike -- and you're an actual "bike racer."
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Old 12-16-20, 08:30 AM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by rubiksoval View Post
A story you just made up to make a point that has nothing to do with the post to which you're responding?
Happened to me in the real world quite a few times. I'd call it unofficial or improvised competition.
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Old 12-16-20, 08:32 AM
  #40  
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Originally Posted by mstateglfr View Post
I would call that the closest thing cycling has to a meet cute if it were in a rom-com.
I would love it if someone would make a cycling rom-com. Then maybe I wouldn't have to watch "When Harry Met Sally" with my wife every year on Valentine's Day.
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Old 12-16-20, 08:36 AM
  #41  
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Originally Posted by Koyote View Post
Years ago, on our regular group ride, one of the riders started talking about the rides in racing terms. He would dissect them afterwards (during the post-ride beer drinking), saying things like, "Did you see how I attacked Steve on Elm Street?," and "How about that leadout that Bob gave to Dave at the county line?" He would recreate (in his narrative) the ride as if it had been a race, rather than a no-drop group ride.
I am picturing a totally bewildered expression on Steve and Bob and Dave's faces, completely unaware that these instances had occurred.
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Old 12-16-20, 08:56 AM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by Vintage Schwinn View Post
You should consider doing a Sprint Triathlon as 3 person RELAY TEAM. ALL YOU GOTTA DO IS RIDE THE BIKE
....talk is cheap!!
I don't think the average club cyclist doing the B-ride has any idea how strong a lot of triathletes and duathletes are in a time trial. It's their wheelhouse, aerobic power production. Also, triathletes tend to have more time on their hands as multisport athletes as opposed to a single sport athlete anyway. Maybe our area is exceptional, but we've got a lot of local Ironman triathletes (as in they do one EVERY year) that can smoke the local yokels on a bike.

To address the rest of the forum topic:

1. It isn't competition if there isn't some kind of bounds to the activity. Even if you come across a guy on a ride.......you don't just roll up on them while they're doing intervals and go "oh I passed you". If you're all about some childish stuff like that, why not propose a challenge? Ride to a hill, propose a segment, etc.... What some folks in here are saying is competitive spirit is akin to saying you're brave because you can beat on the glass of the gorilla exhibit at the zoo. Go jump in the gorilla pit then you can start talking.

2. Since when is filtering up through a group ride considered "competitive"? If it isn't an outright "weeknight worlds", then there is no 'competition'. Even then, weeknight worlds is a random hard workout and johnson measuring event. A group ride is a group ride. Assuming you're competitive on a group ride just makes you the ass who is screwing up the group ride. It doesn't make you competitive. The group ride is about the group. Smooth rotation. Safety. Together. If you want to do this, just have the group let everyone "go" when there's a longer hill or something. Kind of like turning off the "fence" in a Zwift group ride for the mountain climb.

3. Strava......oh Strava. I've stopped paying attention to the stuff that isn't an out-and-back or something with a good uphill grade to it. Otherwise, it's just playing the game of weather doping or sit on sprinting. Man up and fight the hills and wind in BOTH directions. Even then, it still doesn't matter, it's just a good way to measure your progress.
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Old 12-16-20, 09:04 AM
  #43  
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I think the OP should have put this on the 50+ or C&V. He would have got zero to very little snark.
At 57 I'm still as competitive as ever. I think it's a mindset and not necessarily a competition the OP is referring to. So in that respect I'm competitive (not necessarily competitive in that event). So if you want to play any sport/game with me whether it be basketball, golf, dodgeball, tennis, etc... my mindset is I'm gonna beat you or at the very least do the best I can to beat you.
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Old 12-16-20, 09:07 AM
  #44  
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I've done it on solo rides, but I don't see it as competition. If I am trying to catch another rider it's really to see how fast that guy is riding. I won't, however, try to grab his wheel. I will hang back a distance and try to maintain his pace. Then I either go a different direction or we end up at a light together, in which case I'd say hi, where are you headed, and then usually let him go ahead. If he's cruising at pace slower then mine, I'll pass.

I've done it often as a runner too, but again, I don't follow close enough to make the other person feel uncomfortable.

It's not a competition if you're the only one thinking it's a compeition.
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Old 12-16-20, 09:29 AM
  #45  
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Originally Posted by Koyote View Post
It's an especially weird affectation, given that bike racing is not difficult: all you have to do is get out of bed early and show up, pay a few bucks, and ride your bike -- and you're an actual "bike racer."
Exactly.

But of course, when people do that, they very quickly realize that reality is not what they imagined, and then there's the ignominy of being dropped after just 5 minutes.

So apparently it's just easier to pretend you're racing random strangers on the road and then claim that as being competitive.
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Old 12-16-20, 09:49 AM
  #46  
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Originally Posted by pattrick View Post
Pushing sixty in a couple of weeks. I am a has been and can deal with that at times. At times the arrogance of those passing me inspires me to chase them down then pass them just to to say pfffft. We all ride so at least try to be sociable, we all ride for different goals but being such a minority I feel we need to support each other. Pass me if you will but be sociable. If not I can become a total ass. I will die just to make you feel inferior. Wave or signal and I will politely do the same as you pass me by. I realize that I can ramp up to high speeds quickly for short burst and piss most off in my area by doing so, but sustainabilty for great distances is no longer my strong suit alas. Fortunately that is all it usualy takes. Yes I have a bit of an attitude at times. But for the most part I support all those who ride and tend to do my own thing. I admire those who politely do the same. But......... lets just all be nice ,we are to few to try to be elitist . Race if you must, but please respect those who just tend to meander for the enjoyment of the ride. We are to few to few to segregate , lets just say we all enjoy the ride! Be it fast or slow we all all are bicycleist. sometimes it is just that simple.
This is the strangest post I've read in a while. How does someone pass you arrogantly? By not waving? For that you will die just to make them feel inferior?

Driving down the freeway must be quite the experience.
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Old 12-16-20, 09:52 AM
  #47  
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There seems to be evidence that in the mental health community that "type-A" personalities exist. Often exhibiting a nearly non-stop attention to status. Maybe this trait is reflected in constant attention to riding group status.
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Old 12-16-20, 10:02 AM
  #48  
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Originally Posted by DorkDisk View Post
OP, you're using cyclists in front of you as motivation, not competing with them.
This.
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Old 12-16-20, 10:14 AM
  #49  
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Originally Posted by rsbob View Post
In auto racing it’s called the ‘red mist’ and it’s the urge to compete and excel. I know there is a good percentage on this board, who ride strictly for the pleasure, fitness, etc, and have zero issue with it. I also know they will comment here even if this thread doesn’t pertain to them, such being the nature of forums.

In my 30s I was an aggressive rider but when I rode, I rode hard and would chase down anyone I could, even momentarily just to catch them. Now in my mid-60s I still am unable to lose that drive to chase, but now don’t catch but back off.

I do it because I think it’s fun, no matter how painful it can be at times. I like to test myself and push myself. I know this is MY thing. No judgement (Others I am sure will add theirs )

Just wondering how many ‘mature’ (heh) riders still have that drive and how many have given it up and moved on and continued cycling for other reasons?
I'll admit to often doing what the OP does, which is chasing down just about every rabbit in front of me, while I'm on a solo ride. But I don't consider it competition with that cyclist, it's more of a competition with myself to see how quickly I can close a specific gap, or to catch up to and then hold the wheel of a stronger rider for as long as I can. I feel that chasing a rabbit (even if they're a non-participant) boosts my adrenaline/endorphins during an interval, in ways that simply doing a hard interval solo, does not. This also goes for Zwift rides.

And yup, if you've never raced before, doing an official CAT5 for an hour can be very humbling. At age 46, a couple years ago, I was feeling extra fit that season so I decided to enter my first CAT5 race at the Pikes Peak International Raceway, rode my fastest/best 20 miles ever, and still came in dead last, behind riders 15-20 yrs older than I. Sometimes you're the hammer, and sometimes the nail.

Last edited by Riveting; 12-16-20 at 10:27 AM.
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Old 12-16-20, 10:48 AM
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Originally Posted by texaspandj View Post
So if you want to play any sport/game with me whether it be basketball, golf, dodgeball, tennis, etc... my mindset is I'm gonna beat you or at the very least do the best I can to beat you.
You hit on the crux of the issue. People actually playing a sport/game with you.

Not you walking on to a random basketball court, sinking a shot, and saying you just won. Not you walking on to a tennis court, hitting a serve, and claiming you got a point. Not picking up a stray dodgeball and chucking it at a kid at recess who's looking the other way.

The OP's post wasn't about any of that. It was about chasing down random strangers who are simply out for a ride and then pretending that doing so is being competitive.
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