Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > General Cycling Discussion
Reload this Page >

Burned by my local bike shop on subtle problem with bike

Notices
General Cycling Discussion Have a cycling related question or comment that doesn't fit in one of the other specialty forums? Drop on in and post in here! When possible, please select the forum above that most fits your post!

Burned by my local bike shop on subtle problem with bike

Old 11-30-19, 12:15 AM
  #1  
wafranklin
Junior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Posts: 17
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 26 Post(s)
Liked 5 Times in 4 Posts
Burned by my local bike shop on subtle problem with bike

I am interested in buying a rather expensive new bike,

but I got burned pretty bad on a recent new bike purchase.


The purchase was a 2019 Giant Propel Advanced Disc for about $4000 from

the most popular local bike shop in my area.


The bike "pulled" to the right a little.

It wasn't noticeable unless riding with no hands.

When riding with no hands I had to keep my weight shifted to the left on the saddle, a little bit.

I don't know how to quantify the extent of the "pulling to the right", but it was

very noticeable while on the bike.


I had the rear wheel dish checked and it was fine.

I checked the frame alignment by running a thread from one rear drop-out,

around the front of the head tube and back to the other drop-out,

then measuring the distance from the thread to the seat tube and it was exactly equal on both sides.

Summary: there was some kind of problem but I couldn't figure it out.


The mechanic at the shop I where I bought it rode it around their little strip mall and said he

couldn't see any problem.

The shop owner rode it around their strip mall and said he couldn't see any problem either.


The mechanic and owner would have been able to detect the problem if they took the bike

for a longer ride on a straight road.

We are in Florida, there are plenty of straight roads near his shop.

I traded the bike in and my new bike rides fine so I know the problem is not with me.

I lost a lot of money on the trade.


I want to buy yet another bike but how do I protect myself if there is a subtle problem

with the new bike and the shop refuses to "see" the problem?
wafranklin is offline  
Old 11-30-19, 02:34 AM
  #2  
Machka 
In Real Life
 
Machka's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Down under down under
Posts: 52,152

Bikes: Lots

Mentioned: 141 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3203 Post(s)
Liked 595 Times in 329 Posts
Okay ... did you check the front brake?
Machka is offline  
Old 11-30-19, 03:41 AM
  #3  
JoeTBM 
Droid on a mission
 
JoeTBM's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Palm Coast, FL
Posts: 1,002

Bikes: Diamondback Wildwood Classic

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 315 Post(s)
Liked 276 Times in 191 Posts
Where is Florida are you? name of the Shop?
__________________
JoeTBM (The Bike Man) - I'm a black & white type of guy, the only gray in my life is the hair on my head
www.TheBikeMenOfFlaglerCounty.com




JoeTBM is offline  
Old 11-30-19, 04:05 AM
  #4  
wafranklin
Junior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Posts: 17
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 26 Post(s)
Liked 5 Times in 4 Posts
Originally Posted by Machka
Okay ... did you check the front brake?
Are you asking me if the front brake pads were dragging? No, they were not.
wafranklin is offline  
Old 11-30-19, 04:42 AM
  #5  
Machka 
In Real Life
 
Machka's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Down under down under
Posts: 52,152

Bikes: Lots

Mentioned: 141 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3203 Post(s)
Liked 595 Times in 329 Posts
Originally Posted by wafranklin
Are you asking me if the front brake pads were dragging? No, they were not.
I'm asking if one front brake pad was touching at times.

Could be the brakes. Could be that the front wheel wasn't quite true.
Machka is offline  
Old 11-30-19, 06:41 AM
  #6  
Gconan
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Posts: 658

Bikes: Norco search xr

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 197 Post(s)
Liked 146 Times in 90 Posts
Can you test ride next time? Extended test ride if possible.
Gconan is offline  
Old 11-30-19, 07:18 AM
  #7  
shelbyfv
Expired Member
 
shelbyfv's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: TN
Posts: 11,453
Mentioned: 37 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3634 Post(s)
Liked 5,310 Times in 2,698 Posts
Originally Posted by wafranklin
but I got burned pretty bad on a recent new bike purchase.
It's not clear how the shop mistreated you but I would suggest you relate this story to the new shop, let them know exactly what you expect from them. Let them decide if they want your business. If they accept you as a customer you'll probably agree on an appropriate distance for a test ride before the sale is final.
shelbyfv is offline  
Likes For shelbyfv:
Old 11-30-19, 07:20 AM
  #8  
JohnDThompson 
Old fart
 
JohnDThompson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Appleton WI
Posts: 24,934

Bikes: Several, mostly not name brands.

Mentioned: 153 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3571 Post(s)
Liked 3,366 Times in 1,915 Posts
You say you checked the frame alignment with the "string test," but did you check the fork alignment? That's a bit trickier without a tool like the Park FT-4:

JohnDThompson is offline  
Likes For JohnDThompson:
Old 11-30-19, 07:26 AM
  #9  
bcpriess
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 289

Bikes: Masi Giramondo, Trek 830 monstercross build, Raleigh Gran Sport, Lemond Tourmalet

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 121 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 19 Times in 12 Posts
Originally Posted by wafranklin
I am interested in buying a rather expensive new bike,

but I got burned pretty bad on a recent new bike purchase.


The purchase was a 2019 Giant Propel Advanced Disc for about $4000 from

the most popular local bike shop in my area.


The bike "pulled" to the right a little.

It wasn't noticeable unless riding with no hands.

When riding with no hands I had to keep my weight shifted to the left on the saddle, a little bit.

I don't know how to quantify the extent of the "pulling to the right", but it was

very noticeable while on the bike.


I had the rear wheel dish checked and it was fine.

I checked the frame alignment by running a thread from one rear drop-out,

around the front of the head tube and back to the other drop-out,

then measuring the distance from the thread to the seat tube and it was exactly equal on both sides.

Summary: there was some kind of problem but I couldn't figure it out.


The mechanic at the shop I where I bought it rode it around their little strip mall and said he

couldn't see any problem.

The shop owner rode it around their strip mall and said he couldn't see any problem either.


The mechanic and owner would have been able to detect the problem if they took the bike

for a longer ride on a straight road.

We are in Florida, there are plenty of straight roads near his shop.

I traded the bike in and my new bike rides fine so I know the problem is not with me.

I lost a lot of money on the trade.


I want to buy yet another bike but how do I protect myself if there is a subtle problem

with the new bike and the shop refuses to "see" the problem?
That could easily be a very minor saddle adjustment/fit problem. If it truly is a subtle problem, you may have difficulty getting someone else to see it. Your rear wheel could be in the dropout slightly unevenly. Or any number of barely perceptible things.
bcpriess is offline  
Old 11-30-19, 07:47 AM
  #10  
Sy Reene
Advocatus Diaboli
 
Sy Reene's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Wherever I am
Posts: 8,611

Bikes: Merlin Cyrene, Nashbar steel CX

Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4717 Post(s)
Liked 1,526 Times in 997 Posts
Roads generally do slope downward to the right.. helps with water run-off.
Sy Reene is offline  
Likes For Sy Reene:
Old 11-30-19, 07:53 AM
  #11  
thumpism 
Bikes are okay, I guess.
 
thumpism's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Richmond, Virginia
Posts: 9,128

Bikes: Waterford Paramount Touring, Giant CFM-2, Raleigh Sports 3-speeds in M23 & L23, Schwinn Cimarron oddball build, Marin Palisades Trail dropbar conversion, Nishiki Cresta GT

Mentioned: 69 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2647 Post(s)
Liked 2,445 Times in 1,557 Posts
I'd suspect the fork. Every assembly we did included a test ride with hands off on an absolutely flat stretch. Probably one in ten bikes had a pull to one side or the other that was attributable to the fork being out somehow.
thumpism is offline  
Old 11-30-19, 07:57 AM
  #12  
indyfabz
Senior Member
 
indyfabz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 39,045
Mentioned: 210 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 18318 Post(s)
Liked 15,261 Times in 7,219 Posts
Maybe something about the bike's particular geometry and your anatomy?
indyfabz is offline  
Old 11-30-19, 08:46 AM
  #13  
MattTheHat 
Senior Member
 
MattTheHat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: Allen, TX
Posts: 2,624

Bikes: 2021 S-Works Turbo Creo SL, 2020 Specialized Roubaix Expert

Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 762 Post(s)
Liked 3,982 Times in 1,415 Posts
The OP isn’t asking for troubleshooting help...the bike has already been traded. The question is how to protect oneself on a future purchase. If the LBS didn’t help make the previous purchase right, I would go to another bike store in the future. One post suggested an extended test ride, which seems like a good idea.

The only other way to protect yourself would be to purchase with a credit card. If there’s a problem with the bike that the store will not correct, your purchase can be disputed with the credit card company. I’d view that as a last resort though, because if a problem is barely perceptible, and the bike store can’t duplicate the problem, they are not going to be pleased when you dispute the purchase. It’s a burned bridge type situation.
MattTheHat is offline  
Likes For MattTheHat:
Old 11-30-19, 08:48 AM
  #14  
FiftySix
I'm the anecdote.
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: S.E. Texas
Posts: 1,823

Bikes: '12 Schwinn, '13 Norco

Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1110 Post(s)
Liked 1,176 Times in 795 Posts
Originally Posted by Sy Reene
Roads generally do slope downward to the right.. helps with water run-off.
Yep. While riding hands free, the slope of the road generally makes my bikes track down to the road's edge, unless I make a correction with my body. Whether on the left or the right side of the crown of a road.
FiftySix is offline  
Old 11-30-19, 11:52 AM
  #15  
Rajflyboy
Banned.
 
Rajflyboy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Carolinas
Posts: 1,293

Bikes: Orbea

Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 917 Post(s)
Liked 205 Times in 170 Posts
Must have been a Trek labeled as a Giant
Rajflyboy is offline  
Old 11-30-19, 12:05 PM
  #16  
Leebo
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: North of Boston
Posts: 5,721

Bikes: Kona Dawg, Surly 1x1, Karate Monkey, Rockhopper, Crosscheck , Burley Runabout,

Mentioned: 10 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 854 Post(s)
Liked 111 Times in 66 Posts
Front wheel drop out, alignment, wheel true? Tire seated correctly, headset, axle seated correctly? Seems pretty minor, some bike I can ride no hands, others not. 1/2 out of 9.
Leebo is offline  
Likes For Leebo:
Old 11-30-19, 12:18 PM
  #17  
bcpriess
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 289

Bikes: Masi Giramondo, Trek 830 monstercross build, Raleigh Gran Sport, Lemond Tourmalet

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 121 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 19 Times in 12 Posts
Originally Posted by MattTheHat
The OP isn’t asking for troubleshooting help...the bike has already been traded. The question is how to protect oneself on a future purchase. If the LBS didn’t help make the previous purchase right, I would go to another bike store in the future. One post suggested an extended test ride, which seems like a good idea.

The only other way to protect yourself would be to purchase with a credit card. If there’s a problem with the bike that the store will not correct, your purchase can be disputed with the credit card company. I’d view that as a last resort though, because if a problem is barely perceptible, and the bike store can’t duplicate the problem, they are not going to be pleased when you dispute the purchase. It’s a burned bridge type situation.
It's also possible that the op has unreasonable expectations. For all we know their definition of a major issue tracking to the right would be imperceptible to many of us. Could be a real problem or some princess/pea fussiness.
bcpriess is offline  
Likes For bcpriess:
Old 11-30-19, 12:20 PM
  #18  
phughes
Senior Member
 
phughes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 3,055
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1018 Post(s)
Liked 1,244 Times in 717 Posts
My advice would be in the future, to ride the bike longer before making the mistake of trading the bike off and losing money. I honestly think there was nothing really wrong with the bike, other than possibly a minor fit adjustment being needed, to nothing at all and the geometry of the bike was more susceptible to the way the road is crowned.
phughes is offline  
Old 11-30-19, 12:32 PM
  #19  
dim
Senior Member
 
dim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Cambridge UK
Posts: 1,703

Bikes: Trek Emonda SL6 .... Miyata One Thousand

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 63 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 29 Times in 22 Posts
your left arse cheek is bigger and heavier than the right
dim is offline  
Old 11-30-19, 12:52 PM
  #20  
Cyclist0108
Occam's Rotor
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 7,248
Mentioned: 61 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2366 Post(s)
Liked 2,331 Times in 1,164 Posts
There's a fork for that:

Cyclist0108 is offline  
Old 11-30-19, 01:18 PM
  #21  
wolfchild
Banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Mississauga/Toronto, Ontario canada
Posts: 8,721

Bikes: I have 3 singlespeed/fixed gear bikes

Mentioned: 30 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4227 Post(s)
Liked 2,488 Times in 1,286 Posts
Pulling to the right was probably the result of road surface or maybe wind direction. LBS tested it and found nothing wrong. I doubt that a $ 4000 bike made by reputable brand purchased from a reputable LBS would be defective....and if the bike was really defective it should of been replaced for free.
wolfchild is offline  
Likes For wolfchild:
Old 11-30-19, 01:56 PM
  #22  
tkamd73 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Menomonee Falls, WI
Posts: 1,850

Bikes: 1984 Schwinn Supersport, 1988 Trek 400T, 1977 Trek TX900, 1982 Bianchi Champione del Mondo, 1978 Raleigh Supercourse, 1986 Trek 400 Elance, 1991 Waterford PDG OS Paramount, 1971 Schwinn Sports Tourer, 1985 Trek 670

Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 601 Post(s)
Liked 1,054 Times in 530 Posts
I never know which way any of my bikes are gonna pull, when I use no hands, but solving that problem was pretty simple.
Tim
tkamd73 is offline  
Likes For tkamd73:
Old 11-30-19, 03:47 PM
  #23  
Alloyboy
Senior Member
 
Alloyboy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: Guelph.Canada. 43.54N 80.25W
Posts: 50

Bikes: Empire 3 speed. Resolution Get away mtb. 10 speed.Sekine. No rco. Mountaineer SL.

Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Liked 4 Times in 4 Posts
$4000 Giant not behaving. We are all familar with how many old names Giant now represents with bikes being made overseas. The fine tuning is always ( or should be ) done by the LBS. I whole heartedly agree with post #8 from John D Thompson regarding the front end of the bike. Just some other information for the family here. I have not even come close to $4000 and I have been riding since my second hand 10th birthday present in June 1941. Big deal I can hear from the gallery........do ya wanna medal.....sorry we are all out of medals. .giggle Jim.
Alloyboy is offline  
Old 11-30-19, 03:51 PM
  #24  
63rickert
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 2,068
Mentioned: 44 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1090 Post(s)
Liked 329 Times in 245 Posts
Going to disagree with most here. Yes, the entire issue could be as simple as crown of the road. OTOH the OP presumably has other bikes or remembers other bikes that don't pull.

Most bikes are not perfect out of the box. Most bikes will not do what they should do until a lot of tuning has been done. This one it does sound like an alignment problem. String test is very crude, won't catch much. The store should have done a thorough alignment check and should have walked their customer through the process, making sure he knew what they were doing and what they were looking for.

Giant frames are not particularly accurate. Yes, frames on $4000 bikes can be off. Most will never notice. Most have very low standards. Not a lot of impetus for manufacturers to correct problems that few will ever perceive. Off the top of my head Look and Time have reputations for making accurate frames. There must be others. Giant, Trek, Specialized, Cannondale do not make accurate frames. If customer is very picky custom is a live option. For $4000 it is possible to do a custom and a basic build.

Buy a new bike from the oldest family-owned store possible. Best is an owner who has built frames. No, that is not always possible. Yes, it can be done. My LBS is owned by a man who has built a few hundred steel frames and was part of the team that designed and built the original Kestrel, the first monocoque carbon frame. He has very little business. Consumers want to buy from the big factory owned Trek store. Buy a carbon frame from Ron, you get hours of his time. From a guy who has literally forty years experience with carbon. The other two LBS that get some of my business the owners have also built a few steel frames and know what alignment means.

The bike business in general has extremely low standards. Anyone who has high standards is pushing uphill. You can still get to top of the ill but it won't be easy.
63rickert is offline  
Likes For 63rickert:
Old 11-30-19, 03:59 PM
  #25  
anon06
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 109

Bikes: Giant Cypress

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 20 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 10 Times in 6 Posts
Originally Posted by MattTheHat
The OP isn’t asking for troubleshooting help...the bike has already been traded...
Sure. Well, I didn't mind hearing others' ideas about what might've possibly been wrong with the bike or if it was something else; the information could be helpful to someone else in the future, who might also have a similar problem.
anon06 is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.