Tourist in MSN

Agree, 12 pounds is less than six liters of water and I usually start out with three liters of water on my bike in the morning when touring.

I have seen too many cyclists that come into campgrounds dehydrated and ask where the water is because they ran out of water hours earlier. Or others that ask if anyone brought a first aid kit that they can borrow, or, ... ...

But I know that some can do it with reasonable safety, a couple of neighbors did the Appalachian Trail several years ago, I asked her what her pack weighed at the end, without food or water it was 12 pounds and her husbands pack was 15 pounds. Her pack was not much heavier than my gym bag.

Fullcount

Please understand - 12 pounds is lightweight camping gear (tarp, sleeping bag, hammock, personal gear, etc)...I would still need to add bike specific stuff like repair kits, tubes, riding cloths, etc. My point is, if done properly (and manage bulk - as quilts & tarps take up room), maybe I can get down to two panniers instead of four. Or in the case of a trailer, have everything loaded on this mode of transport and not have any extra weight on the bike. Objective is lite bike, lite trailer. The lighter, the less stress on spokes and tires - the less rolling resistance on all three wheels.

I still think the low profile to the ground of a trailer and the aerodynamic advantage trumps big bags on the side of your bike, not to mention if you are riding with a handlebar bag. We will see - I am testing both methods and monitoring heart rate to evaluate physical input to the ride.

TiHabanero

I had a BOB trailer for several years and used it quite a bit. Hauled some heavy loads with it. I will say it tracked nicely behind the bike, did not seem to overly affect high speed cornering all that badly, and allowed me to carry more than I should have.

Much prefer panniers. One less tube to carry, and moving the bike around is super easy compared to having to park it and a trailer, or move it through a door. Just easier to tour without out the trailer. Touring with 2 panniers is now my goal. Some call it minimalist touring, I call it going back to the seventies when I started touring and only bringing the essentials. Two panniers and a handlebar bag are the goal. KISS.

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Okay,

I did some testing and wanted to run a course with a set load. On Nov. 11th, I ran a 41 mile course that traveled on the Virginia Capital Trail. 20.5 miles out and 20.5 miles back. On this first trip, I rode with my Maya Cycle Trailer hooked to my Domane. Yesterday, December 6th, I took that same load and traveled the same course, but this time with my Trek 520 and four panniers. Here in eastern VA, there are very few hills, but I measured the affect of going over the Chickahominy Bridge on the outbound and return trips. There is also one hill on the return from Charles City that is about 3.5% grade. I used Strava's information to document the results of the test

I used heart rate as my measurement point. I also went and pulled the weather data from those dates and highlighted if for your observation. Weather data revealed that I was riding into the wind on the trailer test and had it at my back on the return trip. On the second trip with panniers, the wind was a cross wind and did not affect the ride other than a couple of gusts caught my panniers in a cross wind push.

Overall impression is that from a perceived fatigue aspect, the panniers were harder than the trailer as referenced on the Relative Effort Score. However, even though riding up the hills was slower on the Panniers - I felt I could continue at that spinning pace for a longer period of time. The Trek 520 has a low granny gear of 16 gear inches, but I never really got that low - maybe in the 23 gear in range as I never had to go that low. Another factor, the heavier bike did absorb road vibration better and I did not suffer the same hand pain that has plagued me for the past 2 years in my right hand. The 520 actually performs better with a load on it, than riding it without weight on a Rando Ride..

Final thoughts - both systems can work. Both systems have advantages. The trailer system is so much easier to load up and get going, whereas, loading panniers is a challenge trying to balance your bike. I suspect the latter becomes easier with more practice.

Had to make a choice: The Trek 520 with panniers. Testing revealed some new information. Would I discount the trailer? Absolutely not. Weight is still weight and the Domane with trailer was still an easier ride, notwithstanding the hand vibration transfer. Thanks all.

djb

neat, and wow. I follow motorsport a lot and feel I am looking at all the data from a racing team!
Kinda fun looking at the info and more importantly, how things felt to you for the two.

a few thoughts
-the first time you have to go into a doorway, or through a gate, or pick you bike up over something, or take a plane (I know, not the case) you'll curse the trailer
-certainly dont discount the "rider comfort" aspect of stuff, but hey, thats up to you, your age, how you feel etc etc etc
-dont forget, tire choice and tire pressures will make a real diff in rider comfort. Often just a small amount like 5 or 10 psi can make the ride so much more ccomfortable, and while its common to think "harsh=faster" this is really not the case. Ive done lots of riding playing with pressures on various tires on various bikes, and a bit less psi that means a lot nicer ride on your hands and everything, is not slower. Common misconception though, the old "not harsh and buzzy, so not as fast" thing.

was fun that you actually can compare data, although to an extent, weather and how our body feels one day to another will always be a certain factor. I'd say body diff from day to day, energy etc, will play a big part always.

again, have fun whatever setup you use.

Tourist in MSN

If your hand starts to bother you, drop your front tire pressure a bit, with your wider tires on the 520 that should not cause a pinch flat as long as you are reasonable about pressure.

I did a week long van supported trip in West Texas with ACA. Very rough chip seal pavement. I had 40mm wide tires, first day ran about 55 to 60 psi in front and 75 to 80 psi in back, really rough on my hands and on my handlebar mounted electronics. Day two, dropped front tire pressure to between 40 and 45, kept the back where it was. Did not appear to slow me down any, but it was much easier on my hands.

I think you will be happy with the choice of the 520. Touring is not a race, take it slow so that a 6 or 7 hour long day becomes enjoyable.

I have some cushioning under my bar tape on the tops of the bars, sort of a stiff closed cell foam. Not sure how much it helps, but if you keep having hand problems, try that or maybe double wrapping tape on the bars or the part of the bars where you have your hands.

djb

yup, that gel cushion stuff plus good bar tape makes quite a diff, throw in some good gloves with good gel pads and it all adds up

heck, lets get direct, what pressures are you using on your Domane 25mm?
how much do you weigh?
could you fit 28mm tires on it?
I run my 28s at around 90 rear 80 front, less sometimes even a bit , but I weigh 140 tops
but depends on road surfaces

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On this test ride, there were several gates as the VCT is a segregated multi-use trail with bollards that prevent motorized traffic, some of them quite narrow. I actually rode through these gates with ease. The Maya trailer is a single wheel trailer and if truth be known, no wider that a full set of panniers, if not narrower. If you look closely at the test data, I rode stronger on the Domane with trailer, due to the lighter rig AND the aerodynamic Features of the trailer. Only reason I would choose the touring bike with panniers is IF I planned a trip with extended climbing, which is what I would end up doing if heading west of Tidewater, Va. Going south on a coastal route would be mainly flat riding and that would be more conducive to the trailer / Domane setup. I would be able to ride further and with less fatigue.

What everyone needs to understand, is that touring with a heavier bike and panniers with a low granny gear might be the right tool for hills, but a conditioned rider with a trailer and light bike might be the right tool for flats. Right tool for the right job.

PS. I am 215 pounds and spoke strength is always a concern on the rear wheel. Having a trailer with load evenly distributed on a third wheel, eliminates the stress on the rear wheel of a bike,with my type of rider load and the load of the panniers. Luckily, my 520 has a 36 spoke wheel count.

djb

Well I guess you have the luxery to choose, and to change your mind to change stuff or method if you find you aren't keen on whatever option you use first.

saddlesores

okay so far.

i'd also like to see a 3rd run done with the 520 and trailer, as well as one run each with unladen bikes.

after that, i want to see you do the same 5 runs to afton mountain and back.

Fullcount

If I was retired and not concerned with my job, I might accommodate the different tests. Thanks.