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Do you find this performance level believable?

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Do you find this performance level believable?

Old 12-27-18, 03:41 PM
  #1  
BengalCat
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Do you find this performance level believable?

I wasn't quite sure where to post this so I put it here in this forum:

​​​​​​

The rider claims to be 76 years old and a long time avid cyclist. He can do a category 4 climb of 5.08 miles in 22 minutes averaging a HR of 178 with an average power up the climb of 232 watts with a max power output of 414 watts.

On the descent of the same hill, he is faster than not only everyone in his Strava age group (over 75) but is also faster than anyone from the next two lower age categories, (65-69 and 70-74.) He also hits on the descent a max heart rate of 165 and average power of 187 watts with a max of 804.

All of the above he does after he has already ridden 50 miles on semi-flat terrain.

On the above ride and other rides of his that I've checked he routinely hits a max HR of 195 to 204 on different segments or parts of his long rides.

I don't find the above credible for a 76-year-old rider. What do you think?
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Old 12-27-18, 03:59 PM
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I am assuming his the KOM for the strava segment.

I am just going to say it and I am not trying to offend you but my thought is who cares...… believable I have no idea I guess could be many things could in play like he has an ebike or electric assist or he is just an amazing athlete.

I have been blown away on a group ride of guys who were MUCH older than me and I was embarrassed but then again I have had a good ride day (very few) where guys younger than me were struggling at my pace.

Point is I guess, don't let it bother you if it does and ride on brother!
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Old 12-27-18, 04:33 PM
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I'm not so sure about Strava anymore with all the motor assist out there. I've seen guys pass me on big fat electric bikes then noticed in the strava fly by section, he recorded his ride on strava. On a roadie I'm averaging 18 and he's averaging 20 blowing me away but we know the truth.
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Old 12-27-18, 04:37 PM
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Pretty amazing heart rate. I am 67 and have a hard time hitting 155.
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Old 12-27-18, 04:44 PM
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Who cares. When i tour or commute i am sure no one would be impressed with my times. I do like the view however.
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Old 12-27-18, 05:32 PM
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Its Strava. No one cares. Put down the app, and go for a ride. Get home and delete the app and smile as you feel renewed by the release of the shackles of social media. Just maintain a presence on BikeForums! The only social media one needs.
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Old 12-27-18, 05:57 PM
  #7  
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Originally Posted by BengalCat
I wasn't quite sure where to post this so I put it here in this forum:

​​​​​​

The rider claims to be 76 years old and a long time avid cyclist. He can do a category 4 climb of 5.08 miles in 22 minutes averaging a HR of 178 with an average power up the climb of 232 watts with a max power output of 414 watts.

On the descent of the same hill, he is faster than not only everyone in his Strava age group (over 75) but is also faster than anyone from the next two lower age categories, (65-69 and 70-74.) He also hits on the descent a max heart rate of 165 and average power of 187 watts with a max of 804.

All of the above he does after he has already ridden 50 miles on semi-flat terrain.

On the above ride and other rides of his that I've checked he routinely hits a max HR of 195 to 204 on different segments or parts of his long rides.

I don't find the above credible for a 76-year-old rider. What do you think?
Heck, he must simply dial it up to 400W.
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Old 12-27-18, 06:28 PM
  #8  
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He's telling the truth, that dude is a stud especially for his age. Have you seen his legs?
Respect!
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Old 12-27-18, 06:31 PM
  #9  
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Certainly unusual. But sure. Ignore the HR part.
Many of our USA cycling stars are aging and keep riding.
They put out big power in their 60s and 70s. I ride with a guy that age who can do that power without any doubt. I know 60 year olds that can dump most Cat 2s and a few Cat 1s.
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Old 12-27-18, 10:20 PM
  #10  
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Originally Posted by Doge
Certainly unusual. But sure. Ignore the HR part.
Many of our USA cycling stars are aging and keep riding.
They put out big power in their 60s and 70s. I ride with a guy that age who can do that power without any doubt. I know 60 year olds that can dump most Cat 2s and a few Cat 1s.
You know 76-year-old guys that ride 50 miles then attack a Cat 4 5.08 climb averaging over 200 watts and hitting a peak of over 400 watts at the steep end, (11 percent grade), while averaging 178 BPM HR and then turn around and descend at a rate faster than anyone 15 years younger? (Max HR 204.)
By the way where he is allegedly doing this is in ONE of the densest areas with competitive recreational and practicing pro-bicycling riders. And and not one guy in their sixties and seventies categories, not one person is close to him. Not a single one.

Can I believe you?
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Old 12-27-18, 10:58 PM
  #11  
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There are far too many figures in this thread. Whatever happened to just going for a ride and feeding the ducks and horses?
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Old 12-27-18, 11:44 PM
  #12  
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Originally Posted by BengalCat
You know 76-year-old guys that ride 50 miles then attack a Cat 4 5.08 climb averaging over 200 watts and hitting a peak of over 400 watts at the steep end, (11 percent grade), while averaging 178 BPM HR and then turn around and descend at a rate faster than anyone 15 years younger? (Max HR 204.)
By the way where he is allegedly doing this is in ONE of the densest areas with competitive recreational and practicing pro-bicycling riders. And and not one guy in their sixties and seventies categories, not one person is close to him. Not a single one.

Can I believe you?
I can't speak to the HR, other than it swings a lot from that 220-age number.
The grade also does not matter. The watts/time is what I was saying folks of older ages can do. Is that 5min? Shoot - I was thinking 30 min.
But to be clear I need to know the power being held for time.

I don't know of exactly 76 year old cyclists. John Watkins in 80 something, rides in SoCal and can hang some group rides. He can power along at 23-25mph on his own at his 6'3 frame. I expect that is well over 200W for 20 min or so me just following him. John Howard isn't riding so much and not that old, but in his 70s. He can hold that.

Then the "youth" in their 60s Wayne Stetina 65, never-mind. Kid's coach @ 65 can hold big numbers. Glen Winkel @ 63 is doing well in Cat 2 races.
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Old 12-28-18, 12:11 AM
  #13  
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Originally Posted by Doge
I can't speak to the HR, other than it swings a lot from that 220-age number.
The grade also does not matter. The watts/time is what I was saying folks of older ages can do. Is that 5min? Shoot - I was thinking 30 min.
But to be clear I need to know the power being held for time.
HR is most relevant in this case. He is doing a little over 200 watts for almost 22 minutes of a category 4 that ends with a 11 percent grade. (If you think grade doesn't matter I don't what to say to you except try holding your sustainable power for 22 minutes with one case it being on the flats and on the other case it is climbing that cat 4. You don't think there is a difference in power sustainability dependent upon grade and time? (Especially at 76.)

By the way the best time up that 5.08 climb is 14 minutes averaging or holding or averaging most of the way about 440 watts with a maximum peak of about 1100 watts. That's a pro. A real one, (literal not figurative.)
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Old 12-28-18, 01:10 AM
  #14  
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Don't know, don't care bout Strava. If you want to compete with others, go enter a race where such things are monitored.

Cynicism aside, I wouldn't really put too much difference between a 65 and a 76 year old recording rides on Strava. Obviously the average 65 year old is going to be fitter than the average 76 year old, but the sample size is generally too small in such things to take any meaningful comparison from it.
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Old 12-28-18, 02:05 AM
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Originally Posted by BengalCat
HR is most relevant in this case. He is doing a little over 200 watts for almost 22 minutes of a category 4 that ends with a 11 percent grade. (If you think grade doesn't matter I don't what to say to you except try holding your sustainable power for 22 minutes with one case it being on the flats and on the other case it is climbing that cat 4. You don't think there is a difference in power sustainability dependent upon grade and time? (Especially at 76.)

By the way the best time up that 5.08 climb is 14 minutes averaging or holding or averaging most of the way about 440 watts with a maximum peak of about 1100 watts. That's a pro. A real one, (literal not figurative.)
Are you suggesting this old guy is modifying his Strava file to show an abnormally high HR? That sounds a little absurd. Why would anyone want to inflate their HR.
I ride with two 70+ guys who can climb for 15-20min with a VAM of around 1000. One of them was doing over 280W for 17min. He’s not a lightweight but old guys can still be strong if they ride regularly. 230W doesn’t seem unreasonable for a 70+ KOM
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Old 12-28-18, 04:28 AM
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He is riding an ebike... duh!
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Old 12-28-18, 04:46 AM
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Originally Posted by BengalCat
I wasn't quite sure where to post this so I put it here in this forum:

​​​​​​

The rider claims to be 76 years old and a long time avid cyclist. He can do a category 4 climb of 5.08 miles in 22 minutes averaging a HR of 178 with an average power up the climb of 232 watts with a max power output of 414 watts.

On the descent of the same hill, he is faster than not only everyone in his Strava age group (over 75) but is also faster than anyone from the next two lower age categories, (65-69 and 70-74.) He also hits on the descent a max heart rate of 165 and average power of 187 watts with a max of 804.

All of the above he does after he has already ridden 50 miles on semi-flat terrain.

On the above ride and other rides of his that I've checked he routinely hits a max HR of 195 to 204 on different segments or parts of his long rides.

I don't find the above credible for a 76-year-old rider. What do you think?
Why does it bother you? And why are you stalking him?
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Old 12-28-18, 06:06 AM
  #18  
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Marginal gains? Have you contacted WADA?

​​​​​​
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Old 12-28-18, 06:23 AM
  #19  
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How old is the OP? People age at different rates, and some people take better care of them selves.
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Old 12-28-18, 08:05 AM
  #20  
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Originally Posted by BengalCat
HR is most relevant in this case. He is doing a little over 200 watts for almost 22 minutes of a category 4 that ends with a 11 percent grade. (If you think grade doesn't matter I don't what to say to you except try holding your sustainable power for 22 minutes with one case it being on the flats and on the other case it is climbing that cat 4. You don't think there is a difference in power sustainability dependent upon grade and time? (Especially at 76.)

By the way the best time up that 5.08 climb is 14 minutes averaging or holding or averaging most of the way about 440 watts with a maximum peak of about 1100 watts. That's a pro. A real one, (literal not figurative.)
Not that I really care whether this guy is for real or not, but you are being hyperbolic about the climb.

It's a 5.8 miles cat 4 with an 11% grade at the end? That's 9300 meters in distance, and Strava categorizes cat 4 as being distance X grade = 8000-16000. The highest average grade for that distance is therefore 1.7%. If part of that distance is 11%, doesn't sound like it could be much of a climb until the end.
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Old 12-28-18, 08:12 AM
  #21  
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Originally Posted by Aubergine
Pretty amazing heart rate. I am 67 and have a hard time hitting 155.
Yep, I am only 62 and hitting (and sustaining) 160 is tough to do.

Of course, there was the time when my Garmin was showing HR readings of 175-180 on a local climb.

As soon as I got home I changed the battery in my HRM strap.

Problem solved.
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Old 12-28-18, 08:24 AM
  #22  
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Originally Posted by BengalCat
HR is most relevant in this case. He is doing a little over 200 watts for almost 22 minutes of a category 4 that ends with a 11 percent grade. (If you think grade doesn't matter I don't what to say to you except try holding your sustainable power for 22 minutes with one case it being on the flats and on the other case it is climbing that cat 4. You don't think there is a difference in power sustainability dependent upon grade and time? (Especially at 76.)

By the way the best time up that 5.08 climb is 14 minutes averaging or holding or averaging most of the way about 440 watts with a maximum peak of about 1100 watts. That's a pro. A real one, (literal not figurative.)
If it is the HR that is most relevant, then stick with that and don't mix in the power or grade. My comment on HR is I have seen it vary a lot.
Power is not based on grade. Its average is affected by time of the even and time, as in age of course.
It is true normally (track riders may disagree) riders get their best power numbers on a grade, but there are many reasons for that.
Having seen a lot of my kid's, wife's, others power numbers over the year, most the max ave power I see come on the 3%-7% grade range. Max from a sprint on a lessor grade.
Pros differentiate themselves on how long they hold high power, over how many days. Their max power may not be higher than the fit amateurs range. And a less fit amateur may put out more power in the <5 min range.

As to 20min @ 200W, I already stated it.
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Old 12-28-18, 08:26 AM
  #23  
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Originally Posted by MikeyMK
There are far too many figures in this thread. Whatever happened to just going for a ride and feeding the ducks and horses?

Somebody made an app that counted calories provided per duck and horse.
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Old 12-28-18, 09:41 AM
  #24  
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"Just Ride";
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Old 12-28-18, 09:42 AM
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Originally Posted by BengalCat
...200 watts for almost 22 minutes...
A big Strava segment and and the right membership will show this. Filter on age 75+
The 3rd fastest 75+ year old did over 218W (real power meter) for over 20 min. The fastest time was considerably faster (virtual?), and I suspect that. Weight of course plays a huge part in power.

People fabricate numbers on Strava all the time, but I don't suspect it so much for a 3rd place in the 75+ group some 1,000+ place overall (I didn't look). I think that is the real data you are looking for.
I used https://www.strava.com/segments/3635577

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